2019-2020 Offseason Discussion

[Namaste]

Lest we forget, Austin Dean, Tyler Heineman and even Eddy Alvarez had higher OPS than Diaz at New Orleans. Heck, Lewis Brinson hit pretty much as well as Diaz at NO.

Diaz’s .224 BABIP didn’t do him any favors with the Marlins in 2019.

[lou]

We certainly shouldn't ignore him. We should hope he improves at AAA at the start of next season. Based on last year's results at the ML level, there just isn't any way to pencil Isan into next year's opening day lineup.

This is stupid. Isan is a lock for opening day at 2B. Unless it's a tough lefty, and maybe he gets an off day.

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They have to physically have on the team 13 bats from this:

Alfaro, Wallach (2)
Cooper, L. Diaz (2)
I. Diaz, Berti (2)
Rojas, Jazz (2)
Anderson (1)
Sierra, Brinson, Monte (3)
Ramirez, Dean, J. Sanchez (3)
=15

Sandy, Caleb, Pablo, Urena, Yamamoto, Sixto, E. Cabrera, Neidert, Dugger (9)
Steckenrider, Stanek, Brice, Brigham, E. Hernandez, Guzman (6)
Garcia, Conley, Quijada, Castano (4)
=19

Holloway, Mejia, W. Stewart (3 - likely non 2020 players)
=3

Total=37



Lewin, Jazz, Monte, and Sanchez can't come up until the summer for service time reasons.

They have to add 2 bats just to get to 13.

Even if they add 4 veteran/new bats to this, Isan is not one of the next two drops, which are clearly Brinson (sucks) and Dean (has option to AAA). Ramirez and Sierra are OOO so they stay. Isan has an option, but they also need, you know, infielders.

[Nick]

We certainly shouldn't ignore him. We should hope he improves at AAA at the start of next season. Based on last year's results at the ML level, there just isn't any way to pencil Isan into next year's opening day lineup.

Improve? His AAA OPS was near 1.000 last year what more does he have to prove in AAA? This may be your worst take yet.

[lou]

Improve? His AAA OPS was near 1.000 last year what more does he have to prove in AAA? This may be your worst take yet.

I think Buster Posey is a replaceable player because he's a catcher will never be topped

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He's going to have to say something like Justin Verlander isn't a hall of famer because he has no world series wins to beat that

[emkayseven]

Man, small deals in the $8-10M range do nothing for me. I still think Ozuna makes a ton of sense. Fits an organizational need, is popular with the fans, and didn't finish strong and is probably somewhat buried in this FA class. Imagine spinning to the fans "We got Gallen who we swapped for Chisholm, and we got our backup OFer in Sierra, and we got our 2019 All Star for Ozuna, and now we have Ozuna too." That buys you goodwill AND it improves your team.

[lou]

Man, small deals in the $8-10M range do nothing for me. I still think Ozuna makes a ton of sense. Fits an organizational need, is popular with the fans, and didn't finish strong and is probably somewhat buried in this FA class. Imagine spinning to the fans "We got Gallen who we swapped for Chisholm, and we got our backup OFer in Sierra, and we got our 2019 All Star for Ozuna, and now we have Ozuna too." That buys you goodwill AND it improves your team.

Totally. Who cares about the draft pick. Hard hit rates are great and he can play good defense in LF. They need a RH bat to match with Anderson, Alfaro, Monte, and Cooper longterm. He'll be 29-32 on a 4 year deal which can't be much more than $72?

That moves their payroll to like, $65-75 for 2020-2023. Cheap.

I'm also not worried about the "redundancy" of Monte, Sanchez, and Bleday. I don't think that's an excuse. If all 3 are awesome, someone can be traded for a SP. Or Ozuna can in a salary dump. Bleday probably isn't even ready for a full time gig until 22 anyways.

[Lee Stone]

Would you ...

send Urena and Conley packing or let them go to arb?

use a forty-man spot on Will Stewart?

[lou]

Would you ...

send Urena and Conley packing or let them go to arb?

use a forty-man spot on Will Stewart?

You keep all of them, but if you get a beneficial trade for any of them, sure.

I'd want a FV40 prospect to headline for Urena and Conley, NOT 40 man eligible. That's a top 16-28 player in the Marlins system. Basically, a Will Stewart.

[rmc523]

Totally. Who cares about the draft pick. Hard hit rates are great and he can play good defense in LF. They need a RH bat to match with Anderson, Alfaro, Monte, and Cooper longterm. He'll be 29-32 on a 4 year deal which can't be much more than $72?

That moves their payroll to like, $65-75 for 2020-2023. Cheap.

I'm also not worried about the "redundancy" of Monte, Sanchez, and Bleday. I don't think that's an excuse. If all 3 are awesome, someone can be traded for a SP. Or Ozuna can in a salary dump. Bleday probably isn't even ready for a full time gig until 22 anyways.

I'd also like to see them front load a deal of whoever they sign while they have more flexibility now before the "next core" starts coming up/making money at the same time.

[tjfla]

Names they are looking at are Calhoun and Desmond as well as the Boston guys. Want them AND a sweetner(draft pick/IFA/Prospect) and are offering guys like Tayron/Conley/Keller/Kinley(40 Man RP). Pretty much salary dump

They are looking at pen(like Romo),Vet SP on 2 yr deal(option) and 2 bats

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****NEW Coach Alert****

Hensley Meulens has been offered a job. Not close but we are the favorites-could tap into Dutch players(Curacao)

The staff we are trying to put together looks great AND if they get Meulens he could be another contender for Manager job when Mattingly fired. They still need a 3B Coach but right now u have Hillman/Rowson/Keith Johnson/Meulens? all who could be a Manager

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Would you ...

send Urena and Conley packing or let them go to arb?

use a forty-man spot on Will Stewart?

U can get something for both of them

[Nick]

So early indications is this seems like status quo Marlins behavior for this offseason. You can be smart with building your minor league system, build a strong farm system, but if you're ultimately not willing to be more than the last or 2nd to last in major league payroll, that's only going to get you so far.

[Lee Stone]

So early indications is this seems like status quo Marlins behavior for this offseason. You can be smart with building your minor league system, build a strong farm system, but if you're ultimately not willing to be more than the last or 2nd to last in major league payroll, that's only going to get you so far.

The lowest payroll in 2019 actually got the Rays quite far. I respect their entire approach.

[Nick]

The lowest payroll in 2019 actually got the Rays quite far. I respect their entire approach.

You can respect it all you want, but it's not going to get the Rays a world championship unless they can actually hold onto players and supplement that talent they've held onto with new prospects coming up.

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Also, you've got to have a strong foundation to do what the Rays did. They've had a continuity that has allowed them to re-tool the roster from the success they had in 2010-2012, which made for a rather short re-building period, to where they were able to compete again. Loria left the foundation basically sinking into the earth, with his basically complete neglect of the minor league system in his later years, and then structuring contracts for the talent we do have at the major league level so that he paid the bare minimum and the new FO would be saddled with contracts that there was just no way we could get rid of, (Chen) or that we could get very little return for a defending MVP. (Stanton)

You willing to wait another decade for the Marlins to be good, so that they can say they did it like the Rays did, Lee? So they can be eliminated in the Divisional Series in 2030?

[fauowls44]

So early indications is this seems like status quo Marlins behavior for this offseason. You can be smart with building your minor league system, build a strong farm system, but if you're ultimately not willing to be more than the last or 2nd to last in major league payroll, that's only going to get you so far.

Seems like they are at least going to add to the team and not just $3 million veteran types. That would at least be slight progress. Unfortunately this seems like a fairly bad free agent class, so there’s really no big splash to be made other than Rendon or Cole which of course is not happening.

[lou]

I'd also like to see them front load a deal of whoever they sign while they have more flexibility now before the "next core" starts coming up/making money at the same time.

Absolutely. I'm not sure there is a huge opportunity with that for a FA, but maybe?

BUT Anderson is an easy buyout candidate for say 5/$35 and get a 6th year option pushing it to 6/$45ish.

They can really stack Anderson say $7-$10-$8-$6-$4 and talk about the windfall 2023-2024 for his age 30-31 seasons. They should be running to frontload Anderson.

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You can respect it all you want, but it's not going to get the Rays a world championship unless they can actually hold onto players and supplement that talent they've held onto with new prospects coming up.

- - - - - - - - - -

Also, you've got to have a strong foundation to do what the Rays did. They've had a continuity that has allowed them to re-tool the roster from the success they had in 2010-2012, which made for a rather short re-building period, to where they were able to compete again. Loria left the foundation basically sinking into the earth, with his basically complete neglect of the minor league system in his later years, and then structuring contracts for the talent we do have at the major league level so that he paid the bare minimum and the new FO would be saddled with contracts that there was just no way we could get rid of, (Chen) or that we could get very little return for a defending MVP. (Stanton)

You willing to wait another decade for the Marlins to be good, so that they can say they did it like the Rays did, Lee? So they can be eliminated in the Divisional Series in 2030?

Yep