What is the Appropriate Amount of Time for Marlins Fans to Vent?

[Beef]

We know what you're mad about (at least I do).

Can you now explain how I, or the other members of this alleged crew, are in favor of the trade, as you keep saying. Find one time where any one has done this. You've taken us from apologists to being in favor of the trade, by tomorrow we will have negotiated the trade with Toronto.


The point was you're doing the same thing.

I already won. He loves the new payroll.

[HUGG]

Well now what are we gonna talk about?

[Namaste]

Well now what are we gonna talk about?

Mark Sanchez?

[Mainge]

Mark Sanchez?

Can you now explain how I, or the other members of this alleged crew, are in favor of the trade, as you keep saying. Find one time where any one has done this. You've taken us from apologists to being in favor of the trade, by tomorrow we will have negotiated the trade with Toronto.

Daft?

[Beef]

We know what you're mad about (at least I do).

Can you now explain how I, or the other members of this alleged crew, are in favor of the trade, as you keep saying. Find one time where any one has done this. You've taken us from apologists to being in favor of the trade, by tomorrow we will have negotiated the trade with Toronto.


The point was you're doing the same thing.

To be fair to you, Mainge, Erick and Bobbob, he isn't doing the same thing. He keeps saying y'all liked the trade. You guys aren't saying he loved the slashing of payroll that he says you did. Ya know? See the difference? Anyway, I won.

What do you think kingzfan is doing right now?

[Erick]

You know what else makes zero sense?

Me saying 35 times that I'm pissed that we're back to pre-new ballpark spending yet we're STILL debating something. What are we debating?

Are we debating that I made a thread that said I was very pissed about defending the organization to friends? If so, I'm sorry I made it sound like that was the thing I was MOST pissed about.

One more time, IM MOST PISSED that after crying about no ballpark revenues being the reason for very low payroll for several years, payroll will seemingly be very low after the ballpark was built.

I lose, you guys win.

We're debating because we don't agree about certain things.

For example, you said the trade was awful and I don't think it was awful. That doesn't make me a front office apologist. Doesn't even make me someone who loves the trade. I just don't understand how the trade, itself, was awful.

We're also debating because of what you said. You began the thread talking about your friends and how you look bad now which is rather irrelevant. You've kinda changed since.

The reason why the your friends thing matters is because your friends sound like casual fans who would still laugh at you if the team re-invested. Like, say, if the Marlins decided to spend money on guys like Stephen Drew, one of the FA starters available, etc., your friends would probably be like "Who? Who cares? Dude, we had Jose Reyes, he was awesome. I don't know who Stephen Drew and Yunel Escobar are even though they've been in the big leagues for years. No one cares about those guys. Still cheap front office!"

[Namaste]

We're debating because we don't agree about certain things.

For example, you said the trade was awful and I don't think it was awful. That doesn't make me a front office apologist. Doesn't even make me someone who loves the trade. I just don't understand how the trade, itself, was awful.

We're also debating because of what you said. You began the thread talking about your friends and how you look bad now which is rather irrelevant. You've kinda changed since.

The reason why the your friends thing matters is because your friends sound like casual fans who would still laugh at you if the team re-invested. Like, say, if the Marlins decided to spend money on guys like Stephen Drew, one of the FA starters available, etc., your friends would probably be like "Who? Who cares? Dude, we had Jose Reyes, he was awesome. I don't know who Stephen Drew and Yunel Escobar are even though they've been in the big leagues for years. No one cares about those guys. Still cheap front office!"

You're the same person who has said on more than one occassion that had "Reyes not been in the trade" that it was a good trade.

You and I need to learn to be more like Beef: Rarely take a stance on anything but always be quick to point out inconsistencies in other people's posts.

[Beef]

Get on the Beefboard

[Bobbob1313]

So, he's just going to ignore the "Loria lover" questions, right?

[Beef]

I'm gonna point out an inconsistency.

You're the same person who has said on more than one occassion that had "Reyes not been in the trade" that it was a good trade.

So then he didn't say it was a good trade. He just said it wasn't awful.

[Erick]

You're the same person who has said on more than one occassion that had "Reyes not been in the trade" that it was a good trade.

You and I need to learn to be more like Beef: Rarely take a stance on anything but always be quick to point out inconsistencies in other people's posts.

Right. That doesn't mean it's awful though. I don't see the inconsistency there. I've consistently said it wasn't awful and stated reasons as to why it wasn't awful. To which you responded with something along the lines of "because overpayments never happen in sports." As if that's a good reason to keep bad contracts on the team.

Forget the payroll, feelings, etc. and just look at the trade, itself. The 5 players we gave away, the 7 players we received. Apply some context to the deal (salaries). "Awful" implies (to me, anyway) that the deal is lopsided. I really don't think it is.

You, on the other hand, seem to believe otherwise based on your last post in the 1st page and have proceeded to basically ignore every post defending this stance on the deal. Like, I think it's valid to say that Mark Buehrle was a league average pitcher last year, not worth near ace money for the next 3 years. I think it's fair to say that Jose Reyes (while I think he's good) is definitely not going to be worth 22 million per year, ages 32-35, especially considering the strength of his game is speed.

You've ignored this and then said stuff like all 5 of us represent 1/3 of the population that thinks this trade is good. Or something.

That's the reason why the thread is now six pages long. Not to mention that you started it for the sake of discussion, as well...

[Jay]

You're forgetting the part where Toronto made the trade to get better today and didn't care about the payroll consequences. The trade was lopsided just because the blue jays took on salary doesn't mean they don't give up anything with potential. I'm not pissed they traded these players. I'm not even mad that the payroll will not resemble that of a major league team. I'm pissed that they traded the players and got back nothing of quality and did not even get good quantity for what they gave up.

[Namaste]

So, he's just going to ignore the "Loria lover" questions, right?

Bob, don't talk to me like I'm not standing in the room.


I was definitely doing a thing with the Loria Lover stuff and if I offended anyone I apologize. But I was perceiving a sort of "no big deal" reaction about recent events. If my perception was incorrect then, again, I am sorry for that.
--------------------

I'm pissed that they traded the players and got back nothing of quality and did not even get good quantity for what they gave up.

Ruh-roh

[Beef]

I'll do it, Daft.

jay576 doesn't know that we got back nothing of quality.

Don't even know what he's doing with the good quantity thing.

Also, can we not forget that while we gave up 5 players, Bonifacio is a nice bench player, almost everyone was of the opinion that Buck was the worst thing ever, JJ was often hurt and seldom (lately) as good as we thought he was capable of and Buehrle shortens game times.

The players won't all be awesome, because they're not all that good but a couple are promising and others may be serviceable major leaguers. It's the nature of a trade for prospects.

They'll be interesting to watch until we realize they all suck.

[Erick]

You're forgetting the part where Toronto made the trade to get better today and didn't care about the payroll consequences. The trade was lopsided just because the blue jays took on salary doesn't mean they don't give up anything with potential. I'm not pissed they traded these players. I'm not even mad that the payroll will not resemble that of a major league team. I'm pissed that they traded the players and got back nothing of quality and did not even get good quantity for what they gave up.

I'm not forgetting what Toronto did; I just think what Toronto is doing is irrelevant. The situations are completely different. Toronto is in better position to win now because they had a better core than the Marlins before the trade was even made. That's probably why they're taking the chance. Anthopolous is a good GM and put his team in this position by not giving out any silly contracts beforehand.

The "nothing of quality" part is very debatable. You don't know that. Can we at least wait a year or two before coming to that conclusion?