Juan Rodriguez's Top 50 Marlins of All Time

[Swifty]

how many years have marlins fans been saying that? "keep playing hermida, keep him, trade willingham, because hermida has potential, and josh has a fuck up back". Isnt 2009 suppose to be hermida's last year as a marlins to prove himself, and he hasnt. I rather keep a proven ML starter like ross, and cantu, then hermida's upside that we have been waiting to manifest for years.

I get why people want to trade ross and cantu, because there value is at the highest now. But given to choose bewteen those 3, herms would be my last option

If we're trading Ross and Cantu because their value is at their highest now, doesn't that then leave you with Hermida if you wanted it or not...

Just pointing out that you can't go ahead and say we have three players, we have to keep at least one, potentially two, and we have to trade these two because their value won't be higher and they're not part of the long-term plan, but I don't want the guy we're left with, go do something else.

And, just an FYI, I don't think anyone in the keep Hermida camp advocated trading Willingham to leave Hermida a roster spot.

[lou]

I don't know Lou, I'm not sure I want to keep Hermida at the expense of Ross or Cantu on the hopes Hermida "might" put it together.

Not to nitpick, but Hermida is currently 10 OPS points below Cantu, but Hermida has 19 OBP points on him so for all intensive purposes Hermida > Cantu right now. Ross is a bit different, but I'll always play the upside card. Hermida can get to an .850 OPS. Ross has no chance as a hack-attack consistent .800 OPS hitter.

I do hope we take a long-term view (something we've never done under Beinfest) and realize how downright stupid our 2012 team looks with Hermida in left, Maybin in center and Stanton in right, Coghlan and Logan in the infield and Cantu and Ross elsewhere.

It takes biting the bullet for a season, maybe a season and a half, but it's so worth it long term.

Cantu keeps 1B/3B warm for the last to arrive of Logan/Dominguez.
Cody keeps a corner warm for Stanton
Coghlan moves to the infield in 2010, be it at 3B or 2B
Then suddenly, Hermida gets a corner for 2010, likely gets left-field in 2011 ->

This team is set up so well for the short-term / long term handoffs it makes me nuts to think how we'll find a way to screw it up. My guess is we keep Coghlan in left and give 2B to Bonifacio.

Thats a real idealistic view if you want to think about Hermida 3 years down the road, but sure. Cantu would only be around for 2010, so it wouldn't be for whoever is last of Logan/Dominguez. It would be for 2010 and that's it. You could keep the two outfielders around until the Stanton/Cousins/Petersen/Raynor regime change takes place, but if you can get similar production for Carroll/Gload type veteran, why bother paying the money. That's the Marlins way.

And it's really easy to see how we screw it up like you said - Bonifacio at 2B. I am sure they give it to him because they are seeing Michael Bourn turn from a .588 OPS player into a really solid damn player this year (.292/.367/.411, 46 SB). And let's say you do that, wouldn't the obvious reaction be to keep Amezaga for a year to "mentor" EB, and to be able to cover 2B if EB is a total failure.

It all depends on the money. If Loria approves $45 million, I'd like to see them do this.

C John Baker $415,000
1B Gaby Sanchez $405,000
2B Chris Coghlan $405,000
3B Jorge Cantu $6,000,000
SS Hanley Ramirez $7,000,000
LF Jeremy Hermida $3,500,000
CF Cameron Maybin $405,000
RF Cody Ross $4,200,000
B Emilio Bonifacio $415,000
B Wes Helms $950,000
B Ronny Paulino $880,000
B Brett Carroll $415,000
B “Veteran Bat” $750,000

SP Josh Johnson $5,500,000
SP Ricky Nolasco $4,500,000
SP Andrew Miller $2,000,000
SP Chris Volstad $415,000
SP Anibal Sanchez $1,000,000
RP Leo Nunez $1,600,000
RP Matt Lindstrom $1,600,000
RP Reynel Pinto $850,000
RP Dan Meyer $415,000
RP Rick Vanden Hurk $415,000
RP Brian Sanches $415,000
RP Burke Badenhop $415,000

$44,865,000

Bats - Morrison, Petersen, Stanton, Cousins, Dominguez, Raynor
Arms - WEST, Tucker, Leroux, Wood, Parcell, Voss, Winters, Trahern, Ceda, Cishek, C. Martinez, etc

That is pretty damn loaded, and you probably add 2 significant players somewhere above from moving Uggla.

[wanks1212]

If the organization is willing to spend ~$6 mil on a corner infielder, I'd rather see them give that money to Nick Johnson (1/6 or, hell, 2/11 would be fine) and trade Cantu for a spec - even, like, a B- reliever spec.

Johnson comes with health questions, but he helps this team so much more than Cantu. And if Logan's really tearing up AAA in 2010, well, stick him in LF for a year if need be.

[lou]

If the organization is willing to spend ~$6 mil on a corner infielder, I'd rather see them give that money to Nick Johnson (1/6 or, hell, 2/11 would be fine) and trade Cantu for a spec - even, like, a B- reliever spec.

Johnson comes with health questions, but he helps this team so much more than Cantu. And if Logan's really tearing up AAA in 2010, well, stick him in LF for a year if need be.

Can Gaby Sanchez play an acceptable 3B? That's the main question. If he can, I agree with you.

[wanks1212]

I tend to believe that, defensively, Johnson at 1B and Gaby at 3B would collectively be no worse than Gaby at 1B and Cantu at 3B. But, based on their treatment of him this year, I doubt the organization likes Gaby enough to give him a starting position anywhere.

I almost wonder which INF is better when considering offense, defense, and baserunning:

1B: Johnson
2B: Boner (yeah, I know, ugh, but at 2B hopefully he's a plus defensively, and let's face it the organization may go this way eventually)
SS: Hanley
3B: Coghlan (note: pretend for a minute the FO would consider Coghlan at 3B)

OR

1B: Gaby
2B: Coghlan
SS: Hanley
3B: Cantu

INF #2 is probably a bit better offensively, just because Bonifacio's involved in the first option. But I do wonder whether INF #1 makes up the difference based on superior defense and baserunning.

[Swifty]

Gaby cannot play 3B. He is an absolute butcher there.

And this is coming from someone who thinks defense be damned, play at the most premium position your glove allows your bat to play.

Also, I think we know all we need to know about Gaby's long term role here.

[nny]

Have you actually seen Gaby play the position (serious question)?

Metrics say he'd actually be fine there

[Ramp]

Ya'll talk like Gaby will ever see 500 at bats with this team

[Swifty]

Have you actually seen Gaby play the position (serious question)?

Metrics say he'd actually be fine there

Yes, and one of my good friends from high school was his teammate at UM.

[nny]

UM != today

he also used to be a horrible fielding first baseman and how he's a plus fielding firstbaseman