2018/2019 Offseason Thread

[fish16]

Nobody forced them to buy the team.

Nobody said they forced them to buy the team. Your problem is that you cant get it through your fucking head that the previous incarnation of this team was thoroughly mediocre and there was quite literally 0 realistic path to contention any time in the next 5 years as the team was currently constructed. That combined with the fact that you are beyond jaded due to previous ownership groups shows that no matter what path this ownership group took to contention you were gonna bitch and moan for attention as if you actually gave a shit about the previous players we traded away that led us to exactly 0 meaningful winning and had 0 chance of taking us to any meaningful winning because of what the previous ownership group did for the past decade before selling the team. You act like you really disagree with the direction when in reality you have proven time and time again to be nothing but a cynical troll looking for attention and its why you got kicked off the other site too.

Also, I love the fact that you continue to argue that i see nothing but rainbows and sunshine when i consistently have criticized the front office over the past year. Unlike you, however, I can compartmentalize differing views on individual moves with the obvious fact that the complete overhaul was 1000% the right thing to do and we are in a better position now than we have been in close to 20 years simply due to the fact that we have an ownership group that has a basic fundamental understanding of what sized market this team is and will stick to a plan for years rather than changing our franchise outlook based on the daily whims of an unmitigated moron in Loria. Unlike you, i have an ability to view this team from a non jaded perspective and realize that this team needed years to overhaul what Loria did to this franchise and rebuild in a way that actually makes sense for this market. So please do keep on acting like youre some voice of reason when all you are is a cynical troll on a fucking message board of a loser team who clearly needs more positive things going on in his life.

[rmc523]

He has said he prefers to be on the West Coast or a big city like Chicago or NY

Same problem we always have with Asian guys-none of them really wanna come to Florida

Didn't realize he had said that.

[fish16]

No they arent gonna do a NYM deal just saying the Mets are trying to use that as a way to get him. Mets are trying to drive talks with Miami

Ya the mets make 0 sense to do a deal with. They won't be involved in any JT deal. They are a team that needs to start doing what the marlins did and start running their team with a plan that is relative to the payroll capabilities of the ownership group. Idk how many years in a row they can continue to do this stupid shit of investing in big name and big contract guys in exchange for top prospects and continue to be surprised when they realize the team is mediocre as hell and their farm system sucks.

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He has said he prefers to be on the West Coast or a big city like Chicago or NY

Same problem we always have with Asian guys-none of them really wanna come to Florida

Ya those guys always want to be in a big market on the east coast or in Seattle, LA, San fran, etc.

[Maddawg]

Nobody said they forced them to buy the team. Your problem is that you cant get it through your fucking head that the previous incarnation of this team was thoroughly mediocre and there was quite literally 0 realistic path to contention any time in the next 5 years as the team was currently constructed. That combined with the fact that you are beyond jaded due to previous ownership groups shows that no matter what path this ownership group took to contention you were gonna bitch and moan for attention as if you actually gave a shit about the previous players we traded away that led us to exactly 0 meaningful winning and had 0 chance of taking us to any meaningful winning because of what the previous ownership group did for the past decade before selling the team. You act like you really disagree with the direction when in reality you have proven time and time again to be nothing but a cynical troll looking for attention and its why you got kicked off the other site too.

Also, I love the fact that you continue to argue that i see nothing but rainbows and sunshine when i consistently have criticized the front office over the past year. Unlike you, however, I can compartmentalize differing views on individual moves with the obvious fact that the complete overhaul was 1000% the right thing to do and we are in a better position now than we have been in close to 20 years simply due to the fact that we have an ownership group that has a basic fundamental understanding of what sized market this team is and will stick to a plan for years rather than changing our franchise outlook based on the daily whims of an unmitigated moron in Loria. Unlike you, i have an ability to view this team from a non jaded perspective and realize that this team needed years to overhaul what Loria did to this franchise and rebuild in a way that actually makes sense for this market. So please do keep on acting like youre some voice of reason when all you are is a cynical troll on a fucking message board of a loser team who clearly needs more positive things going on in his life.

You are so totally wrong about everything, because you are so closed minded. I don't know what you are talking about getting kicked off of a site, and if it's the Fish thing I had never heard of it until you mentioned it, and unless you can prove that it was me through ISP proof you'd best cease & desist or I will explore ways to in fact legally shut you up. You call me a troll but often it is YOU that trolls the board with your sunshine picture of the team. By the way I wasn't the 1st one to comment on that, I only was quoting someone else's post. Also I have NEVER disagreed with the direction of the team, I have REPEATEDLY said they are doing the right thing. I disagree with the PEOPLE that are doing the moves and don't understand keeping someone as horrible as Mike Hill. You want to rebuild FINE but don't keep one of the biggest problems the old regime had. After Loria, Hill was the biggest culprit. DO YOU NOT READ MY POSTS....this is my biggest problem and to me means that they are NOT building a contender.....as long as Hill is here they are a pretender to me.

[fish16]

You are so totally wrong about everything, because you are so closed minded. I don't know what you are talking about getting kicked off of a site, and if it's the Fish thing I had never heard of it until you mentioned it, and unless you can prove that it was me through ISP proof you'd best cease & desist or I will explore ways to in fact legally shut you up. You call me a troll but often it is YOU that trolls the board with your sunshine picture of the team. By the way I wasn't the 1st one to comment on that, I only was quoting someone else's post. Also I have NEVER disagreed with the direction of the team, I have REPEATEDLY said they are doing the right thing. I disagree with the PEOPLE that are doing the moves and don't understand keeping someone as horrible as Mike Hill. You want to rebuild FINE but don't keep one of the biggest problems the old regime had. After Loria, Hill was the biggest culprit. DO YOU NOT READ MY POSTS....this is my biggest problem and to me means that they are NOT building a contender.....as long as Hill is here they are a pretender to me.

Jesus dude get a fucking life. Really have nothing going on to the point where you'd take legal action. Holy shit that is one of the most pathetic things ive ever seen. You'd be lucky not to get laughed out of court. Didnt even bother reading the rest of the post good lord.

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And im not closed minded at all. I completely understand people who dont want hill here. but get the fuck out of here that you just think he is the issue and thats it because that is complete and utter bullshit. You've shown exactly what you are: a cynical troll who will find any way to criticize and provide your special brand of cynicism to any move, even the most minor of moves. Youre are plain and simple a cynical troll who likes to say that other people are being all rainbows and butterflies about the team when the reality of the situation is actually that you just like to complain and bring your personal baggage with years of ownership failures and thrust them onto the current brand new ownership who is the only owner in this franchises history who has identified the market correctly and is running the team with a plan and doesnt waver from that plan and the plan actually perfectly fits this market.

Also it is abundantly clear you have no idea the inner workings of the front office over Hill's tenure and have made no effort to educate yourself on the available information out there as to how decisions were made and how this team was run for the past decade.

[rmc523]

Didn't we have this discussion about you two putting each other on their ignore lists?

No wonder nobody posts here.

[lou]

Looks like they signed Pedro Alvarez to a minor league deal. Seemingly looks like the plan is to spend no money on 1B and churn out power-upside guys.

I'm fine with that. The minor league deal strategy looks much improved this year versus prior years.

[fauowls44]

Looks like they signed Pedro Alvarez to a minor league deal. Seemingly looks like the plan is to spend no money on 1B and churn out power-upside guys.

I'm fine with that. The minor league deal strategy looks much improved this year versus prior years.

I can't imagine Pedro Alvarez is anything more than AAA filler at this point of his career, even for this Marlins team. He certainly wasn't good enough to get significant playing time for the Orioles last year. Not to mention that they said they moved on from Bour to get more athletic...If anything, Alvarez is less athletic than Bour.

There will be plenty of 1B available this off season that they should be able to upgrade that position pretty easily and for very little money.

[fish16]

Pedro Alvarez is just a name at this point and wasnt all that good anyways but hopefully we continue to add a bunch of those low risk minor league deal/small major league deal free agents.

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Craig Mish

Verified account

@CraigMish
7m7 minutes ago
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Sources: #Marlins offered J.T. Realmuto two separate contract extensions. 4 yrs 43 mil back in July and then 5 yrs 61 mil, w option for 6th yr (76 mil total). Realmuto’s camp did counter with an offer and then pulled it off the table and never returned.

If thats right we kind of low balled JT.

[rmc523]

I can't imagine Pedro Alvarez is anything more than AAA filler at this point of his career, even for this Marlins team. He certainly wasn't good enough to get significant playing time for the Orioles last year. Not to mention that they said they moved on from Bour to get more athletic...If anything, Alvarez is less athletic than Bour.

There will be plenty of 1B available this off season that they should be able to upgrade that position pretty easily and for very little money.

Bour himself was non-tendered.

[fish16]

Bour himself was non-tendered.

Id be cool with bringing him back and then dealing him again if he has a solid first few months. Much better chance of getting something for him than Alvarez, but again these 1b/DH types have become so devalued and there are so many of them that none of them are truly all that valuable at all. There is a carousel of those 1b/DH/corner OF guys every year, you just gotta hope to scout well or get lucky that they wont have down years like a guy like Lomo did last year.

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On a side note, the phillies are absolutely doing their rebuild in a way that doesnt see the process out and will guarantee them several years of maybe wild card contention and nothing more. I get that their owner wants to make a splash and sign high priced free agents but they seem to be just doing so for the sake of spending money as opposed to some part of a long term plan and their farm system, despite all the rave reviews it seems to get, really doesnt impress me in the slightest. They seem to be going toward the path of their rebuild leading towards long term 80-90 wins rather than teams like the braves, cubs, astros, yankees, etc who are set up to be consistently in the 90+ win range. the phillies will be behind the braves in terms of long term outlook for the foreseeable future because they continue to grow impatient and try to make the big move rather than letting the rebuild progress gradually and successfully.

[lou]

If thats right we kind of low balled JT.

Those are pathetic offers if so. That is valuing JT free agency years at probably around $14 million, and the second offer around $15 million. They are basically giving him a $1+ million raise versus Salvador Perez. They are definitely using him as a comp here.

I would tell them to fuck off and I don't want to play here if that is what is coming down the pipes too. This is probably the 2nd most egregious thing I've heard about the new ownership group (with Yelich being traded with a 5 year contract the (likely forever) 1st). It's completely not understanding your asset or landscape. Unless of course, you just are not interested in signing a catcher longterm unless it's super-club friendly.

JT had eclipsed Perez at the time of the offer by being the best catcher in baseball (over a 3 year period to boot). The summer 2018 offer should have been 5/$70, and since JT kept it up all year, moving arbitration a bit higher, and annual value a bit higher, he's 5/$80+ now, with probably $85 the max. Past that it becomes untenable for any smart franchise in baseball.

That's really awful if true.

[fish16]

i think the first offer is a really bad look, the second offer still obviously easily rejected by JT but that is more defensible to offer him IMO. I think they are essentially saying we think your value is higher to us in the trade market context given that he only has 2 years of team control left UNLESS he were to take a super discount to stay here. Id hope for their sake that it was due to what they know they can get in the trade market as opposed to just low balling a player in an initial offer.

With that said, at least we came in low rather than us clamoring to overpay for guys once their team control period ends. JT aint the right guy to do it with though. The right move for both sides is to move on because the timelines dont match up.

[Lee Stone]

Those are pathetic offers if so. That is valuing JT free agency years at probably around $14 million, and the second offer around $15 million. They are basically giving him a $1+ million raise versus Salvador Perez. They are definitely using him as a comp here.

I would tell them to fuck off and I don't want to play here if that is what is coming down the pipes too. This is probably the 2nd most egregious thing I've heard about the new ownership group (with Yelich being traded with a 5 year contract the (likely forever) 1st). It's completely not understanding your asset or landscape. Unless of course, you just are not interested in signing a catcher longterm unless it's super-club friendly.

JT had eclipsed Perez at the time of the offer by being the best catcher in baseball (over a 3 year period to boot). The summer 2018 offer should have been 5/$70, and since JT kept it up all year, moving arbitration a bit higher, and annual value a bit higher, he's 5/$80+ now, with probably $85 the max. Past that it becomes untenable for any smart franchise in baseball.

That's really awful if true.

I disagree and here's why: Signing a player to an extension is very different than a free agent signing. For someone like JT, with two years remaining, an extension is akin to an insurance policy. As it is, he could be injured and unable to play at his current level or unable to play at all. An extension secures his financial future. And whether you choose to acknowedge it or not, the team is taking a risk.

[Nick]

I disagree and here's why: Signing a player to an extension is very different than a free agent signing. For someone like JT, with two years remaining, an extension is akin to an insurance policy. As it is, he could be injured and unable to play at his current level or unable to play at all. An extension secures his financial future. And whether you choose to acknowedge it or not, the team is taking a risk.

The team's taking a risk in not resigning him as well. The closer we get to him becoming an outright free agent the more his value drops and then you run the risk of getting nothing for him. You don't insult your most talented player with this kind of offer and expect the talent to come flocking to you in the future.

Also, didn't tj say throughout the season that Realmuto had not been offered a contract and that they were waiting until after the season to try and re-sign him?