2019-2020 Offseason Discussion

[Nick]

I think Jazz and Lewin being ready by August 1st is pretty aggressive. I don't think it's out of the question, but neither guy has played in AAA yet. Lewin has less than 250 ABs above A-ball and Jazz is coming off a year where he hit .220 in AA and struck out about once every three plate appearances. Cabrera being up is aggressive as well. I think it's anybody's guess what we get from Monte next year.

Some of these prospects are going to fail, it's just the nature of the beast, you can't just pencil them in like they're a foregone conclusion. Right now we should be setting up contingency plans through the money we should be able to spend on our major league payroll.

[lou]

Totally agree with this. I'm on board with the rebuild, and get how it works, but improvement needs to be shown. Granted, getting rid of some of the guys that are already gone (Granderson, etc.), should automatically cause an improvement. But I think they need to show improvement - and a change in thinking (vs. the old regime) - for people to gain more trust in what they're doing.

I totally agree too

- - - - - - - - - -

I think Jazz and Lewin being ready by August 1st is pretty aggressive. I don't think it's out of the question, but neither guy has played in AAA yet. Lewin has less than 250 ABs above A-ball and Jazz is coming off a year where he hit .220 in AA and struck out about once every three plate appearances. Cabrera being up is aggressive as well. I think it's anybody's guess what we get from Monte next year.

Some of these prospects are going to fail, it's just the nature of the beast, you can't just pencil them in like they're a foregone conclusion. Right now we should be setting up contingency plans through the money we should be able to spend on our major league payroll.

I think they need to give Lewin the "Isan Diaz" treatment and see what they got. Call him up in July and see if he can at least be a strong RHP platoon bat.

Jazz they can wait a bit longer. He's a more valuable longterm asset, so I'd "Kris Bryant" him and call him up May 1, 2021 if he's ready and who cares about the Super 2 status. Just get the year of control.

Cabrera I am undecided, but if he's ready in August I'd call him up. Pitchers have shorter shelf lives than bats. Let them rip once the Super 2 deadline is gone. Sixto, Neidert, Cabrera, Guzman, Castano, maybe Vesia. All of them.

[tjfla]

I totally agree too

- - - - - - - - - -



I think they need to give Lewin the "Isan Diaz" treatment and see what they got. Call him up in July and see if he can at least be a strong RHP platoon bat.

Jazz they can wait a bit longer. He's a more valuable longterm asset, so I'd "Kris Bryant" him and call him up May 1, 2021 if he's ready and who cares about the Super 2 status. Just get the year of control.

Cabrera I am undecided, but if he's ready in August I'd call him up. Pitchers have shorter shelf lives than bats. Let them rip once the Super 2 deadline is gone. Sixto, Neidert, Cabrera, Guzman, Castano, maybe Vesia. All of them.

Well Lewin and Jazz are on the 40 man and they have Rojas/Berti/likely minor league FA at SS so up in the air what they do with Jazz this year. Lewin is 1000% getting called up by July/Aug

If the guys are on the 40 man they will more than likely get calls up in 2020 especially the arms. November 20 is gonna be interesting for us. Lots of decisions to make on arms but Castano and Dylan Lee are ahead of Vesia on pecking order however guys like Tayron,Kinley,Keller,Chad Smith,Eveld.Poteet could be on the move. They LOVE guys like Milbrath,Stevens,Vesia,CJ Carter,Aiello,Alex Mateo but none of them but 2 have to be on 40 man

I know u know this but for casual fans IF u are don't have to be on the 40 man u likely won't be put on it. Maybe mid season but they arent gonna put Stevens,Vesia,Carter,Aiello,Jupiter guys on no matter what this early.If Cabrera didn't have to be on the 40 man he wouldn't be put on it even if he was 10-0 with a 1.50 ERA in AAA. Denbo knows how to do things and this is no longer some circus show where FO put guys on roster just to put them on it and burn option years(Brad Hand)

- - - - - - - - - -

Business will pick up starting over next week or 2. GM Meetings/40 man roster set and then in Dec u got Winter Meetings(FA)

- - - - - - - - - -

New name to add to vet bat list

Brittany Ghiroli
@Britt_Ghiroli
Howie Kendrick drawing a lot of early interest, including the Rays. Marlins also interested. He's from Florida, but lives in the Phoenix area now in the offseason. Veteran looking for a short deal.

[fauowls44]

Brittany Ghiroli
@Britt_Ghiroli
Howie Kendrick drawing a lot of early interest, including the Rays. Marlins also interested. He's from Florida, but lives in the Phoenix area now in the offseason. Veteran looking for a short deal.

I can see him fitting the Castro role...Play some 3rd, 1st, and 2nd in place of Isan against a tough lefty.

[tjfla]

I can see him fitting the Castro role...Play some 3rd, 1st, and 2nd in place of Isan against a tough lefty.

They want 2 bats- Preferably 1 RH and 1 LH but not requirement and want 1 of them to be a vet

Not sure Howie comes here because like said Rays interested AND he lives in Phoenix(heard prefers Texas and out west)

[fauowls44]

They want 2 bats- Preferably 1 RH and 1 LH but not requirement and want 1 of them to be a vet

Not sure Howie comes here because like said Rays interested AND he lives in Phoenix(heard prefers Texas and out west)

He wouldn't be my first choice, but I can see why they'd be interested in him for that role. I'd prefer some bats that are closer to their prime.

[tjfla]

He wouldn't be my first choice, but I can see why they'd be interested in him for that role. I'd prefer some bats that are closer to their prime.

Ya not a bad option just not likely. They have and are looking at a number of guys like Gardner,Dickerson,Neil Walker,Cabrera,Starlin,Brock Holt,Calhoun. Want a vet just not a priority. Also all over the trade market

I keep hearing likely try for Garcia or maybe Didi/Castellanos then figure out the vet. Romo is very high on list and has interest in reunion with same role as LY. Are dying to get a innings eater like Roark,Pineda on 1yr+ option

If they get Garcia they dont really want another RHB who is only a OF. If they get Didi they dont really want another LHB who is IF mostly so all depends on what they do at first

Rojas and Berti are RHB SS/UT guys. I could see Asdrubal Cabrera(if willing to be backup) or Brock Holt as option for vet LHB if get Avisail Garcia. Before anyone says what about JT Riddle-very likely he is DFA by Nov 20

[lou]

Why the fuck is world series champion Howie Kendrick coming off a totally awesome year, playing his last season for the rebuilding Marlins?

He will get a bench/platoon job with any contender. He's made over $65 million dollars in his career.

[tjfla]

Why the fuck is world series champion Howie Kendrick coming off a totally awesome year, playing his last season for the rebuilding Marlins?

He will get a bench/platoon job with any contender. He's made over $65 million dollars in his career.

He wouldnt unless TB,Houston,Arizona,LAD,LAA said no thanks. I asked my "janitor" friend about him/rumor and supposedly Miami was mentioned because he wants to play in Florida OR West of Texas but we are likely LAST on list. He would sign with us over teams like Minnesota,Seattle,NY teams

[Namaste]

I lol’d when tj said the Marlins think they can be over .500 in 2021. The Marlins better be over .500 in 2021. If they’re not, it will because the FO didn’t add the necessary pieces via the trade market to do so.

When 2021 rolls around, it will have been 17 years since the Marlins made the playoffs.

[Nick]

I don't think it got enough press that the Marlins went an entire decade without finishing .500 or above. The Marlins did not have a winning record in the 10s. That shit is unbelievable.

[fish16]

Pineda on a 1-2 year deal could be a great value especially in our ballpark

[fauowls44]

I lol’d when tj said the Marlins think they can be over .500 in 2021. The Marlins better be over .500 in 2021. If they’re not, it will because the FO didn’t add the necessary pieces via the trade market to do so.

When 2021 rolls around, it will have been 17 years since the Marlins made the playoffs.

This is exactly why they need to make moves this year to improve. It's very hard to go from 60-65 wins to 82-85. They need to at least be able to win 72-75 wins this year and that will take adding multiple legitimate pieces to the MLB club. You can't just rely on calling up prospects in August. Things happen...go get actual MLB talent and prove that winning matters.

[lou]

This is exactly why they need to make moves this year to improve. It's very hard to go from 60-65 wins to 82-85. They need to at least be able to win 72-75 wins this year and that will take adding multiple legitimate pieces to the MLB club. You can't just rely on calling up prospects in August. Things happen...go get actual MLB talent and prove that winning matters.

Let's take this even further, they should be good (on paper) in 2022 right? Who cares about 2020 for a second, and let's think about 2022 and how this year's free agency can be used to impact 2022.

Payroll is a phenomenal asset right now. This is constantly brought up here, but they can frontload deals for 2 seasons to mitigate against future payroll and be able to use it on an extra player or two in 2022.

Imagine this in 2022:

Alfaro $4,250,000
Wallach $1,000,000

L. Diaz $625,000
Cooper $3,500,000
I. Diaz $650,000
Jazz $625,000
Berti $650,000
Anderson $5,000,000

Monte $625,000
Ozuna/Castellanos $12,000,000
Bleday $625,000
J. Sanchez $625,000
VVM/Sierra $650,000

Alcantara $4,250,000
Pablo $3,500,000
Caleb $6,500,000
Sixto $625,000
Neidert $625,000

E. Cabrera $625,000
Guzman $625,000
Brigham $650,000
Holloway/CC $625,000

Rogers $625,000
Garrett $625,000
Vesia/Castano $625,000
W. Stewart/CC $625,000

Total Payroll $51,350,000 < - ARE YOU KIDDING ME (Also please no one construe as suggesting all those guys are relievers. I'm just putting them in for discussion sake and let them fall as they do)

You get there by:

Giving Anderson 5/$35, and pay him $8-10-$5-$5-$5 ($2 mil buyout on an option). That is radical early money and sets up a 2022-2025 contending period.
Giving Ozuna/Castellanos 4/$68 and pay them - $16-$28-$12-$12 < - Fuck your payroll in 2021 as you try out all the kids, and get cheaper years to hopefully afford an extra player.

To note, Marlins can easily hit payroll under $70-75 million in 2020, and $80 million in 2021. Which I think are reasonable totals.


This is what they should be doing. Using this payroll for a longterm strategy. Guys are going to fail on that list above, and you've mitigated that by shaving probably $10 million off Anderson and Ozuna/Castellanos in 2022 and 2023 by being smart with your payroll strategy. That is smart business. Doing stuff like that, gets you Josh Donaldson on 1 year deals as you have extra money to burn. That's the kind of move this sets up.

- - - - - - - - - -

Also to note: Alfaro, Wallach, Cooper, Sandy, Pablo, and Caleb are roundball arb projections. Could be a little higher if someone really works out which Sandy might, but point stands an even more important reason to mitigate payroll.

- - - - - - - - - -

And to get back to center - Ozuna/Castellanos help right now, and they can add a few more Walker/Romo types to help be less embarrassing in 2020.

Which helps TV, naming rights, gate, etc.

I mean this isn't hard.

[tjfla]

Let's take this even further, they should be good (on paper) in 2022 right? Who cares about 2020 for a second, and let's think about 2022 and how this year's free agency can be used to impact 2022.

Payroll is a phenomenal asset right now. This is constantly brought up here, but they can frontload deals for 2 seasons to mitigate against future payroll and be able to use it on an extra player or two in 2022.

Imagine this in 2022:

Alfaro $4,250,000
Wallach $1,000,000

L. Diaz $625,000
Cooper $3,500,000
I. Diaz $650,000
Jazz $625,000
Berti $650,000
Anderson $5,000,000

Monte $625,000
Ozuna/Castellanos $12,000,000
Bleday $625,000
J. Sanchez $625,000
VVM/Sierra $650,000

Alcantara $4,250,000
Pablo $3,500,000
Caleb $6,500,000
Sixto $625,000
Neidert $625,000

E. Cabrera $625,000
Guzman $625,000
Brigham $650,000
Holloway/CC $625,000

Rogers $625,000
Garrett $625,000
Vesia/Castano $625,000
W. Stewart/CC $625,000

Total Payroll $51,350,000 < - ARE YOU KIDDING ME (Also please no one construe as suggesting all those guys are relievers. I'm just putting them in for discussion sake and let them fall as they do)

You get there by:

Giving Anderson 5/$35, and pay him $8-10-$5-$5-$5 ($2 mil buyout on an option). That is radical early money and sets up a 2022-2025 contending period.
Giving Ozuna/Castellanos 4/$68 and pay them - $16-$28-$12-$12 < - Fuck your payroll in 2021 as you try out all the kids, and get cheaper years to hopefully afford an extra player.

To note, Marlins can easily hit payroll under $70-75 million in 2020, and $80 million in 2021. Which I think are reasonable totals.


This is what they should be doing. Using this payroll for a longterm strategy. Guys are going to fail on that list above, and you've mitigated that by shaving probably $10 million off Anderson and Ozuna/Castellanos in 2022 and 2023 by being smart with your payroll strategy. That is smart business. Doing stuff like that, gets you Josh Donaldson on 1 year deals as you have extra money to burn. That's the kind of move this sets up.

- - - - - - - - - -

Also to note: Alfaro, Wallach, Cooper, Sandy, Pablo, and Caleb are roundball arb projections. Could be a little higher if someone really works out which Sandy might, but point stands an even more important reason to mitigate payroll.

Take Ozuna out as option with the QO its 99.9999% we will pass on him.

Looking at vet bat,Romo and a SP like Roark/Pineda in 2021. 2022 u could have Avisail Garcia at like 6 million(I think he gets 2/13-15 mill) but 2022 I dont expect any of the FA we sign now to be here-maybe Didi or Castellanos but guys this offseason are stop gaps

I wouldn't be surprised IF Garrett or Rogers are readyas SP in 2022 if Caleb is dealt. Far off still but possible. Also in 2022 u could have the #3 pick ready(SP-Hancock,Ginn,Wilcox/3B-Martin/1B-Tork could be ready sometime during year)