September 2019 Game Thread

[rmc523]

I'm with Lee here 10000%

I'm glad to have continuity and not be a laughing stock, I'm happy he seems to command respect, but while managers have very little impact on the game, he sucks at the places they do have impact -- lineup, bullpen management, fundamentals.

Not a fan of the extension.

I'm with you too. He makes some inexplicable moves and lineup decisions, and often.

Like I said above, I could've seen an "extension" of just a year - next year - and bring in a new guy after that, but 2+ seemed unnecessary.

[fish16]

Miggy Rojas deal is 2 years for 10.5 million total plus an option for a 3rd year according to heyman. If true that is a phenomenal deal, even from someone who views Rojas as merely an average stopgap type player who is great in the clubhouse

[lou]

Miggy Rojas deal is 2 years for 10.5 million total plus an option for a 3rd year according to heyman. If true that is a phenomenal deal, even from someone who views Rojas as merely an average stopgap type player who is great in the clubhouse

I mean phenomenal should be reserved for the Albies and J. Ramirez deals.

But that's fine. It's a million more than I'd expect, but who cares about that. Rojas has earned this and its a good look for them of rewarding their own.

Onto Anderson.

[rmc523]

Miggy Rojas deal is 2 years for 10.5 million total plus an option for a 3rd year according to heyman. If true that is a phenomenal deal, even from someone who views Rojas as merely an average stopgap type player who is great in the clubhouse

10.25M, not 10.5

He also says if the option vests it'll be "north of" 15M overall.

[Lee Stone]

Rojas. I guess it's a deal depending how you look at it. The team just finished paying Prado $41 M for exactly 600 plate appearances with an OPS under .600. Personally, I'd prefer Jon Berti for minimum wage.

[Nick]

Rojas. I guess it's a deal depending how you look at it. The team just finished paying Prado $41 M for exactly 600 plate appearances with an OPS under .600. Personally, I'd prefer Jon Berti for minimum wage.

Berti's still going to be on the team. (I would think)

[Lee Stone]

Berti's still going to be on the team. (I would think)

I meant as a utility guy who can play multiple positions, I'd take Berti over Rojas in a second. I don't see Rojas as a starting SS on a decent team.

[fauowls44]

Interesting article on Fangraphs about Castellanos upcoming free agency. It puts his value at 3/$60 million...which I would probably consider doing if I were the Marlins.

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/no-nicho...lion-contract/

[Lee Stone]

For me, one Cooper is enough. Garrett will also make about $56 M less over the next three years.

[fish16]

castellanos at anything above 12-13 million for 3 or less years is an overpay. his bat isnt that special and he's a defensive liability. couple that with the ballpark and the surrounding lineup and id say no thank you and just spend on SP's and other lineup guys or, at worst, just invest heavily in the bullpen with our SP prospects and in the worst case we have some more potential flips in july for some more lewin diaz type guys.

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I mean phenomenal should be reserved for the Albies and J. Ramirez deals.

But that's fine. It's a million more than I'd expect, but who cares about that. Rojas has earned this and its a good look for them of rewarding their own.

Onto Anderson.

i would wonder what anderson is worth and whether it would even be worth extending him long term unless its a major discount. We've got him for 4 more years, next year still for the minimum under team control. Unless its like 6-7 years at a huge discount, whats the point? Just let him ride out the next few years. Plus he's already 26. The chances he becomes a late blooming star are slim to none, why not just ride out his next few years and maybe with 2 years left of team control see if its worth extending him? It feels like extending him now would just be extending him and spending more money for the sake of extending him and spending more money. Maybe at this time next year.

[lou]

castellanos at anything above 12-13 million for 3 or less years is an overpay. his bat isnt that special and he's a defensive liability. couple that with the ballpark and the surrounding lineup and id say no thank you and just spend on SP's and other lineup guys or, at worst, just invest heavily in the bullpen with our SP prospects and in the worst case we have some more potential flips in july for some more lewin diaz type guys.

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i would wonder what anderson is worth and whether it would even be worth extending him long term unless its a major discount. We've got him for 4 more years, next year still for the minimum under team control. Unless its like 6-7 years at a huge discount, whats the point? Just let him ride out the next few years. Plus he's already 26. The chances he becomes a late blooming star are slim to none, why not just ride out his next few years and maybe with 2 years left of team control see if its worth extending him? It feels like extending him now would just be extending him and spending more money for the sake of extending him and spending more money. Maybe at this time next year.

I definitely see potential major value in getting a below market Anderson for his age 31 and 32 seasons. Those are still prime years.

He probably can make $20-24 in arbitration depending on how many bombs are coming (I can see power growth). He has a full club controlled year next year, so he’s going to cost them low-mid 20s next 4 years which is amazing.

We keep talking about Castelllanos in the $15+ a year ballpark, and I think I’m comfortable with him upwards of $18. Ignoring FA prices are going to be more expensive in 4 years, I think it’s an easy add on of getting that deal to 5/$35 for Anderson and then adding in another club option on the back to make it say 6/$46. Basically, guarantee him a solid arbitration and get two cheap years on the back, only one guaranteed.

I view Anderson as very very safe given his defensive versatility (high floor) and upside wise, I can see power growth. Nothing like Yelich, but I can see 25+ HR and a peak year getting to 30 here and there. Also, the Marlins second best 3B in the organization is named “Jack Shit” and he’s not ready in 4 years.

I think Anderson would be hard pressed to turn down $35 when his guaranteed salary next year is under $700,000. Also they can front load this as an incentive to sign and to protect future payrolls. For instance

2020 - $5
2021 - $8
2022 - $10
2023 - $7
2024 - $3
2025 - $2 buyout OR $13 million

Their payroll is an asset right now. They should use it like this to create value down the line both with Anderson, and mitigating future payroll.

He’s honestly the only guy in the organization you do this with right now. We need to see 1-2 more years of all the pitchers and Alfaro and Diaz don’t make sense right now.

[fish16]

castellanos more than 15 million is absurd for an NL team. good luck with any NL team, let alone a rebuildingteam like us who would be counting on him being the major piece for the next year or 2, getting any value out of him with that kind of salary. Especially for a team like us that, if they sign him, would be counting on him to be THE guy. that would be a horrific signing. anything above 12-13 from an NL team would be a horrific signing. he has not only no value defensively, he has negative value defensively. He is a plain and simple DH only type guy for around 10-12 million a year for 3-4 years from an AL team. Especially for a team with one of the best farm systems in baseball.

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id do 35 million for 5 years for anderson though, obviously. maybe 6 for 42 or so. would be a good and safe deal for both sides.

[lou]

castellanos more than 15 million is absurd for an NL team. good luck with any NL team, let alone a rebuildingteam like us who would be counting on him being the major piece for the next year or 2, getting any value out of him with that kind of salary. Especially for a team like us that, if they sign him, would be counting on him to be THE guy. that would be a horrific signing. anything above 12-13 from an NL team would be a horrific signing. he has not only no value defensively, he has negative value defensively. He is a plain and simple DH only type guy for around 10-12 million a year for 3-4 years from an AL team. Especially for a team with one of the best farm systems in baseball.

We know what you think about modern free agency.

But more importantly, the more I think about this, the best possible internal move they can do is shift Anderson’s final arbitration year (2023) to earlier payroll years to be cheaper when you’re theoretically a contender.

They can “probably” wait a year to do it even if that’ll cost them a little more, but hes safe. Just do it now. Get the good culture press release from it and reward your own, etc.

I am all in on an Anderson front loaded buy out.

[fish16]

If it’s front loaded that’s something I can get behind on Anderson. That would make sense to me for the team and for Anderson. That’s actually an idea I’d love to see. That’s not only a great idea but something that would give me more confidence in a long term plan by this front office

[tjfla]

Berti's still going to be on the team. (I would think)

Berti is the UT guy next year with Rojas as SS. Riddle is ? and Jazz is in AAA. Once Jazz is up then Rojas goes to UT role. 2/10 million is a GREAT contract

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Interesting article on Fangraphs about Castellanos upcoming free agency. It puts his value at 3/$60 million...which I would probably consider doing if I were the Marlins.

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/no-nicho...lion-contract/

If we were an AL team I would pay him that but as NL team I top out at 3/45 for Castellanos. With Mattingly back it probably takes us out of Puig race and more likely to move Brinson. Its well known he hates Puig and is not a fan of Brinson either

Someone mentioned Nick Williams-I could see us trying to get him as the FO loves him. Tried to get him in JT deal and were hoping Philly would DFA him but never did

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I'm with you too. He makes some inexplicable moves and lineup decisions, and often.

Like I said above, I could've seen an "extension" of just a year - next year - and bring in a new guy after that, but 2+ seemed unnecessary.

They gave him the 2 years but he is on a short leash. Watch to see what coaches they keep around in the offseason(Hillman/Keith Johnson/Eric Duncan) as Mattingly could be replaced by any of them at any point in next 2 years. If team doesn't show improvement he could be replaced very easy