Marlins Sign Placido Polanco

[fauowls44]

Jonny Gomes had a .868 OPS this year. Mentioning his lack of post season at bats is pointless. The A's had a reason for doing it, nothing to do with how enamored they were with him. Also what history of sucking does Gomes have? One bad year in 2011? When he gets a good amount of at bats, he's performed.

Palcido Polanco had one bad year and doesn't have a history of sucking either. But that is a bad signing because he's older than Gomes? Who cares? He's a 1 year stopgap.

[lou]

Smith always hit RHP, and Gomes always hit LHP. Like Ramp said, there was a vision there with those guys. Let's also not forget Oakland shelled out serious bucks Cespedes (I agree, that I did not like that deal when Oakland did it but I did give them credit for going for it and it looks like they won), resigned Crisp for significant cash, and did other things like beef their bullpen, Bartolo, and traded away Gio Gonzalez and got a lot of great things.

The Marlins haven't done any of that, besides beefing up Jacksonville/2015 squad with the Toronto trade. I know Samson likes to point to Oakland and say we need to do that, but they don't do that. If they did, they would sign someone like Joe Saunders/Shaun Marcum for 2 years, sign Scott Hairston, sign Kelly Johnson, and sign some RHP like even Matt Lindstrom tomorrow. At least those guys have some youth and/or ability to turn into a real asset. Even if Pierre or Polanco return to 2004 form, they won't bring shit in July as everyone will expect immediate regression, or injury if it's Polanco with his back (which is worse than some of you think).

[Ramp]

So what was the A's reason for doing it then? Gomes OPSed .714 in 2011 and .758 in 2010. His career OPS is .789. He has been around since 2003, and only three times has he OPSed .800. For someone who cannot play a lick of defense, that isn't very good. You're gonna tell me he didn't play over his head last year?
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So you were against giving Cespedes that money, but you're upset that we got outbid for him? Got it. Also, the Marlins weren't the only team Oakland outbid for him, by the way.

I assume Gomes only got 1 at bat in the playoffs because they didn't face any lefties. After all, that's his moneymaker.

I never said he was a world beater, but when he got atleast 200 at bats, he had atleast a .758 OPS in every season besides 2011. He's a solid bat and like I said, he crushed left handed pitchers. He's a perfect platoon guy.

I did not like the idea of giving Cespedes a big contract, but if you're going to go after him, go get him. The Marlins had a huge hole in CF and he was out there for the taking. If it was up to me, the Marlins wouldn't have bid for him to begin with, but I'd like to believe the Marlins had more info than I based on a few stats and that crazy work out video. Maybe if I saw more of him in person, I would have changed my stance.

(I also didn't like the deal the Reds gave Chapman. But if you want someone badly, go get him.)

[Valid]

Smith always hit RHP, and Gomes always hit LHP. Like Ramp said, there was a vision there with those guys. Let's also not forget Oakland shelled out serious bucks Cespedes (I agree, that I did not like that deal when Oakland did it but I did give them credit for going for it and it looks like they won), resigned Crisp for significant cash, and did other things like beef their bullpen, Bartolo, and traded away Gio Gonzalez and got a lot of great things.

The Marlins haven't done any of that, besides beefing up Jacksonville/2015 squad with the Toronto trade. I know Samson likes to point to Oakland and say we need to do that, but they don't do that. If they did, they would sign someone like Joe Saunders/Shaun Marcum for 2 years, sign Scott Hairston, sign Kelly Johnson, and sign some RHP like even Matt Lindstrom tomorrow. At least those guys have some youth and/or ability to turn into a real asset. Even if Pierre or Polanco return to 2004 form, they won't bring shit in July as everyone will expect immediate regression, or injury if it's Polanco with his back (which is worse than some of you think).

I don't understand you guys. On one hand, you say you want the Marlins to go out and sign these mediocre players on the cheap. Then on the other hand, you say you want to give our young talent a chance.

I mean, which is it then?

[Namaste]

fauowls, you're one of my favorite posters here

do the marlins really need a stopgap?

they've already thrown in the towel

like Ramp said......throw Cox out there

some of you are acting like Polanco is the piece that's going to shore up the lineup and make a run

they're not going to win 80 games

you mentioned "who cares?"

you're exactly right. why bother with Polanco at his age. give someone else (younger) a chance to grow in the bigs and look toward 2014.

[Ramp]

Palcido Polanco had one bad year and doesn't have a history of sucking either. But that is a bad signing because he's older than Gomes? Who cares? He's a 1 year stopgap.

He's had 2 years in a row of him having a sub .675 OPS. His numbers have declined ever year since his 2007 season. He's 37 with no upside and no sign of him turning it around.

I'd rather see a young guy with some potential, than an old guy that is going the wrong way. Hell, I'd rather see any minor league minimum guy out there besides Polanco.

[Valid]

I assume Gomes only got 1 at bat in the playoffs because they didn't face any lefties. After all, that's his moneymaker.

I never said he was a world beater, but when he got atleast 200 at bats, he had atleast a .758 OPS in every season besides 2011. He's a solid bat and like I said, he crushed left handed pitchers. He's a perfect platoon guy.

I did not like the idea of giving Cespedes a big contract, but if you're going to go after him, go get him. The Marlins had a huge hole in CF and he was out there for the taking. If it was up to me, the Marlins wouldn't have bid for him to begin with, but I'd like to believe the Marlins had more info than I based on a few stats and that crazy work out video. Maybe if I saw more of him in person, I would have changed my stance.

(I also didn't like the deal the Reds gave Chapman. But if you want someone badly, go get him.)

Maybe the Marlins didn't want him as much as you think they did? Like, how do we know they wanted him so badly? We have no evidence of how much they truly wanted the guy. My guess is that they probably felt he wasn't worth that kind of money.
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fauowls, you're one of my favorite posters here

do the marlins really need a stopgap?

they've already thrown in the towel

like Ramp said......throw Cox out there

some of you are acting like Polanco is the piece that's going to shore up the lineup and make a run

they're not going to win 80 games

you mentioned "who cares?"

you're exactly right. why bother with Polanco at his age. give someone else (younger) a chance to grow in the bigs and look toward 2014.

I don't think anyone is saying that.

[lou]

Who cares? He's a 1 year stopgap.

I mean yea, no matter what they do, probably going to be terrible and under 1 million fans in the seats so who cares, but shouldn't you try to maximize your resources? This is why they are really bad infrastructually. They have never maximized their potential, which someone like Oakland usually does. Something the Marlins can offer right now is playing time. What do ancient Pierre and Polanco's do for this team? Give the playing time to younger guys who have years of control left and see if something develops. It's hard to see how the whole season will go, but hopefully by June they are both pushed out and guys like Silverio, Cox, Smolinski, not even the Yelich/Marisnick/Ozuna class, starts getting serious time. Like Solano and Hechavarria. Those are probably bad ideas, but hey. Maybe? If they even establish themselves as poor man's Bonifacios, thats not so bad. That's what a rebuilding club needs to do. It's not Pierre and Polanco.

[Ramp]

I don't understand you guys. On one hand, you say you want the Marlins to go out and sign these mediocre players on the cheap. Then on the other hand, you say you want to give our young talent a chance.

I mean, which is it then?

I want them to sign youngish guys that still have some upside. Or atleast are still producing somewhere.
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Maybe the Marlins didn't want him as much as you think they did? Like, how do we know they wanted him so badly? We have no evidence of how much they truly wanted the guy. My guess is that they probably felt he wasn't worth that kind of money..

The Marlins reportedly offered him a 6 year $36mil deal. He signed 4/$36

They wanted him. They just got crushed by the A's.

[fauowls44]

fauowls, you're one of my favorite posters here

do the marlins really need a stopgap?

they've already thrown in the towel

like Ramp said......throw Cox out there

some of you are acting like Polanco is the piece that's going to shore up the lineup and make a run

they're not going to win 80 games

you mentioned "who cares?"

you're exactly right. why bother with Polanco at his age. give someone else (younger) a chance to grow in the bigs and look toward 2014.

Yes they need a stopgap. What if Cox isn't ready? You want to throw him out there anyway? I know it doesn't seem like it, but the team does at least have to TRY to field a major league product. That's why I brought up the A's. NOBODY saw them making the playoffs and there is at least a slight chance the same can happen here.

Signing Pierre and Polanco fills immediate needs...that's not to say that Yelich and Cox don't end up getting more at bats during the season then either of them do. The only thing worse than this team blowing up last year's "plan" would be rushing the prospects they supposedly tore it down to eventually build around. In the meantime, what is wrong with at least having a few veterans around to try and help out the young players?

[Erick]

People really hate this front office, huh?

As fauowls has said, a lot of complaining about nothing.
Polanco will potentially be worth more at the deadline than the guy who hit .235/.284/.372...splitting time in AA and AAA last year. Age is irrelevant here. Kevin Kouzmanoff fucking sucks. Polanco could break his back and still be a better player. Pretty hilarious this is being said now after making fun of Kouzmanoff all offseason for being "Plan A."

Billy Beane had such great vision that when he was asked if he expected that kind of year, he basically said no numerous times.
I'm pretty sure fauowls main point about baseball is simply that shit happens.

While the hitters they signed played a part, a lot of unexpected things happened with that team. It was a team with five rookie pitchers and, really, only Jarrod Parker (who had question marks, himself, before the year) was the only real known commodity among the group before 2012.

If the likes of Turner, Alvarez, Eovaldi all pan out like all the Oakland pitchers did, you're looking at a different team. If the team hangs around and Jose Fernandez (who's a better prospect than all these pitchers) comes up and pitches like a stud, all of the sudden things change. That was the main point. Baseball isn't the NBA where everything is so predictable. Is this likely to happen? No. Was it likely that the A's would make the playoffs last year? No, most people actually had them finishing below the Mariners in the standings.

Also, I usually don't say these types of things, but we don't play the game nor are we around the game. Maybe they wanted a couple of veterans with good reputations simply for the young guys to develop proper work habits, etc. That's not an irrelevant thing for organizations.

Either way, it's a lot of complaining about nothing. Can someone at least bump the Blue Jays trade thread for people to have something to complain about? It's hard to believe this is a thing right now. Because we're not starting Ian Stewart and Kevin Kouzmanoff at 3B.

Also, they sign stopgaps because rushing young players when they're not ready yet is not a good way to develop young players.
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fauowls, you're one of my favorite posters here

do the marlins really need a stopgap?

they've already thrown in the towel

like Ramp said......throw Cox out there

some of you are acting like Polanco is the piece that's going to shore up the lineup and make a run

they're not going to win 80 games

you mentioned "who cares?"

you're exactly right. why bother with Polanco at his age. give someone else (younger) a chance to grow in the bigs and look toward 2014.

No offense, but this is really dumb logic.

Based on what you're saying, every non-contending team in the big leagues is really dumb. Every team signs stopgaps and they usually don't put prospects in that position when they're not ready because fuck it. That's not the way it works.
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The Marlins reportedly offered him a 6 year $36mil deal. He signed 4/$36

They wanted him. They just got crushed by the A's.

They wanted him...for 6 years/36 million. Isn't it possible that they didn't want him for 4 years/36 million?
The two deals are nowhere near the same.

Your complaint would make more sense if the years were the same and they were outbid by a couple million.

I really don't get this; it just seems like more complaining for the sake of complaining. Not to mention you didn't even think Cespedes was worth it, so...

[HUGG]

Cox isn't ready. Just throwing him out there because we're gonna suck is really stupid. We're gonna suck, so who cares. Put him in the minors and let him rebuild himself from his awful 2012. Why rush him? You don't rush prospects because you suck.

[Ramp]

People really hate this front office, huh?

As fauowls has said, a lot of complaining about nothing.
Polanco will potentially be worth more at the deadline than the guy who hit .235/.284/.372...splitting time in AA and AAA last year. Age is irrelevant here. Kevin Kouzmanoff fucking sucks. Polanco could break his back and still be a better player. Pretty hilarious this is being said now after making fun of Kouzmanoff all offseason for being "Plan A."

Billy Beane had such great vision that when he was asked if he expected that kind of year, he basically said no numerous times.
I'm pretty sure fauowls main point about baseball is simply that shit happens.

While the hitters they signed played a part, a lot of unexpected things happened with that team. It was a team with five rookie pitchers and, really, only Jarrod Parker (who had question marks, himself, before the year) was the only real known commodity among the group before 2012.

If the likes of Turner, Alvarez, Eovaldi all pan out like all the Oakland pitchers did, you're looking at a different team. If the team hangs around and Jose Fernandez (who's a better prospect than all these pitchers) comes up and pitches like a stud, all of the sudden things change. That was the main point. Baseball isn't the NBA where everything is so predictable. Is this likely to happen? No. Was it likely that the A's would make the playoffs last year? No, most people actually had them finishing below the Mariners in the standings.

Also, I usually don't say these types of things, but we don't play the game nor are we around the game. Maybe they wanted a couple of veterans with good reputations simply for the young guys to develop proper work habits, etc. That's not an irrelevant thing for organizations.

Either way, it's a lot of complaining about nothing. Can someone at least bump the Blue Jays trade thread for people to have something to complain about? It's hard to believe this is a thing right now. Because we're not starting Ian Stewart and Kevin Kouzmanoff at 3B.

Also, they sign stopgaps because rushing young players when they're not ready yet is not a good way to develop young players.

I don't care for Kouzmanoff at all. I'd rather see Cox or lets get a legit competition going in camp. I feel like signing Polanco is a waste of resources. $2.5mil isn't much, but sadly to this club, it is. You want to bring in Pierre and Polanco to help mentor the young guys? By all means, I think it's a great idea. But I don't want the P Bros to be getting 500 at bats this year if there are young guys with upside that can potentially play in those positions (I am not talking about youngsters like Yelich).

I'm not suggesting Beane believed his team would win 90. But I am suggesting he had/has a plan in place when he signs these players. He knows what he's doing with his platoon splits and picking up young veterans with some upside.

Have you liked this offseason thus far? How would you grade it? What moves did you like, what moves didn't? I'm having a hard time understanding your mindset and your belief that some of us are just complaining to complain.
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Cox isn't ready. Just throwing him out there because we're gonna suck is really stupid. We're gonna suck, so who cares. Put him in the minors and let him rebuild himself from his awful 2012. Why rush him? You don't rush prospects because you suck.

Ok, not Cox. But you can find someone else with young side. I thought he was closer to being ready, clearly I was wrong there.
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They wanted him...for 6 years/36 million. Isn't it possible that they didn't want him for 4 years/36 million?
The two deals are nowhere near the same.

I really don't get this; it just seems like more complaining for the sake of complaining. Not to mention you didn't even think Cespedes was worth it, so...

I'm not complaining for the sake of complaining and I'm actually offended by this. I've been on the board for awhile, and for you to insinuate this is pretty rude. It's like you can't have a baseball conversation on a message board that you disagree with. The second you disagree with something it's clearly because me or lou or whoever is "complaining just to complain". We're all just miserable people that love to complain.

Sorry if we expect more from our team. I guess I'll keep expectations low so I'll always be pleasantly surprised no matter the case.

It was still $36mil and he was a good fit for the Marlins (even if I didn't like giving someone a long term deal). I'm giving the A's and all the teams in the running the benefit that they knew more than I when it came to Cespedes.

[Jay]

If we went into the season with any prospect that was not thought of as ready or close to ready everyone complaining about Pierre and Polanco would be complaining about rushing these players.

I agree that getting well past their prime players is not the past strategy and finding players that just haven't gotten a chance or have shown something, are still in their prime and just haven't put it all together yet. Going with cheaper younger guys is definitely the better option but those cheaper younger guys should in no way be prospects being rushed.

Zach Cox may not be the best prospect anymore but he currently projects as our third baseman in the future. He was without a doubt rushed by the cardinals and it backfired. He needs time to develop. If he's playing well and has his confidence back midseason and all the shit they threw at third base hasn't stuck then it's the right time to start the prospect.

[HUGG]

I mean, I agree with Ramp's basic point though. I'd have rather we got Danny Valencia or someone similar than a 37-year old.

And I still would rather we had just went with Kouzmanoff.