2023-2024 Offseason Thread

[fish16]

I agree, I really think the rotation the way it's currently looking, will be great at the beginning, but will be a mess by the time we get to August/September.

just like it was last year. they put a ton of eggs in the cueto basket, and that basket was filled with shit. It will be even worse with sandy out. The rotation on paper looks really fucking good, but unless they find some rays magic to get some innings eaten in a quality manner, we will have issues down the stretch.

Plus, i keep hearing some positive but also some uncertainty with Braxton Garrett's shoulder. If he goes down, that is an enormous hole on top of sandy. We desperately need Edward Cabrera to take a major step forward with the control. Eury will be great with innings limits, Luzardo as long as he is healthy will be fine, Garrett going down creates huge issues.

[Todd]

I've heard the Sox and Cleveland are open to trading Cease and Bieber.

[Nick]

With Max Meyer, I think they need to be careful with him, but also do whatever they can to make him ready to pitch high leverage innings in August and September. If they can find away to make Puk a long-man that gives you 7 innings a week, that would be huge as well, as far as limiting the innings of Eury, Cabrera, Rogers.

[fish16]

With Max Meyer, I think they need to be careful with him, but also do whatever they can to make him ready to pitch high leverage innings in August and September. If they can find away to make Puk a long-man that gives you 7 innings a week, that would be huge as well, as far as limiting the innings of Eury, Cabrera, Rogers.

The good news about the innings limits is that it seems like we do have more options and better SP depth this year. It's a lot of guys with legitimate questions marks, but it's at least still a lot of guys. Not the hoeings and smeltzers of the world. Outside the top 4, we're stretching out Meyer, Puk, Rogers, Soriano, Weathers, Sixto, Gutierrez. Obviously you need health and performance, but that is better than the 26 starts we gave Cueto, Okert, Barnes, Hoeing, Chargois, Smeltzer, Could use 1 more guy though, but im not sure how you tow the line because you dont technically need a full 5th starter, but they could really use another reliable guy to help in case of injuries. Lorenzon really seems like a good option because he can easily become one of our best righty relievers but also stretch out as a starter if needed.

[Nick]

Unless Garcia just tears it up in Spring, the man has to go. Giving his spot to an Edwards or Johnston would make this team so much better, you could consistently slot Bell at DH making the defense much better. I'm over the fucking anchor that is him and his contract.

[lou]

just like it was last year. they put a ton of eggs in the cueto basket, and that basket was filled with shit. It will be even worse with sandy out. The rotation on paper looks really fucking good, but unless they find some rays magic to get some innings eaten in a quality manner, we will have issues down the stretch.

Plus, i keep hearing some positive but also some uncertainty with Braxton Garrett's shoulder. If he goes down, that is an enormous hole on top of sandy. We desperately need Edward Cabrera to take a major step forward with the control. Eury will be great with innings limits, Luzardo as long as he is healthy will be fine, Garrett going down creates huge issues.

If Garret goes down they are really fucked.

Assuming he's fine though, if they can turn Chiniros, Guitterez, Faucher, McCaughan, Tyler, Hoeing, Monteverde, etc. into 125+ innings, ala Thompson 2021 out of nowhere performance, they probably have enough innings capacity for the year. But I think the Lorenzen failsafe is a better idea than Rays magic for sure. I'd pick that move over any bat ultimately. It's likely most impactful at this stage of the offseason.

[lou]

I've heard the Sox and Cleveland are open to trading Cease and Bieber.

I don't think the Marlins need a name brand here (although would be nice), it's a Lorenzen type to me. Thirty 4+ inning bursts two times through the lineup. Live and die with Luzardo, Garrett, Eury, and pray for the Cabrera break out, with the lefty relievers and eventually Meyer and a healty Bender forming a killer bullpen. That bullpen could be nasty FAST as we hope for 1 run magic again.

Hopefully Papa Bruce surprises us with Lorenzen and M. Taylor/Duvall/Pham and DFA's Garcia to make that happen (they could just option Brazoban/Soriano to AAA to make room for Lorenzen so no big deal). That sets up Edwards in AAA which will annoy some of us, but he'll be up a lot as the 11 other non catcher bats won't all be healthy at all times. The Marlins 12th and 13th non catcher bats last year combined for 450 PA (this was also over 400 PA in 2022), so I do think Edwards could absorb most of that playing time ultimately so this wouldn't be a big deal. It would be a 350 PA floor absent incredible health for the team more than likely, etc.

[lou]

Unless Garcia just tears it up in Spring, the man has to go. Giving his spot to an Edwards or Johnston would make this team so much better, you could consistently slot Bell at DH making the defense much better. I'm over the fucking anchor that is him and his contract.

I agree, get him out of here. If he has an Aaron Hicks/Baltimore resurgence elsewhere, so be it. I'd prefer a different veteran OF of course, but if this opens it up for Edwards as the "worst case scenario," bet the upside/break out and hopefully Edwards can handle LF/CF versus lefties.

[rmc523]

I agree, I really think the rotation the way it's currently looking, will be great at the beginning, but will be a mess by the time we get to August/September.

Yeah they always need an innings eating vet, and never seem to get it (or when they do, the guy implodes)….this year is no different, IMO, especially with Sandy out.
too many variables with too many younger guys with innings limits, injury history, potential performance/learning curve issues not to sign someone to come in and provide “ok” innings.

[fish16]

i think we're good from a hitting perspective in terms of adding more guys. Obviously our offense could be better, but i'd like to see what the current crop can bring before i go sign a veteran to be average and send guys who have nothing left to prove in the minors back down to the minors again. Trade Berti for an arm, get Mancini and Garcia out of here, and just see what Gordon, Edwards, Johnston, and maybe Brujan/Myers can do. Lets see some youth get some opportunities.

[Todd]

I don't think the Marlins need a name brand here (although would be nice), it's a Lorenzen type to me. Thirty 4+ inning bursts two times through the lineup. Live and die with Luzardo, Garrett, Eury, and pray for the Cabrera break out, with the lefty relievers and eventually Meyer and a healty Bender forming a killer bullpen. That bullpen could be nasty FAST as we hope for 1 run magic again.

Hopefully Papa Bruce surprises us with Lorenzen and M. Taylor/Duvall/Pham and DFA's Garcia to make that happen (they could just option Brazoban/Soriano to AAA to make room for Lorenzen so no big deal). That sets up Edwards in AAA which will annoy some of us, but he'll be up a lot as the 11 other non catcher bats won't all be healthy at all times. The Marlins 12th and 13th non catcher bats last year combined for 450 PA (this was also over 400 PA in 2022), so I do think Edwards could absorb most of that playing time ultimately so this wouldn't be a big deal. It would be a 350 PA floor absent incredible health for the team more than likely, etc.

I was joking.

Lorenzens peripherals are also not good. He was mediocre last year and that was with a career best walk rate out of nowhere.

No issues with him on a cheap incentive laden deal but he can't be counted on.

[Nick]

I’ve seen Tristan Gray hit 2 absolute bombs this spring. This one, off our old friend Jorge Lopez.

[lou]

I was joking.

Lorenzens peripherals are also not good. He was mediocre last year and that was with a career best walk rate out of nowhere.

No issues with him on a cheap incentive laden deal but he can't be counted on.

Don't disagree with you, and that would be the idea. He is very good 1st time through the order (3.42 era) and then falls apart (2nd time, 4.94, and is ironically better 3rd time but that's a blip more than likely). I think you can get 120+ innings out of him at a low 4 era, which is very solid IMO. He'd be a perfect combo 5th SP with someone like Rogers and treat them each as 3-4+ inning guys and all of a sudden that's 7 innings as a floor with 2 arms. Really mess with teams and open with Chargois and then go Rogers then Lorenzen. That's easily bridging to Nardi or Scott the games you need them, or just letting Lorenzen close it out if there is a cushion or garbage time.

Something like that would work. I suppose it's a question of do they think Chiniros, McCaughan, Faucher, Hoeing, etc. can do that just as well as the more expensive option in Lorenzen. I'd take the bodies personally. They need bodies to raise the team floor production. Lorenzen can also pinch run and be a desperation pinch hitter if the rules would allow such usage in a given circumstance. Maybe that's valuable 5 times out of the year.

[lou]

It's Clevinger too who is out there and he's probably cheaper than Lorenzen. The underlying overall stats are very ugly (xFIP 5.15), but then:

1st time through: .232/.310/.397, 52K in 53.1 IP, 3.71 ERA

2nd time through: .291/.348/.460, 36K in 46.1 IP, 3.69 ERA


This dude got lucky AF 2nd time through the lineup last year. Sign me up for some mix/matching with these "bad SP" turning into "positive bulk RP." I think you're getting 100-120 positive innings out of someone like Lorenzen or Clevinger and you're telling them, it's max effort starting inning 3 until we pull you. Of course, they have to be on board for this and not be arrogant they are 32 start / 180 IP guys, but that kind of guy would be great. And I imagine they know who is out here who could maybe do this more than me as these two are just some bigger names. Maybe one of those low-end guys like Faucher ends up doing this pretty OK. The Rays seem to pull this shit all the time so we can hope.

[lou]

Also this one is wild

Manager Skip Schumaker and pitching coach Mel Stottlemyre Jr. believe [Josh Simpson] could be this season's breakout reliever like Andrew Nardi was in 2023. Simpson, who has yet to make his MLB debut, needs to trust his fastball, which would complement his 60-grade curveball (on the 20-80 scale). With A.J. Puk building to be a starter and Steven Okert traded to Minnesota, there's an opening for another southpaw in the bullpen. https://www.mlb.com/marlins/news/dar...ter-candidates

Not sure I believe this one with a guy who walked 6+ per 9 in AAA last year, but quite a mention for a guy all of us would readily kick off the 40 man. That would be something if they develop another good young lefty. He's got 2 options to cool. Stop walking people.