Season Super Game Thread

[Namaste]

Can we take a moment to acknowledge that we sold high on almost every guy we traded last offseason with the exception of Yelich? Stanton has not been anything close to what he was last year.

Another head explosion.

What a weird thing to say to bolster your tired pro-Jeter agenda.

Stanton has a 2.7 WAR after a total disaster start with a ton of baseball left. I wonder what his WAR was last year on July 12th........

[fish16]

Another head explosion.

What a weird thing to say to bolster your tired pro-Jeter agenda.

Stanton has a 2.7 WAR after a total disaster start with a ton of baseball left. I wonder what his WAR was last year on July 12th........

His ops is .866 after being over .1000 last year. That is not really close. Its the difference between Mike Trout's career OPS and Khris Davis's. Nobody is calling him a bad player or saying his numbers wont improve by the end of the year, but they sold high and got off that contract before it becomes a potential albert pujols type albatross that a team in this market cant survive like the Angels can.

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And its not a pro jeter agenda. I couldnt care less who actually runs the team. I care about a team adhering to a smart team building strategy relative to their market and that is what we are finally doing after nearly 2 decades of Loria incompetence.

[Nick]

I mean yeah, you could make the argument we sold high on these guys, but you could also make the argument that most of the prospects we got back in these trades have taken a step back and are lesser prospects than when we traded for them.

[sports24/7]

Any power is not all projection at this point. He's had around .500 slugging percentage each of the last 2 years and around 20 hr pace per 162 games as well. For a catcher he has more thnn enough power. And again, he's been young for each level he's been at.

You kind of just proved my point, no?

[Namaste]

I don’t know why I even bother.

[fish16]

You kind of just proved my point, no?

I already said he has more value when he's a catcher. I just think his hit tool is good enough regardless of where he plays. But obviously any catching prospect will have more value.

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I don’t know why I even bother.

nothing i said was remotely controversial or wrong.

[lou]

I mean yeah, you could make the argument we sold high on these guys, but you could also make the argument that most of the prospects we got back in these trades have taken a step back and are lesser prospects than when we traded for them.

I think you can FOR SURE say that for the Yelich hitter prospects (Yamamoto is cool), but I think the Gordon trade is really looking good with Niedert (probably biggest "win" so far?). I think the Cardinals/Yankees guys are "as expected" for the most part. Devers is a little better, Sierra a little worse, etc.

Going to take another few years to sort this mess out, but I agree with you, it's probably overall more bad than good with this group half a season in.

I'm still hoping they get two 3 WAR position players out of Brinson/Monte/Diaz, two good 3/4 SP out of Alcantara/Guzman/Niedert, and then some role players/relievers out of Gallen/Sierra/Yamamoto/Whoever. Marlins will come out alright if that happens even without a breakout star. I think we can all live with that combined with Anderson, Ca. Smith, Steckenrider, I guess Conley, maybe Riddle, etc. all turning into solid assets for who they are. That's starting to turn into half a longterm baseball team.

[Nick]

I think you can FOR SURE say that for the Yelich hitter prospects (Yamamoto is cool), but I think the Gordon trade is really looking good with Niedert (probably biggest "win" so far?). I think the Cardinals/Yankees guys are "as expected" for the most part. Devers is a little better, Sierra a little worse, etc.

Going to take another few years to sort this mess out, but I agree with you, it's probably overall more bad than good with this group half a season in.

I'm still hoping they get two 3 WAR position players out of Brinson/Monte/Diaz, two good 3/4 SP out of Alcantara/Guzman/Niedert, and then some role players/relievers out of Gallen/Sierra/Yamamoto/Whoever. Marlins will come out alright if that happens even without a breakout star. I think we can all live with that combined with Anderson, Ca. Smith, Steckenrider, I guess Conley, maybe Riddle, etc. all turning into solid assets for who they are. That's starting to turn into half a longterm baseball team.

I agree with most of your assessment, the only thing I'll say is I'm not at all impressed by what Guzman's done at Jupiter. His ERA is decent, but all his other stats are less than stellar, especially for Jupiter, and his walk rate is shockingly high.

[tjfla]

JT News

Washington tried to get him again and were told Soto OR Robles again-said NO

Jon Heyman had an article out and says Houston is the fave. This is true however unless they offer Tucker plus doubtful JT is traded during the season. The FO plan is to offer JT an extension before the trade deadline and if he says NO then put him on the market. They are expected to ask for Tucker again and if not a package around Yordan Alvarez and Corbin Martin

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You literally have no idea what you're talking about. If Mejia plays any other position he's not a top prospect, that's the point. The thing that makes him valuable is his ability to play Catcher.

If Mejia's not playing catcher McKenzie is easily the better prospect. (and may be the better prospect either way)

I totally agree with u and I think we will play him at C(If we get him) because we will end up trading JT.

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I know a lot of people give you shit here, but this is pretty unfair

JT to Washington was mentioned and people complain that they should hold out for Soto OR Robles. If neither then keep him and dont take a Kieboom and More deal
DD and Bearclaw to Clev was mentioned and people complain that they should take McKenzie and More instead of holding out for Mejia

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Can someone explain to me what an elite hit tool is?

This must've been what I was missing back when I played as a youngster, if only I'd known there was a hit tool.

Guy has a sub .800 OPS in the minors in 1800+ ABs, so he might want to upgrade that hit tool.

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Right now, Mejia's numbers remind me of a Starlin Castro type. Yeah Starlin Castro, the guy tj keeps telling me we couldn't get rid of even if we paid teams to take him.

We have been offering Prado and Castro around the league WITH cash attached and have gotten ZERO bites. They would love to move Castro

[lou]

I agree with most of your assessment, the only thing I'll say is I'm not at all impressed by what Guzman's done at Jupiter. His ERA is decent, but all his other stats are less than stellar, especially for Jupiter, and his walk rate is shockingly high.

I think he's going to the bullpen. Not a knock, but all of that isn't screaming SP. I like this in theory of a future hypothetical bullpen:

Guzman, Steckenrider, Wittgren, pick 2 Gallen/Merandy/Richards/Yamamoto/Hernandez/Brigham/Meyer/Whoever
Conley, pick 2 Quijada/Garcia/Peters/O'Grady/probably could pick up another lefty or two for depth and prospect flameout purposes

Focus on getting Alcantara, Caleb, and Niedert in the rotation, hopefully plucking 1 more guy (McKenzie!) in a non-JT deal, and then the eventual veteran starter figurehead on top of it, with Rogers, Garret, and E. Cabrera coming down the pipes in 3+ years.

Anyways. Cautiously optimistic here for 2020. They probably need to acquire 3-4 more "Gallen or better" level guys with one being a top 100 guy, and this starts feeling pretty good at filling out the staff.

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I think you honestly run to trade JT to Houston for Alvarez/Martin/and low level Friends, and Barraclough and DD for McKenzie/and low level friends.

Plopping 2 more big time pitchers to the depth chart and the "1B" of the future with Alvarez to add to Diaz, Anderson, Monte, Brinson, and whatever they get from Riddle/Cooper/Sierra, is getting pretty fun.

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* Assuming you give JT a fair 5 year deal and he refuses 17 times before you trade him on the 18th call

[Nick]

JT News

Washington tried to get him again and were told Soto OR Robles again-said NO

Jon Heyman had an article out and says Houston is the fave. This is true however unless they offer Tucker plus doubtful JT is traded during the season. The FO plan is to offer JT an extension before the trade deadline and if he says NO then put him on the market. They are expected to ask for Tucker again and if not a package around Yordan Alvarez and Corbin Martin

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I totally agree with u and I think we will play him at C(If we get him) because we will end up trading JT.

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JT to Washington was mentioned and people complain that they should hold out for Soto OR Robles. If neither then keep him and dont take a Kieboom and More deal
DD and Bearclaw to Clev was mentioned and people complain that they should take McKenzie and More instead of holding out for Mejia

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We have been offering Prado and Castro around the league WITH cash attached and have gotten ZERO bites. They would love to move Castro

I don't doubt you on Castro, I just feel like the league is in a weird place right now, because Castro's having a good season, is relatively young, he makes a chunk of change, but it's not considerably more than he'd make on the open market I feel.

And you continue to miss the point on Mejia. First of all comparing Mejia to a Robles or Soto level prospect is absolutely ludicrous. They aren't in the same league, and I have no problem holding out for Mejia, what I took issue with is your suggestion of holding out for Mejia, and then when we trade for him moving him off of Catcher.

[Lee Stone]

Am I the only one who's not enamored with Mejia? If he doesn't stick at catcher, his value goes down significantly, no?

I don't see why Miami wouldn't eat money in trading guys like Ziegler, Castro, and Prado. They dumped so much money already, that this shouldn't even be a question. Eat the money, and get the prospects.

I wouldn't trade Urena unless someone is paying for upside, which I wouldn't anticipate. You'd be selling low on him right now, and at worst, he's a rotation arm that gets you through the next couple of years. At best, he uses his stuff better and increases his value.

You are not the only one. Mejia is hitting much the same as Telis at AAA and carries similar question marks defensively.

[tjfla]

I think he's going to the bullpen. Not a knock, but all of that isn't screaming SP. I like this in theory of a future hypothetical bullpen:

Guzman, Steckenrider, Wittgren, pick 2 Gallen/Merandy/Richards/Yamamoto/Hernandez/Brigham/Meyer/Whoever
Conley, pick 2 Quijada/Garcia/Peters/O'Grady/probably could pick up another lefty or two for depth and prospect flameout purposes

Focus on getting Alcantara, Caleb, and Niedert in the rotation, hopefully plucking 1 more guy (McKenzie!) in a non-JT deal, and then the eventual veteran starter figurehead on top of it, with Rogers, Garret, and E. Cabrera coming down the pipes in 3+ years.

Anyways. Cautiously optimistic here for 2020. They probably need to acquire 3-4 more "Gallen or better" level guys with one being a top 100 guy, and this starts feeling pretty good at filling out the staff.

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I think you honestly run to trade JT to Houston for Alvarez/Martin/and low level Friends, and Barraclough and DD for McKenzie/and low level friends.

Plopping 2 more big time pitchers to the depth chart and the "1B" of the future with Alvarez to add to Diaz, Anderson, Monte, Brinson, and whatever they get from Riddle/Cooper/Sierra, is getting pretty fun.

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* Assuming you give JT a fair 5 year deal and he refuses 17 times before you trade him on the 18th call

Agree on Guzman-I don't mind if they try him another year as a SP but he looks like setup/closer

Yes Please on BOTH

Houston-JT/Tyler Kolek
Miami-Alvarez/Corbin Martin/2 or 3 others

Clev-DD/Bearclaw
Miami-McKenzie/3 or 4 others

LAD OR Boston-Conley
Miami-2 or 3 prospects

Looks like they are going to make 1 big push in Oct on JT. He says YES than cool and he says NO then Winter Meetings he will be dealt

[lou]

Did you really just type Tyler Kolek?

[tjfla]

I don't doubt you on Castro, I just feel like the league is in a weird place right now, because Castro's having a good season, is relatively young, he makes a chunk of change, but it's not considerably more than he'd make on the open market I feel.

And you continue to miss the point on Mejia. First of all comparing Mejia to a Robles or Soto level prospect is absolutely ludicrous. They aren't in the same league, and I have no problem holding out for Mejia, what I took issue with is your suggestion of holding out for Mejia, and then when we trade for him moving him off of Catcher.

O I dont think Mejia is on same level as Robles or Soto. Miami is looking for that TOP prospect-Tucker/Soto/Robles/Mejia/Vlad Jr/Bo

The suggestion was if JT still is here. 1 of them will have to move to 1B but I don't think JT will be here next year so he will be at C

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Did you really just type Tyler Kolek?

Ya might as well send him back to Texas. He can sit on his ranch and pretend to rehab

Not getting anything for him so might as well throw him in