July/August 2020 Game Thread

[fish16]

it's pretty unreal how obvious it is 3 games into a 22 year olds career that the guy is an ace. Sixto, Pablo, and Sandy then two spots for years to come for Meyer, Cabrera, Neidert, Rogers, Garrett. if we can develop just a few of these bats we're a perrenial contender for 6 years. Jazz looked decent tonight at the plate and at least hit the ball hard multiple times. I doubt hes up here for long though. We're pretty obviously still 1 more middle of the order bat away from being able to do much of anything this year but the future is so bright.

I wish we had the money to get JT back in the offseason. you add him to this young core and that's a legit contender next year and might be even without him.

[Nick]

it's pretty unreal how obvious it is 3 games into a 22 year olds career that the guy is an ace. Sixto, Pablo, and Sandy then two spots for years to come for Meyer, Cabrera, Neidert, Rogers, Garrett. if we can develop just a few of these bats we're a perrenial contender for 6 years. Jazz looked decent tonight at the plate and at least hit the ball hard multiple times. I doubt hes up here for long though. We're pretty obviously still 1 more middle of the order bat away from being able to do much of anything this year but the future is so bright.

I wish we had the money to get JT back in the offseason. you add him to this young core and that's a legit contender next year and might be even without him.

To my eyes, Sixto, Sandy, Pablo and Cabrera are all extremely valuable assets at this point, with Max Meyer possibly joining those ranks soon. Then you've got Rogers, Garrett, Neidert and Elieser. Who at least two of which should be legit rotation pieces for years to come, I think. So you're going to be able to deal 1 or 2 maybe even 3 of these guys for significant returns. It's absolutely imperative we hit on these trades to acquire bats, because I think there will be quite a few holes in the lineup once the dust settles with the current crop of prospects that would've found themselves in AA and AAA this year.

[tjfla]

it's pretty unreal how obvious it is 3 games into a 22 year olds career that the guy is an ace. Sixto, Pablo, and Sandy then two spots for years to come for Meyer, Cabrera, Neidert, Rogers, Garrett. if we can develop just a few of these bats we're a perrenial contender for 6 years. Jazz looked decent tonight at the plate and at least hit the ball hard multiple times. I doubt hes up here for long though. We're pretty obviously still 1 more middle of the order bat away from being able to do much of anything this year but the future is so bright.

I wish we had the money to get JT back in the offseason. you add him to this young core and that's a legit contender next year and might be even without him.

They got atleast 15 million for 2021 and can go higher if want. Question is does JT wanna come back

Their budget BEFORE all this crap was 100-110 million starting in 2021. I doubt its that high anymore however

Cabrera is even better than Sixto and Garrett is a better pitcher than Rogers in most eyes

Neidert is a #4/5 SP innings eater

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To my eyes, Sixto, Sandy, Pablo and Cabrera are all extremely valuable assets at this point, with Max Meyer possibly joining those ranks soon. Then you've got Rogers, Garrett, Neidert and Elieser. Who at least two of which should be legit rotation pieces for years to come, I think. So you're going to be able to deal 1 or 2 maybe even 3 of these guys for significant returns. It's absolutely imperative we hit on these trades to acquire bats, because I think there will be quite a few holes in the lineup once the dust settles with the current crop of prospects that would've found themselves in AA and AAA this year.

They actually have more arms who are older just havent seen much of them cause no Milb.

Older-Puckett/Roberson/Will Stewart/Andrews/Walters and lots of RP

Other SP-Soriano/Palacios/Guerrero/Fitterer/Fulton/Mokma/Givin/DSL guys they love

Not saying any of these guys are #1 or 2 but depth thru system

Same with bats we have some interesting guys just havent gotten AB's

Dying to see what they do with guys next year-does Denbo get aggressive and move guys up cause of age to test them? Arms are older while most of our bats our younger plus 2021 is 20 Rds and likely to be the BEST draft ever

[fish16]

jt wasnt a real ask for me. as much as i want it to happen that aint happening. id just try and see if we can maybe deal some of our OF or pitching surplus for a catcher upgrade. Regardless i think you will see some OF guys moved and a couple of the SP's eventually moved to fill holes as nick mentioned. especially cause next year it looks like marte and dickerson have starting spots locked down already and that just leaves a bunch of potentially mlb ready guys put off for another year. Sanchez, Misner, Monte, Jerar, Burdick are all guys i could see being moved to address positions of lesser depth like 3b or C.

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and i honestly think thats been playing a big part in how aggressive they are being with some of these prospects trying to see at least some bit what they have in some of these guys so they can have other plans or backup plans for next year. the lack of a minor league season has been incredibly hurtful in that sense.

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also, i know we have the 60 man player pool or whatever but are all the rest of the guys in the organization who arent on the 60 man just not allowed to come to the facility and just have to figure out themselves how to develop for a full year?

[tjfla]

jt wasnt a real ask for me. as much as i want it to happen that aint happening. id just try and see if we can maybe deal some of our OF or pitching surplus for a catcher upgrade. Regardless i think you will see some OF guys moved and a couple of the SP's eventually moved to fill holes as nick mentioned. especially cause next year it looks like marte and dickerson have starting spots locked down already and that just leaves a bunch of potentially mlb ready guys put off for another year. Sanchez, Misner, Monte, Jerar, Burdick are all guys i could see being moved to address positions of lesser depth like 3b or C.

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and i honestly think thats been playing a big part in how aggressive they are being with some of these prospects trying to see at least some bit what they have in some of these guys so they can have other plans or backup plans for next year. the lack of a minor league season has been incredibly hurtful in that sense.

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also, i know we have the 60 man player pool or whatever but are all the rest of the guys in the organization who arent on the 60 man just not allowed to come to the facility and just have to figure out themselves how to develop for a full year?

Nope pretty much got plans for everything and doing work wherever. They send in tapes/reports and all but everything is done on skype/zoom. Coaches watch films give tips

Exactly they are trying to figure who can stick and who cant in 2021

3B isnt a big need really. U give BA a 5 year extension and by year 4 u got guys like Cappe/Salas/Osiris/draft picks ready to go. They got that position in the system just far off. That is the plan trade guys from surplus for others-with all these DFA coming(even the Villar trade) they are looking for NON 40 man types

They could have traded Monte for Archie Bradley in the Arizona deal but chose not to. Young controllable P always brings tons in return and AL teams will always trade for Jerar types to play DH(Hopefully NL has DH soon as Jerar/Aguilar/Conine are perfect) Conine can hit .180 with 25hrs HAHAH

[Nick]

They actually have more arms who are older just havent seen much of them cause no Milb.

Older-Puckett/Roberson/Will Stewart/Andrews/Walters and lots of RP

Other SP-Soriano/Palacios/Guerrero/Fitterer/Fulton/Mokma/Givin/DSL guys they love

Not saying any of these guys are #1 or 2 but depth thru system

Same with bats we have some interesting guys just havent gotten AB's

Dying to see what they do with guys next year-does Denbo get aggressive and move guys up cause of age to test them? Arms are older while most of our bats our younger plus 2021 is 20 Rds and likely to be the BEST draft ever

Those are certainly names.

[Lee Stone]

Game notes:

Shocker of the game was Cooper taking that 2-2 hanging slider, right down the middle at the belt, for strike three with runners aboard. All he had seen were 83 mph sliders, so there was no surprise factor. Weird and likely costly.

Non-shocker was Alfaro triple whiffs ... he did exactly the same the night before. Credit Mattingly for sending up a pinch hitter for him in the ninth, even it was L. Diaz, who has had trouble getting a major league hit.

That's the only credit I give the manager, who never made any attempt to move up a baserunner or make anything happen in that really ugly loss.

Elieser and Sixton look like the same guy on the mound. Yea, Sanchez has a little more velocity, but is just equally effective overall. Both have been victimized by rare hanging sliders.

Bold prediction: Urena will have better numbers than Alcantara this month.


They could have traded Monte for Archie Bradley in the Arizona deal but chose not to I find that extremely difficult to believe.

Zac Gallen! 7 innings of near perfection vs mighty Dodgers. 1 hit, no runs, 7 K. 1.80 ERA puts him in the Cy Young hunt.

[Nick]

Elieser and Sixton look like the same guy on the mound. Yea, Sanchez has a little more velocity, but is just equally effective overall. Both have been victimized by rare hanging sliders.

I guess I should no longer be surprised at this point, but...

[Lee Stone]

Surprised by what? Just look at their stats ... basically identical except for quite a few more K's for Hernandez. That's no slam on Sixton whatsoever. It's a reflection of Elieser being under-rated.

The other under-rated pitcher (with a tiny sample) is Rogers. Despite the Mets having two looks at him, I don't think a single ball left a Mets bat at more than 95 mph.

[Nick]

Surprised by what? Just look at their stats ... basically identical except for quite a few more K's for Hernandez. That's no slam on Sixton whatsoever. It's a reflection of Elieser being under-rated.

The other under-rated pitcher (with a tiny sample) is Rogers. Despite the Mets having two looks at him, I don't think a single ball left a Mets bat at more than 95 mph.

You are correct it's a tiny sample. It's all very tiny samples. Pitchers are not identical because they have similar numbers over 20-25 innings.

How about this? Elieser in the 3rd year of his major league career, has not gone more than 6 innings in a game. Sixto has gone 7 innings in 2 of his first 3 major league starts.

[Namaste]

Lee, c’mon buddy.

Sixto could have easily thrown a complete game last night. Guy made 1 bad pitch.

Lee, go take a look at how many guys Sixto has walked so far this year.

[Lee Stone]

Lee, c’mon buddy.

Sixto could have easily thrown a complete game last night. Guy made 1 bad pitch.

Lee, go take a look at how many guys Sixto has walked so far this year.

I always check numbers before commenting on anything. Both Elieser and Sanchez have 1.00 WHIP thus far (fantastic). Elieser has allowed a .212 BAA compared to .257 for Sixto. Nothing I said downplays what Sanchez has done. I addressed the absence of respect for how excellent Hernandez has been.

[fish16]

the difference between sixto and elieser is enormous, and i actually really like elieser. sixto is so much more efficient with his pitches (which is the thing that has stood out the most to me so far with him), doesnt walk anyone, and goes deep into games. elieser is good but they arent on the same level. Elieser is also 3 years older than him and in his 3rd year in the league which, no matter how much you want to try and ignore that lee, makes a huge difference in evaluating their performance.

Sixto is a legit ace 3 starts in. Elieser is maybe a long term #4 or 5?

[Namaste]

They are both pitching great but Sixto’s xFIP (2.63) says he’ll be better than Elisier (3.83).

Elisier K/9 is over 11 (wowowowow)

Sixto’s BB/9 is 0.47 (wowowowow)

[tjfla]

Game notes:

Shocker of the game was Cooper taking that 2-2 hanging slider, right down the middle at the belt, for strike three with runners aboard. All he had seen were 83 mph sliders, so there was no surprise factor. Weird and likely costly.

Non-shocker was Alfaro triple whiffs ... he did exactly the same the night before. Credit Mattingly for sending up a pinch hitter for him in the ninth, even it was L. Diaz, who has had trouble getting a major league hit.

That's the only credit I give the manager, who never made any attempt to move up a baserunner or make anything happen in that really ugly loss.

Elieser and Sixton look like the same guy on the mound. Yea, Sanchez has a little more velocity, but is just equally effective overall. Both have been victimized by rare hanging sliders.

Bold prediction: Urena will have better numbers than Alcantara this month.


They could have traded Monte for Archie Bradley in the Arizona deal but chose not to I find that extremely difficult to believe.

Zac Gallen! 7 innings of near perfection vs mighty Dodgers. 1 hit, no runs, 7 K. 1.80 ERA puts him in the Cy Young hunt.

Difficult to believe? Arizona ended up trading him for a AAA UT guy and a 24 yr old who was in AA and is their #14 prospect now