2023 Game Thread

[fish16]

how can kim and skip just sit there and watch this season fall apart and make 0 changes? Send fortes down, just try out allen. Bring Edwards up, DFA wendle. Hell, at this point even see what johnston has. How can you sit there and make no roster changes? And how can skip just keep trotting the same lineup out there night after night? Mix things up a little, just change even for the sake of change would do some good right now. Stop hitting soler in the 2 spot, stop hitting DLC in the 4 spot. Mix up the lineup a little. Hell, even if you want to put jazz back in the leadoff spot and arraez back in the 3 spot, just do it. What's going on right now clearly isnt working.

[Lee Stone]

The concept of batting a low on base percentage guy who can't run in the two hole has always mystified me. Arraez in the leadoff spot is also off. He's a two, or better yet, a three hitter who will knock in runs.

[Nick]

The concept of batting a low on base percentage guy who can't run in the two hole has always mystified me. Arraez in the leadoff spot is also off. He's a two, or better yet, a three hitter who will knock in runs.

I know it's a lost art at this point, but Arraez would be perfect for executing the hit and run. I really think that could be a weapon if Edwards ever hits in front of him. Keep Arraez out of double plays too.

[rmc523]

It seems like everything that went right in the first half is no going completely wrong.

It also seems like Skip has transformed from a manager that was pushing all the right buttons, to now pushing all the wrong buttons - he'll leave guys out there to dry when they don't have it, and pull guys that are cruising. He's now pulling a Don and pitching the "lesser" pitchers in games we're ahead, and not using the good ones when we're leading.

Couple that with the FO suddenly reluctant to make any changes and it's not a good combo all around.

While obviously the Eury move isn't directly applicable to all aspects of team performance, it definitely seems like the wheels fell off when he was sent down - it affected morale.......couple that with us going to bullpen games several rotations in a row, which has the double affect of putting us behind the 8 ball in that game, plus taxing the bullpen for the other games......Kim not getting another starter at the deadline is showing its affects.

Swapping out for the younger guys can't hurt at this point - not like we can do much worse than we've been doing.

[fish16]

is there a website to figure out the percentage of our homers that are solo shots, 2 run, 3 run, and grand slams? It seems like every single homer is either a solo shot or 2 run homer. we never can get the huge hit with multiple guys on base. couple that with the fact that we dont hit a ton of home runs to begin with, and it seems like a bad recipe to consistently score a lot of runs on top of having 2 automatic outs in the lineup every game that wendle plays.

[Erick]

The concept of batting a low on base percentage guy who can't run in the two hole has always mystified me. Arraez in the leadoff spot is also off. He's a two, or better yet, a three hitter who will knock in runs.

Arraez is a leadoff hitter, the best thing he does better than just about anyone is get on base lol.

Put him in the two or three hole and he’d just hit into more double plays like he did last night.

What a weird thing to complain about.

[AdamRavs]

Skip seems to be more concerned with the lefty righty in the line up thing. Arraez leading off is fine. But putting Soler behind him is insane and just leads to the double plays more often than not. Let Jazz hit 3rd. Bring up Edwards put him behind Arraez.

But of course we will put Edwards 9th. With Wendle 7th and Fotes 8th.

[lou]

After coming in last in the first half the season, the Jumbo Shrimp are just a couple games out of first in the second half. Pensacola already earned a first half title so both teams have a shot at reaching the playoffs! See, there is some success out there in Marlin Land. P/S both Beloit and Jupiter are poor this season.

If you told us preseason the Marlins would be 1.5 back of the WC August 8th with Sandy and Jazz not doing much this year, I think we would all take it. The losing streak is just getting to "Marlin Land" unfortunately. It's why for 2 months in late May to early July I was saying trade now trade now trade now. They should have "overpaid" similar to the Rangers with Chapman-Ragans to get a guy earlier and maybe they would have won a few more games. Plenty of options with Colorado and Washington both being out of it and needing pitching, but I digress. Ultimately, this year has been a huge success just over shadowed by how unbelievably bad they have been since the break (as well as overshadowed by the real problem here - no Correa/Swanson and Nimmo signings as they should have signed both).

But if we want some good news

C - Banfield is emerging as a potential legitimate backup option
1B/DH - Johnston may be turning into a player + they got Bell and Burger + Berry showing signs of life
2B - Arraez has been as advertised and Edwards is emerging as a player
SS - Amaya isn't doing bad even if not projecting as a future starter. He's going to play a lot of games for years probably
3B - Burger is better than Segura
CF - Jazz's switch works defensively, Mesa Jr. showing a little something
OF - Sanchez has turned it up a bit, DLC can hit a little even if defense cratered, Soler having a tremendous year
SP - Luzardo has turned into an ace, Eury looks fantastic
RP - Scott and Nardi have looked awesome, generally the pen looks like it is deep with all the names even if lacking a longterm stud

The team looks good for the long haul, they need to get those final 3-4 pieces in the offseason (C, SS, bat upgrade, veteran arm). And hopefully they can hold their own with the August gauntlet and then make up ground with the Mets, Pirates, and Nationals who they have a lot of games against coming up. They need to play close to .500 the rest of the month and they'll have a real shot.

[lou]

how can kim and skip just sit there and watch this season fall apart and make 0 changes? Send fortes down, just try out allen. Bring Edwards up, DFA wendle. Hell, at this point even see what johnston has. How can you sit there and make no roster changes? And how can skip just keep trotting the same lineup out there night after night? Mix things up a little, just change even for the sake of change would do some good right now. Stop hitting soler in the 2 spot, stop hitting DLC in the 4 spot. Mix up the lineup a little. Hell, even if you want to put jazz back in the leadoff spot and arraez back in the 3 spot, just do it. What's going on right now clearly isnt working.

Yea some of that may be a bit too aggressive (Allen, Johnston), but I am all-in on Edwards and Amaya being called up. DFA Wendle and Yuli. Take a swing.

It would look like this I think:

vs RHP

1B/2B Arraez
2B/3B Edwards
CF Jazz
DH/1B/LF Bell/Soler
RF Sanchez
LF/3B Soler/Burger
3B/LF Burger/DLC
SS Berti
C Catcher

B - Catcher, Amaya, Garcia, Floating maintenance days for Bell/Soler/Burger/DLC, one is on the bench. Positional alignment easily shifts with Arraez/Edwards moving to whoever is benched to cover 1B or 3B.

vs LHP

CF/2B Edwards/Berti
2B/1B Arraez/Berti
DH/LF Soler
1B/DH Bell
LF/CF DLC
3B Burger
RF Garcia
SS Amaya
C Fortes

B - Stallings, Jazz, Sanchez, Floating maintenance days for Edwards/Arraez/Berti, one is on the bench and this is mostly Edwards/Berti as Arraez just has to play consistently.


Garcia is really not being used here but I imagine they won't cut ship on him payroll wise. They can call up two more guys - I imagine Dane and Hampson - for September call ups so that's just not enough Garcia time here to impact the bottom line.

[lou]

It seems like everything that went right in the first half is no going completely wrong.

It also seems like Skip has transformed from a manager that was pushing all the right buttons, to now pushing all the wrong buttons - he'll leave guys out there to dry when they don't have it, and pull guys that are cruising. He's now pulling a Don and pitching the "lesser" pitchers in games we're ahead, and not using the good ones when we're leading.

Couple that with the FO suddenly reluctant to make any changes and it's not a good combo all around.

While obviously the Eury move isn't directly applicable to all aspects of team performance, it definitely seems like the wheels fell off when he was sent down - it affected morale.......couple that with us going to bullpen games several rotations in a row, which has the double affect of putting us behind the 8 ball in that game, plus taxing the bullpen for the other games......Kim not getting another starter at the deadline is showing its affects.

Swapping out for the younger guys can't hurt at this point - not like we can do much worse than we've been doing.

I agree with the puzzling RP + Weathers usage, but the idea team morale is impacted by Eury being sent down when he will pitch the same amount of innings at the MLB level, or Kim not deciding to get a SP when Cueto has thrown 19 innings at a 3.85 era immediately, is nothing more than over thinking a real rough patch. They were never a good offensive team. They had unbelievable 1 run luck the first half of the year. They are still the best 1 run team in the league (24-10). They were never a 14 games above .500 team. They were getting lucky and the luck has run out + now they have the August schedule we have all pointed out since May.

They have to play .600 ball here on out to probably make the playoffs so I think we all agree call up Edwards and probably Amaya. But this is micro-analyzing a 5-17 stretch. They weren't as good as the first half. They aren't as bad as the second half so far. Baseball always regresses to the mean, and it's happening violently. That's all that is happening here. They are going to win some games but I think we know, they will be 3-4 games short at the end if not a few more.

[Nick]

I agree with the puzzling RP + Weathers usage, but the idea team morale is impacted by Eury being sent down when he will pitch the same amount of innings at the MLB level, or Kim not deciding to get a SP when Cueto has thrown 19 innings at a 3.85 era immediately, is nothing more than over thinking a real rough patch. They were never a good offensive team. They had unbelievable 1 run luck the first half of the year. They are still the best 1 run team in the league (24-10). They were never a 14 games above .500 team. They were getting lucky and the luck has run out + now they have the August schedule we have all pointed out since May.

They have to play .600 ball here on out to probably make the playoffs so I think we all agree call up Edwards and probably Amaya. But this is micro-analyzing a 5-17 stretch. They weren't as good as the first half. They aren't as bad as the second half so far. Baseball always regresses to the mean, and it's happening violently. That's all that is happening here. They are going to win some games but I think we know, they will be 3-4 games short at the end if not a few more.

Do you really think his MLB teammates are aware of a potential pitch limit that Eury has? They just know one of their best pitchers got sent down for a month. (They probably know about the monetary reasons, I know if I were an MLB player I would)

Ultimately I don't completely buy that this killed morale and is a big part of the 5-17 run, but I do think it is a part, and just overall the way skip has managed the moves that have been made, even if overall I like the trades they made, this is not how a team that wants to make a run at the playoffs operates.

[rmc523]

Do you really think his MLB teammates are aware of a potential pitch limit that Eury has? They just know one of their best pitchers got sent down for a month. (They probably know about the monetary reasons, I know if I were an MLB player I would)

Ultimately I don't completely buy that this killed morale and is a big part of the 5-17 run, but I do think it is a part, and just overall the way skip has managed the moves that have been made, even if overall I like the trades they made, this is not how a team that wants to make a run at the playoffs operates.

Yeah, it's not the sole reason for the ship sinking, but it's definitely one of a few factors:

-Eury sent down
-strange bullpen moves
-playing poor performing vets vs. best player, or at least giving young guys performing well a chance (can't be worse than now)
-recent bullpen meltdowns - especially blown saves, which is easily another 4 wins just off the top of my head
-terrible RISP performance


We've shifted back into the Done lame duck attitude of no urgency, and everyone is riding the ship down.

[lou]

Do you really think his MLB teammates are aware of a potential pitch limit that Eury has? They just know one of their best pitchers got sent down for a month. (They probably know about the monetary reasons, I know if I were an MLB player I would)

Ultimately I don't completely buy that this killed morale and is a big part of the 5-17 run, but I do think it is a part, and just overall the way skip has managed the moves that have been made, even if overall I like the trades they made, this is not how a team that wants to make a run at the playoffs operates.

Yes

[lou]

Yeah, it's not the sole reason for the ship sinking, but it's definitely one of a few factors:

-Eury sent down
-strange bullpen moves
-playing poor performing vets vs. best player, or at least giving young guys performing well a chance (can't be worse than now)
-recent bullpen meltdowns - especially blown saves, which is easily another 4 wins just off the top of my head
-terrible RISP performance


We've shifted back into the Done lame duck attitude of no urgency, and everyone is riding the ship down.

Eury is not a factor - it's an excuse trying to rationalize how a team with a negative run differential is doing so bad all of a sudden. Which doesn't make any sense because of said negative run differential. They were getting really lucky with the 1 run games for 2+ months. Occam's razor. I have literally been saying this was coming since mid-May and why they should have blown away the Nationals (Candelario, Thomas, Harvey) or Rockies (McMahon, E. Diaz, Grichuk) for a package in June to help mitigate against this well in advance. But they either wouldn't pay the price (bad), didn't anticipate this (very bad), or was not feasible as the Nationals, Rockies, and others clung on to slim hope they might have a large June. Hopefully it is the later here (I don't buy it, you can always make the juice worth the squeeze), which then goes back to.... SS/Nimmo in the offseason and the problem is and is always Bruce. The deadline trades were very solid, even if arguably one more big bat should have been obtained for SS or C.

There have been some strange bullpen moves for sure, and that terrible Robertson deflater, but ultimately they still can't hit so it's difficult to pin the impact on just Skip here. He should be better though with how the arms are being used. I do think this will level off with a healthy Jazz and more consistency from Bell and Burger playing everyday - plus the unanimous just call up Edwards - but this team is a good not great team and we will see if Bruce invests in the offseason as generally, they are taking a big step forward this year even if still a ways to go. But they can still surprise. If they can go .500 here on out in August, they will control their destiny in September with many games against the Brewers and Phillies, and god-willingly some cupcake Mets and Pirates games.

[TheMendozaLine]

I’ve completed a through evaluation of our remaining schedule and have identified a small window of opportunity around September 18th when we might, with some luck, pick up our next win.