Season Super Game Thread

[Nick]

It just proves the point that keeping the talent you have is vital to the success of a franchise, it's something we've never been able to do and thus why we haven't had much success and virtually no amount of continued success.

[Namaste]

With an .807 OPS last season, Yelich ranked 64th among MLB regulars. His performance had dropped off a little from 2016. No one could have foreseen a power surge or a .320 BA. Attempting to upgrade the overall roster was a good move.

2016 WAR 5.5

2017 WAR 4.6


There was no reason to trade Yelich.

[lou]

With an .807 OPS last season, Yelich ranked 64th among MLB regulars. His performance had dropped off a little from 2016. No one could have foreseen a power surge or a .320 BA. Attempting to upgrade the overall roster was a good move.

That's bullshit. A ton of people here and elsewhere were expecting a power surge. It's natural for big dudes (6'3), with sweet mechanical swings, with abnormal groundball rates, at very young ages (he became a full time regular at 22 - which for the millionth time is a big deal in terms of player development and projection), will develop more power as they reach their prime. Yelich has hit 18 more XBH this year - some likely due to park factors alone. So he's hitting an extra XBH just under once a week. That's the difference. That's not an unreasonable surge in production. That's a nominal amount of less groundballs (less than 4%). This is not unexpected at all.

There is a reason I (and many others) was pissed about Yelich being moved, but not Stanton, Gordon, and Ozuna. This is it. They had him for 5 years.

Christian Yelich cf - 18:$7M, 19:$9.75M, 20:$12.5M, 21:$14M, 22:$15M club option ($1.25M buyout)

That fits into a new contending window in 2020-2022 to have an ALPHA player in his prime, for cheap. This is one of the best contracts in baseball.

It'll be OK if Brinson, Diaz, Monte, and Yamamoto get to a combined 25-30 WAR over their club controlled years, that is the break even to me, but that's a big big big gamble compared to a known quantity. Yes, it's always better to upgrade the roster in any way, but this is a huge gamble because he didn't only have 2 years of control like Ozuna, or $200 million more on the deal like Stanton, or at the wrong side of 30 and dependent on speed player in Gordon (with a bigger contract).

There is no hindsight bias here. We can hope for the best with the Milwaukee kids, but this one smelled like shit from day one if you had a clue.

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2016 WAR 5.5

2017 WAR 4.6


There was no reason to trade Yelich.

None based on the volatility of the Milwaukee prospects. It still may work out, but that still doesn't make it smart because gambling 2 of 3 guys hit their 80th percentile scouting projection is tough.

The best argument for trading Yelich was, the organization thought he was going to have a bad attitude and be a cancer to the locker room. There was a report about that. No on the field argument works.

[rmc523]

Victor Victor Mesa, Victor Mesa, Jr, and Sandy Gaston are set to have a showcase/workout at Marlins Park next week. I wonder if it's just a geographical thing or if it hints at a connection to us......either way, hopefully we can impress them with the ballpark facilities/amenities to help sway them our way.

[tjfla]

Victor Victor Mesa, Victor Mesa, Jr, and Sandy Gaston are set to have a showcase/workout at Marlins Park next week. I wonder if it's just a geographical thing or if it hints at a connection to us......either way, hopefully we can impress them with the ballpark facilities/amenities to help sway them our way.

Geography thing. All 3 live and train in Miami

Gaston wants to sign with Miami but for the price they agreed to before the failed test while Miami is trying to get VV first. If they can't get VV,wouldnt be surprised to see them turn attention to Mesa Jr and Gaston

If we miss on VV I could see Mesa Jr for 2 million and Gaston for 2 million but #1 is try to sign VV and go from there

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Gallen will be better than Richards? It's fine to think it, but care to explain? A .281 BAA and a 1.47 WHIP alone seem like disqualifiers. Even Neidert will be hard-pressed to match Trevor's MilB numbers. Richards had six starts for the Baby Cakes this season, each and every one a quality start (at least six innings and two ER or less). Gallen had 11 of those in 25 starts.

Guzman is ML ready? Jorge Guzman? His 4+ ERA at Jupiter would likely be at least a run higher if he wasn't in the Florida State League. He has a long, long way to go. Like Alcantara, his hype was tied to velocity only. At some point they have to learn how to pitch.

On Yelich. I don't think anyone thought MILW was getting the best of the deal at the time. Few thought Brinson, Harrison, and Diaz would all be as shaky as they showed this season. Personally, I liked the trade a lot. Yelich was a bland face in Miami. Runners took advantage of his noodle arm and slow release. I thought his number should have had three digits: 463. Seemed like every time he came to bat with a runner on first he hit into a 4-6-3 DP. I'm happy for him ... but couldn't care less that he's gone. Jordan Yamamoto is looking great and will be pitching in the AFL in October.

Yamamoto and Guzman are NOT ML Ready. I am saying when they are ready they will likely be ML RP and not SP but could still change if they show stuff next year.

I still like the trade too. Would like to see more from guys we got but we likely got a ML Starter at 2B,LF,CF and RP in 2020 for 1 ML Player. Its not like we traded Yelich for 4 guys who will never make it past AA like Miggy trade

[Nick]

Geography thing. All 3 live and train in Miami

Gaston wants to sign with Miami but for the price they agreed to before the failed test while Miami is trying to get VV first. If they can't get VV,wouldnt be surprised to see them turn attention to Mesa Jr and Gaston

If we miss on VV I could see Mesa Jr for 2 million and Gaston for 2 million but #1 is try to sign VV and go from there

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Yamamoto and Guzman are NOT ML Ready. I am saying when they are ready they will likely be ML RP and not SP but could still change if they show stuff next year.

I still like the trade too. Would like to see more from guys we got but we likely got a ML Starter at 2B,LF,CF and RP in 2020 for 1 ML Player. Its not like we traded Yelich for 4 guys who will never make it past AA like Miggy trade

???

[Namaste]

lol

[tjfla]

???

Andrew Miller, Dallas Trahern, Eulogio De La Cruz and Burke Badenhop, outfielder Cameron Maybin, and catcher Mike Rabelo.

Miller,Maybin and Badenhop were only real ML guys and Miller didn't do anything with us

[Namaste]

Andrew Miller, Dallas Trahern, Eulogio De La Cruz and Burke Badenhop, outfielder Cameron Maybin, and catcher Mike Rabelo.

Miller,Maybin and Badenhop were only real ML guys and Miller didn't do anything with us

But you realize what your first post said though, right?

Andrew Miller became a dominant closer. It doesn’t matter that he did it after the Marlins traded him. And Maybin became a regular starter.

[Nick]

Andrew Miller, Dallas Trahern, Eulogio De La Cruz and Burke Badenhop, outfielder Cameron Maybin, and catcher Mike Rabelo.

Miller,Maybin and Badenhop were only real ML guys and Miller didn't do anything with us

literally all of those players made it past AA. I'm not saying it wasn't a bad trade, but why would you word it that way?

[fish16]

So the last game in pittsburgh is cancelled even if it has draft implications?

[Madman81]

So the last game in pittsburgh is cancelled even if it has draft implications?

and 100 loss ramifications. bummer.

[Lee Stone]

In a rough September, starting pitching and Peter O'Brien have been bright spots. O'Brien may never make it, but by being the team's most productive hitter in September, he hasn't hurt his case.

[fish16]

Jose Urena isnt the most popular guy in the fanbase, but he just had 2 very solid seasons in a row and has 3 years left of team control. Will never be an ace but there is no reason to trade him this offseason. Chen and Straily are the guys who should be moved from the rotation if we want to make room for some young guys, with Straily being the only one who could be traded. I think a 2020 rotation of Urena, Neidert, Alcantara, Lopez, and a 5th guy between Gallen, Guzman, Yamamoto, Richards, etc. is very solid, cheap, and young. Our SP looks really solid moving forward. The bats in the system are far behind as of right now, but adding Victor Victor and a bat at #3 or #4 next year would go a long way towards rebuilding our position players.

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In a rough September, starting pitching and Peter O'Brien have been bright spots. O'Brien may never make it, but by being the team's most productive hitter in September, he hasn't hurt his case.

He's earned himself a chance in april for sure. Hopefully he can become a high K but big power bat for us moving forward, but i wouldnt hold my breath. He does have a solid track record in the minors though so maybe he could become a late bloomer for us. Id give him a look at 1b for next year.

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Frisaro generally sucks but FWIW, he says he gets the sense that Victor Victor and his brother are a package deal and that although we might havethe 2nd most money we might be the most natural fit, and the Orioles have a front office shakeup going on so that could play a role.

I really think we end up with him

[rmc523]

Jose Urena isnt the most popular guy in the fanbase, but he just had 2 very solid seasons in a row and has 3 years left of team control. Will never be an ace but there is no reason to trade him this offseason. Chen and Straily are the guys who should be moved from the rotation if we want to make room for some young guys, with Straily being the only one who could be traded. I think a 2020 rotation of Urena, Neidert, Alcantara, Lopez, and a 5th guy between Gallen, Guzman, Yamamoto, Richards, etc. is very solid, cheap, and young. Our SP looks really solid moving forward. The bats in the system are far behind as of right now, but adding Victor Victor and a bat at #3 or #4 next year would go a long way towards rebuilding our position players.

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He's earned himself a chance in april for sure. Hopefully he can become a high K but big power bat for us moving forward, but i wouldnt hold my breath. He does have a solid track record in the minors though so maybe he could become a late bloomer for us. Id give him a look at 1b for next year.

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Frisaro generally sucks but FWIW, he says he gets the sense that Victor Victor and his brother are a package deal and that although we might havethe 2nd most money we might be the most natural fit, and the Orioles have a front office shakeup going on so that could play a role.

I really think we end up with him

Yeah from what I read, Frisaro said we're trying to pitch to him that we're "home" for him.