2019-2020 Offseason Discussion

[tjfla]

Jake Cave is pretty much Sierra with a better bat/power and less speed. K alot and barely walks. Starting CF on crap team and 4th OF type on a solid team

It would be Elieser for Cave AND more (like non 40 man
prospect or 2) or Miami could throw a Brian Miller(since no need with Cave and Sierra around) in and try to get a mid level prospect or something better. Denbo likes Jorge Alcala from his NYY days.

They still prefer Calhoun OR Dickerson but both of them seem to be hoping for contenders to call. Puig is interesting because if Mattingly wasnt here(I know what Mish said) he would probably already be signed. Mattingly is not a fan of way he plays baseball and Denbo is still leery of him and Miami nightlife

If Miami misses on Dickerson or Calhoun(contender/price?)I would be cool with a Puig/Jake Cave addition . DFA Dean or trade him for low level prospect

One question tho is why is so many people drooling over Puig on a 3/30+ deal but were crapping on Avisail Garcia deal at 2/12-15? Avisail isnt at the that price anymore but Miami was in on him a few weeks ago at around that price.

Miami has had calls on all SP from Caleb to Urena to Neidert. No rush to trade them

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Take that tj's janitor friend.

Not my "janitor" friend. EVERYONE knows Mattingly is not a fan of him. Puig likes Mattingly and Mattingly might like him as a person but Mattingly doesn't like the showboating/non hussle he shows

One thing to note is Mattingly likely won't be here past mid 2021 so if u sign Puig for 3 years Mattingly would only deal with him for year or so which is why u see us seriously considering him.

Everyone has the 1 guy at work that sucks,lazy or whatever but outside of work u hang to watch games and dont mind him


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Lol, so we don't want injury-prone Cooper, but we want injury-prone Bird?

Greg Bird would be an injury prone guy on a Milb deal. U sign him put him in Wichita and see what he can do. He gets hurt o well and if not u might have something

[lou]

Jake Cave is pretty much Sierra with a better bat/power and less speed. K alot and barely walks. Starting CF on crap team and 4th OF type on a solid team

It would be Elieser for Cave AND more (like non 40 man
prospect or 2) or Miami could throw a Brian Miller(since no need with Cave and Sierra around) in and try to get a mid level prospect or something better. Denbo likes Jorge Alcala from his NYY days.


One question tho is why is so many people drooling over Puig on a 3/30+ deal but were crapping on Avisail Garcia deal at 2/12-15? Avisail isnt at the that price anymore but Miami was in on him a few weeks ago at around that price.

x

Cave isn't like Sierra at all. He is not a speedster and has some pop. If you meant just as a backup OF type, sure. But they are entirely different types of players. I do like the idea of Cave/Alcala/Others for Hernandez/Miller/others. That's a good low key trade for all. To note, Cave has over a 2+ WAR in his career over 500 PA. He's been pretty good.

Avisail is the same as all the other outfielders - let's build a contender for 22+. If you're going to spend money on a guy you're going to have a few years, front load it and get a cheap asset for when you should be good in 22/23. Either spend low funds on true stopgaps like Aguilar or Rojas ($5 and under), or, spend real money to help you now and later. Puig on 3/$30, but paid out $12.5-$12.5-$5 is a really smart thing. They could do the same thing with Avisail. Take a gamble and create an assert for later. Even if all the OF work out, you could trade Puig and if he is a 2+ WAR guy, teams are lining up or $5 million.

[lou]

Frisario saying AAA rotation will open - Sixto, Neidert, Cabrera, Guzman.

Very aggressive with Cabrera. That also leaves Dugger as presumably the 5th SP.

Right handed bullpen seems set to me with Steck, Stanek, Yimi, Brice, and Sharp (Brigham has an option).

Leaves Yamamoto as the 5th SP.

Long story long - they gonna move one of Urena/Caleb/Hernandez and maye aggressively move up the AAA starters.

[Namaste]

Our AAA #1 thru #3 could hang with our MLB 1-3

[tjfla]

x

Cave isn't like Sierra at all. He is not a speedster and has some pop. If you meant just as a backup OF type, sure. But they are entirely different types of players. I do like the idea of Cave/Alcala/Others for Hernandez/Miller/others. That's a good low key trade for all. To note, Cave has over a 2+ WAR in his career over 500 PA. He's been pretty good.

Avisail is the same as all the other outfielders - let's build a contender for 22+. If you're going to spend money on a guy you're going to have a few years, front load it and get a cheap asset for when you should be good in 22/23. Either spend low funds on true stopgaps like Aguilar or Rojas ($5 and under), or, spend real money to help you now and later. Puig on 3/$30, but paid out $12.5-$12.5-$5 is a really smart thing. They could do the same thing with Avisail. Take a gamble and create an assert for later. Even if all the OF work out, you could trade Puig and if he is a 2+ WAR guy, teams are lining up or $5 million.

Meant like Sierra as in LH 4th OF types. Cave has some bat and power but no speed

Would be a good low key trade for both teams which means no chance of happening HAHA

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Hopefully this means Nic Ready(who looked damn good LY) can play as long as he wants instead of until July 2020

On Saturday, the current Commander-in-Chief touted while attending the annual Army-Navy game a shift in policy that permits athletes at the service academies to delay their service.


Will be 23 in Clinton but could give us a 3B prospect

[tjfla]

Kinda Marlins news

Avisail is close to signing with Milwaukee so guys get your wish
Toronto is trying hard to sign Ryu which means more teams will want our SP(Urena/Elieser-Caleb but high price)
SD is trying to get Kluber from Cleveland but need to get rid of Wil Myers first(Nevermind on Kluber-Kluber to Texas)

We just need to do this

Miami-Wil Myers,Comp A Pick,Adrian Morejon and another prospect or 2
SD-Austin Dean

then

Miami-Jake Cave,Jorge Alcala,other
Minnesota-Elieser,Brian Miller,other

Elieser-Morejon
LHB-Cave
RHB-Myers

Alcala gets Dean's 40 man spot.

Sign 1 of Romo/Cishek/Joe Smith

Would have to do some 40 man juggle with 3 new guys on 40 man but they have the space.

[tjfla]

C-Alfaro/Wallach
1B-Aguilar
2B-Isan
SS-Rojas/Berti
3B-Villar
LF-Myers/Ramirez
CF-Cave/Sierra
RF-BA/Cooper

SP-Caleb/Sandy/Pablo/Jordan/Urena or FA?

RP-Quijada,Jarlin,Yimi,Brice,Steck,Stanek,Sharp,FA

AAA
Rotation-Sixto,Neidert,Cabrera,Guzman,Alcala,Morejon
Pen-Dugger,Brigham,Castano,Stevens,Lee,Graves,Eveld,Ma teo,Milb FA(Alcala could be RP too)


99.9999999% this WILL NOT happen but looks pretty solid and damn that AAA staff

AA has Garrett,Rogers,Stewart,Vesia,Aiello,Carter,Puckett

[Nick]

I would definitely approve of those moves.

[lou]

We just need to do this

Miami-Wil Myers,Comp A Pick,Adrian Morejon and another prospect or 2
SD-Austin Dean

then

Miami-Jake Cave,Jorge Alcala,other
Minnesota-Elieser,Brian Miller,other

Elieser-Morejon
LHB-Cave
RHB-Myers

Alcala gets Dean's 40 man spot.

Sign 1 of Romo/Cishek/Joe Smith

Would have to do some 40 man juggle with 3 new guys on 40 man but they have the space.

I think you guys are undervaluing Myers. He has a really good batted ball profile and still a nice skill set. He's certainly well overpaid, but he isn't a pure salary dump. He was effectively a 3 WAR pacing hitter in 2018. Yes he sucked in 2019, so who knows. His career 600/PA is 1.8 WAR. I think that's a really fair baseline to give him. He's not amazing, but that's a solid player and a really good one if you're platooning him with lefties, because..... career .779 OPS vs LHP and and that's around .840(!) the last two years combined. He can play 1B/LF/RF, and that's perfect with likely Lewin and Sanchez taking over Aug 1, 2020. He might not be the best right handed bat around, (Castellanos/Ozuna), but coupled with getting prospects on top of him and being cheaper, he could create the most value depending on those guys. And he could just become good again like 2018. I'm interested in this one.

I can't imagine the Padres giving up Morejon (he could be *really* good. Are you guys giving up E. Cabrera to them if the Marlins were dumping Myers? I wouldn't think so), but the more that I look at their farm system, they have a TON of 2B/SS types:

Arias - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/ga...ts?position=SS
Miller - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/ow...position=2B/SS
Marcano - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/tu...position=2B/SS

Quiroz - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/es...position=2B/SS
Ruiz (got not taken in Rule V, but big upside just young) - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/es...ts?position=2B
Rosario - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/eg...position=2B/3B
Cronenworth - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/ja...ts?position=SS

And a 16 year old (Preciado) who is already in their top 25 prospects on MLB pipeline and doesn't have a webpage
Oh and there is a top 5 pick from last year, CJ Abrams, who could end up in the middle infield even if maybe an OF.

That is sick and they need a 2B and a backup infielder out of that. Tatis is obviously playing SS forever, and they clearly have a plan as they just traded Urias and Edwards ("better" 2B prospects) which is nuts. They know which one of these guy(s) they expect to play 2B after Profar leaves next year.

I separated those first three out intentionally, as those guys are all FV45 (or higher) prospects and comparable to Devers/Nunez types. Arias and Miller are righties, Marcano a lefty. I think the Marlins should be looking at Arias or Miller as a right handed compliment to Isan/Jazz. That could be perfect to match with them and the Padres on the other hand, have their own R/L platoon (plus the other guys, who are an assortment of R/L). This seems like an area where SD has expendable guys and the Marlins could use the depth. Miller and Arias (19 in A+) had good seasons last year.

After that, the Padres are smart. They aren't giving up a Comp pick. They are going to shed their 40 man for next year. E. Ruiz cleared the 40 man, so I think you double-down with another middle infielder (who could grow into 3B). What does SD care? They have Profar and 5 other internal options trading two of those guys. Marlins are good to go as Ruiz doesn't have to go on 40 man for a year and maybe he starts bashing.

So, I think it's something like this:

MIA - W. Myers (and $15-20 million cash), Miller/Arias, E. Ruiz, maybe an outside top 30 prospect throw in or two
SDP - They get 1-2 prospects outside Marlins top 30 if not 40 (they don't want Dean)

Just playing the other side here. I'm not moving those pitchers even in a dump. But these middle infielders? Sure, and pitch in 20%+ of the contract value.

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I also like the:

Hernandez/others - Cave/Alcala trade idea.

DFA Dean, or trade him to a rebuilding AL team for relatively nothing (or trade Brice and keep Dean for now)

TJ's 13 bats is perfect with this alignment

[Nick]

https://www.prospectslive.com/lists/...p-30-prospects

Top 30 Marlins Prospects from a site called Prospects Live.

Pretty good list. I think Neidert and Scott should be higher, but some interesting comments on some of the sleeper prospects some members of this board are high on. Specifically Burdick, Mejia and Palacios.

[lou]

https://www.prospectslive.com/lists/...p-30-prospects

Top 30 Marlins Prospects from a site called Prospects Live.

Pretty good list. I think Neidert and Scott should be higher, but some interesting comments on some of the sleeper prospects some members of this board are high on. Specifically Burdick, Mejia and Palacios.

And Vesia sneaks in at 29.

Those are very bad rankings for Scott and Guzman. I don't think anyone takes Burdick and Jerar over them, but hey whatever. We'll see what the other sites say.

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Also interesting they have Misner as the 5th highest ceiling of the system (after the expected top 4).

[Nick]

Misner is a specimen, just looking at him you can see why scouts love him. Lots of things have to go right for him to meet his potential, though.

[fish16]

Monte Harrison strikes me as someone who will become like Aaron hicks 2.0 at some point

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Misner is a specimen, just looking at him you can see why scouts love him. Lots of things have to go right for him to meet his potential, though.

I think he is gonna be our breakout prospect this year. I think if you look at his stats in the limited sample size he had to start his career last year he has future stud written all over him. Showed great speed, plate discipline, and has some untapped power that he will eventually grow into

[tjfla]

I think you guys are undervaluing Myers. He has a really good batted ball profile and still a nice skill set. He's certainly well overpaid, but he isn't a pure salary dump. He was effectively a 3 WAR pacing hitter in 2018. Yes he sucked in 2019, so who knows. His career 600/PA is 1.8 WAR. I think that's a really fair baseline to give him. He's not amazing, but that's a solid player and a really good one if you're platooning him with lefties, because..... career .779 OPS vs LHP and and that's around .840(!) the last two years combined. He can play 1B/LF/RF, and that's perfect with likely Lewin and Sanchez taking over Aug 1, 2020. He might not be the best right handed bat around, (Castellanos/Ozuna), but coupled with getting prospects on top of him and being cheaper, he could create the most value depending on those guys. And he could just become good again like 2018. I'm interested in this one.

I can't imagine the Padres giving up Morejon (he could be *really* good. Are you guys giving up E. Cabrera to them if the Marlins were dumping Myers? I wouldn't think so), but the more that I look at their farm system, they have a TON of 2B/SS types:

Arias - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/ga...ts?position=SS
Miller - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/ow...position=2B/SS
Marcano - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/tu...position=2B/SS

Quiroz - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/es...position=2B/SS
Ruiz (got not taken in Rule V, but big upside just young) - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/es...ts?position=2B
Rosario - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/eg...position=2B/3B
Cronenworth - https://www.fangraphs.com/players/ja...ts?position=SS

And a 16 year old (Preciado) who is already in their top 25 prospects on MLB pipeline and doesn't have a webpage
Oh and there is a top 5 pick from last year, CJ Abrams, who could end up in the middle infield even if maybe an OF.

That is sick and they need a 2B and a backup infielder out of that. Tatis is obviously playing SS forever, and they clearly have a plan as they just traded Urias and Edwards ("better" 2B prospects) which is nuts. They know which one of these guy(s) they expect to play 2B after Profar leaves next year.

I separated those first three out intentionally, as those guys are all FV45 (or higher) prospects and comparable to Devers/Nunez types. Arias and Miller are righties, Marcano a lefty. I think the Marlins should be looking at Arias or Miller as a right handed compliment to Isan/Jazz. That could be perfect to match with them and the Padres on the other hand, have their own R/L platoon (plus the other guys, who are an assortment of R/L). This seems like an area where SD has expendable guys and the Marlins could use the depth. Miller and Arias (19 in A+) had good seasons last year.

After that, the Padres are smart. They aren't giving up a Comp pick. They are going to shed their 40 man for next year. E. Ruiz cleared the 40 man, so I think you double-down with another middle infielder (who could grow into 3B). What does SD care? They have Profar and 5 other internal options trading two of those guys. Marlins are good to go as Ruiz doesn't have to go on 40 man for a year and maybe he starts bashing.

So, I think it's something like this:

MIA - W. Myers (and $15-20 million cash), Miller/Arias, E. Ruiz, maybe an outside top 30 prospect throw in or two
SDP - They get 1-2 prospects outside Marlins top 30 if not 40 (they don't want Dean)

Just playing the other side here. I'm not moving those pitchers even in a dump. But these middle infielders? Sure, and pitch in 20%+ of the contract value.

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I also like the:

Hernandez/others - Cave/Alcala trade idea.

DFA Dean, or trade him to a rebuilding AL team for relatively nothing (or trade Brice and keep Dean for now)

TJ's 13 bats is perfect with this alignment

Heres the thing. If we agree to take Myers we pretty much have them over a barrel. Would they trade Morejon probably not BUT they have 5 P in that grouping of 8-15. I bet we could get 1 of them OR that Comp A Pick as the main sweetner The MIF thing is spot on which is why said one or 2 prospects. If we did a trade we would 10000% get a MIF in the deal since they have tons

I just threw Dean in to throw in a name. More than likely its a DSL arm or some older arm like we trade Baltimore.

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And Vesia sneaks in at 29.

Those are very bad rankings for Scott and Guzman. I don't think anyone takes Burdick and Jerar over them, but hey whatever. We'll see what the other sites say.

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Also interesting they have Misner as the 5th highest ceiling of the system (after the expected top 4).

Guzman is that low because some teams still seem him as a RP(I see him as a RP right now too). Scott just needs AB's he is young

Misner has a monster ceiling especially if he can handle CF

[lou]

Heres the thing. If we agree to take Myers we pretty much have them over a barrel. Would they trade Morejon probably not BUT they have 5 P in that grouping of 8-15. I bet we could get 1 of them OR that Comp A Pick as the main sweetner The MIF thing is spot on which is why said one or 2 prospects. If we did a trade we would 10000% get a MIF in the deal since they have tons

I just threw Dean in to throw in a name. More than likely its a DSL arm or some older arm like we trade Baltimore.

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Guzman is that low because some teams still seem him as a RP(I see him as a RP right now too). Scott just needs AB's he is young

Misner has a monster ceiling especially if he can handle CF

I think if you eat 100% of Myers, you could get something like...

Morejon, Miller/Arias, Comp A, and a better throw in 40 man eligible in 2021, for say....
Comp B and a lower throw in 2+ years to the 40 man

I think they'd have to do that for the prospects.

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Maybe you send them one of Urena/Brice/Conley too