June Game Thread

[Nick]

Yelich goes yard. Not a good start for Caleb.

[Namaste]

We gon lose

[Nick]

Not good.

[Namaste]

Funniest part of this discussion is IF Miami doesn't sign any FA and has a payroll of 40 million then people will cry that they didn't spend 50 million BUT if they sign Didi and Paxton to deals and have an 80 million dollar payroll peoplewill cry that they overpaid

People? You mean like fish16 and maybe 38 other people on the planet?

[rmc523]

I get the werth comparison, but they are in a different category money wise. Also, given that they had just moved there a few years prior, they arent in the position we are in where it is completely unreasonable to expect fans to come out to our ballpark simply because we signed some free agents. How many times do we have to sign guys or make "go for it" moves in order to try to bring fans out only for it to remain the same. Marlins fans arent coming out because they spent money. they are only coming out if we win. If there was a chance that signing this guy all of a sudden brings out fans, and that in turn gives you more revenue and a higher payrol in future years, then id be fine with that, but unless the move is directly contributing to winning in the most direct way possible, this situation isnt at all comparable to Washington's at that time. Their payroll in the year prior to that was also just 2 million less (went from 66 million in 2010 to 68 in 2011) the next year when Werth was on the team, so im assuming they spent that money once a few high priced guys came off their books, not in order to bring out fans.

I'd also argue that the Jayson Werth deal was horrendous for them. He had 2 years out of the 7 in which he both stayed healthy and performed well. He didnt vault them into contention, Bryce Harper and Strasburg did, as did Scherzer.

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To add to what i said, the nationals were .500 in Werth's first year, and didnt start making the playoffs until 2012, which is not coincidentally the first year they had both Harper and Strasburg on the team and healthy. Id venture a guess that the nats could have produced much more value out of Werth's money by signing a collection of guys to reasonable deals that produce value relative to their salary rather than Werth who was only healthy and good for 2 out of his 7 years under that contract.

Right, but I'm not looking at it as a one or the other move (it's not JUST contributes toward winning, or JUST getting fans to show up). A signing like that would help both aspects. Again, I'm not advocating overpaying a guy that isn't worth it. And I'm not saying Werth was that guy. I'm just saying if the right guy is there (like Rendon), you do it - it'll help you win, AND will show the fan base you're going to sign people, AND would hopefully begin a rise in attendance because of all of the factors, not just one or the other.

You're using a payroll argument about theirs not changing with Werth with guys coming off the books, but after next year Chen is gone. You're doing your payroll "bump" (for a year before it would "equal" out without additional moves) a year before the books clean up because THAT guy is available then.

[Namaste]

We are hacking at everything

[lou]

What do you think he gets at 3 years then, lou?

First, Andrus has to OPT OUT of 3/$43 to test free agency. I didn't realize this earlier, but who the fuck thinks that happens to even make this a debate. If Andrus opts out, he is obviously looking for more money than this and not 2/$20-25 as fish16 floats. I'm sure he is looking at what DJ Lamhieu/Eduardo Escobar types got and not jazzed.

Second, let's do this the right way assuming he does irrationally opt out:

Boston - Xander
NYY - Gleyber
TB - Adames/Wander
Balt - They totally need a SS
Tor - Bichette(?)

Clev - Lindor
Minn - Polanco
CHW - Anderson
KC - Mondesi
Det - W. Castro (big breakout in AAA, they will give him a shot I believe so not in market)

Oak - Siemen/Mateo
Hou - Correa/Bregman/Diaz
Tex - Maybe Anderson Tejeda dissuades them from a longterm SS, but I lean no and they need one
LAA - Simmons, and he leaves in FA in a year but they have bigger problems for 2020
Sea - Crawford

ATL - Swanson
NYM - Rosario/Gimenez
Wash - Turner/Kieboom
Mia - They totally need a SS
Phi - Segura

ChC - Russell/Ademan/Short and they need to sign Baez/Rizzo/etc first so I dont see it
Pitt - C. Tucker, maybe they’d want to upgrade
STL - Dejong
Mil - Arcia/Dubon, they may want to upgrade
Cincy - Peraza, maybe they’d want to upgrade

Col - Story/Rodgers
LAD - Seager
SD - Tatis
Ari - Ahmez/Ketel/Escobar/Jazz, this is maybe upgrade
SF - Crawford and not spending to contend

Totally need SS - Baltimore, Miami, Texas
Could see upgrading - Cincy, Milwaukee
Less likely but maybe - Arizona, Pitt, Cubbies, Detroit, LAA, SF

Baltimore isn't doing shit.
I don't think Cincy or Milwaukee devote years to Andrus or Didi with some solid young guys and other problems on the team.
Texas has $70 million on the books -without- Andrus, Gallo, and Mazara. They have some money to spend for sure. Their SP also blows goats.
Other teams seem opportunistic signings if a guy gets cheap.

I don't think anyone is in a rush to give Didi or Andrus more than 3 years at all. Didi would probably be thrilled to get 3/$48 or 4/$60+.

Once Andrus opts in, Miami is likely bidding against themselves for Didi.

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Right, but I'm not looking at it as a one or the other move (it's not JUST contributes toward winning, or JUST getting fans to show up). A signing like that would help both aspects. Again, I'm not advocating overpaying a guy that isn't worth it. And I'm not saying Werth was that guy. I'm just saying if the right guy is there (like Rendon), you do it - it'll help you win, AND will show the fan base you're going to sign people, AND would hopefully begin a rise in attendance because of all of the factors, not just one or the other.

You're using a payroll argument about theirs not changing with Werth with guys coming off the books, but after next year Chen is gone. You're doing your payroll "bump" (for a year before it would "equal" out without additional moves) a year before the books clean up because THAT guy is available then.

I agree. You only overpay in this class for Rendon or Cole. A true star.

You can be -at value- for guys like Didi and Ozuna for 3-4 years.

[fish16]

Right, but I'm not looking at it as a one or the other move (it's not JUST contributes toward winning, or JUST getting fans to show up). A signing like that would help both aspects. Again, I'm not advocating overpaying a guy that isn't worth it. And I'm not saying Werth was that guy. I'm just saying if the right guy is there (like Rendon), you do it - it'll help you win, AND will show the fan base you're going to sign people, AND would hopefully begin a rise in attendance because of all of the factors, not just one or the other.

You're using a payroll argument about theirs not changing with Werth with guys coming off the books, but after next year Chen is gone. You're doing your payroll "bump" (for a year before it would "equal" out without additional moves) a year before the books clean up because THAT guy is available then.

That's fine. It depends on the guy for me. But signing an above average player for good to great player money for the sake of spending money is how awful teams are run.

[fish16]

i absolutely cringe when i see guerrero come into games. He's the most hittable 100+ mph fastball guy ive ever seen.

And conley is getting to the point where he isnt far behind on the cringe worthiness scale.

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well that should about do it. wanted the sweep but ill take a road series win in milwaukee. Desperately trying to sell Caleb in fantasy though. He's gotta get back in the zone he was in the first month and a half.

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did that hit andersons hand too? Or was he just trying to shake out his shoulder? weird that he was grabbing his hand after that. hope he's just bruised and that wasnt anything serious.

[Namaste]

Caleb Smith. I’m officially worried.

[Nick]

Caleb Smith. I’m officially worried.

Isn't this pretty much exactly how his season played out last year? Although he was a little better in April and May this year. I wonder about his health.

[fish16]

that 2-0 pitch was fucking outside. Why does baseball still have umps calling balls and strikes. its fucking absurd in 2019 when its so easy just to get every pitch right.

[Namaste]

Umpire fucked Castro out of a 3-0 count.

Still think it’s really weird the Brewers sell tickets for $6 on Mondays and the cheapest regularly available Marlins ticket is $10.

[fish16]

fucking ridiculous. absolutely inexcusable that baseball refuses to change for the better and modernize the game

[rmc523]

fucking ridiculous. absolutely inexcusable that baseball refuses to change for the better and modernize the game

What happened?