2022-2023 Offseason Thread

[lou]

Projections on Arizona - https://blogs.fangraphs.com/2023-zip...a-diamondbacks. This is screaming for them to trade an OF for a SP, and could use some help/depth at C (Fortes) and SS (Rojas). Get Danny Jansen and Rosario in separate deals, and this is a perfect match.

BTW, they have the Marlins as a 37 WAR team (Phillies were 43 last year). https://www.fangraphs.com/depthchart...=ALL&teamid=20.

If they do leverage..

Garrett for Jansen
Rogers/Cabrera, Fortes, Salas/Meyer, Rojas, for any Arizona CF, presumably Varsho or Thomas
Mainly prospects for Rosario

You get the Marlins to 40+ WAR pretty quickly.

Just add Rodon and thats the 6th best National league projection I kid you not (above Philadelphia), and thats with Jazz at a 3.2 WAR, Sandy 4 WAR, Luzardo 1.9, and Cabrera/Rogers roughly 1.6, all of whom could smoke those numbers. Give every one of those guys 1 more WAR as quite frankly, I can see Jazz as a 4 WAR guy, Sandy 5, Luzardo 3, and Cabrera/Rogers a 2.5 (Rogers did 4 in 2021!) and you're at the fucking Dodgers projection right now. The fucking Dodgers.

I mean Rodon is a dream, so just add Turner/Drury, a stop gap SP to bridge to Eury/Eder, and maybe a Bass-like reliever, and then pray you get those extra 4 WAR from the guys above and that gets you to be NL team 7 and the last wild card. That is "plausible" to contending.


This is why this offseason is so insane to me and I can't get over it. Why the fuck are they hording all of these assets when this is what the industry thinks? It's just insane what they are not doing. It's malpractice. But I guess they do have till spring training. So we wait.

[fish16]

they wont even sign a legit bullpen arm, they arent signing rodon at the only position of strength on the team for huge money.

[sports24/7]

Jon Heyman mentions Miami being willing to go 2 years on Justin Turner. He also says they are interested in Michael Conforto. To be fair, though, Heyman doesn’t seem to have great Marlins information, usually.

[fish16]

im just out of things to say. what is even the plan? they sold a bag of goods with a smart plan to rebuild in the hopes of building a new organization from top to bottom, which they did well and which i think after jose died we can all acknowledge was probably needed. but now that its time to spend, sherman is the only owner literally in all of baseball who hasnt signed a single major league free agent this offseason and hasnt made a single deal. all of the top free agents are off the board other than swanson who is going to go to the cubs in all likelihood or re-sign with our rivals.

i said this last week, but i wish someone would ask in shermans one time a year answering questions, why on earth should anyone spend their money supporting this team? What on earth has he done in 5 years other than tearing it down and half ass rebuilding it up that would indicate that he gives a single fuck about winning? It is beyond sad how many of the best memories i have of this team since 2003 come from a 2020 shortened year where they were realistically not very good and got super lucky to get into the playoffs. im 28, how on earth have i gone from 9 years old to 28 and the best memories i have of this team are an asterisk playoff berth where they were swept against the only good team they played in the playoffs. At least other teams who have had historic droughts were just incompetent and not incompetent and also, possibly even worse, indifferent. i love baseball and i love the marlins but im so close to being on the lookout for a new team and i dont want to be, but they give this fanbase 0 reasons to watch and be fans of this team. what possible hope is there for the future if 6 years into what was supposed to be the turning point for the franchise, it's literally worse than ever? and what team do i even root for or do i just become a general baseball fan? If i look for a team, it would be a similarly downtrodden team but at least with a slice of hope for the future. maybe the orioles i guess with rutschman, and ive been to their ballpark on a ballpark tour years ago and its beautiful, but i just cant bring myself to support another team. And all of this is as a diehard fan of this team. how fucking bad will attendance be next year when they try to fake as if they think that the rebounds from soler and garcia and full seasons from luzardo and cabrera equal 25-30 win improvements to what it will take to be a playoff team. who in the world would buy that? who in the world would run their organization this way? It's pathetic. we are quite literally the worst franchise in baseball in terms of our current predicament plus hope for the future.

They will never sell the team, and sherman is so fucking invisible that i have 0 idea whether he would ever have the self awareness to realize how completely fucked this situation now is without him spending money,

[rmc523]

im just out of things to say. what is even the plan? they sold a bag of goods with a smart plan to rebuild in the hopes of building a new organization from top to bottom, which they did well and which i think after jose died we can all acknowledge was probably needed. but now that its time to spend, sherman is the only owner literally in all of baseball who hasnt signed a single major league free agent this offseason and hasnt made a single deal. all of the top free agents are off the board other than swanson who is going to go to the cubs in all likelihood or re-sign with our rivals.

i said this last week, but i wish someone would ask in shermans one time a year answering questions, why on earth should anyone spend their money supporting this team? What on earth has he done in 5 years other than tearing it down and half ass rebuilding it up that would indicate that he gives a single fuck about winning? It is beyond sad how many of the best memories i have of this team since 2003 come from a 2020 shortened year where they were realistically not very good and got super lucky to get into the playoffs. im 28, how on earth have i gone from 9 years old to 28 and the best memories i have of this team are an asterisk playoff berth where they were swept against the only good team they played in the playoffs. At least other teams who have had historic droughts were just incompetent and not incompetent and also, possibly even worse, indifferent. i love baseball and i love the marlins but im so close to being on the lookout for a new team and i dont want to be, but they give this fanbase 0 reasons to watch and be fans of this team. what possible hope is there for the future if 6 years into what was supposed to be the turning point for the franchise, it's literally worse than ever? and what team do i even root for or do i just become a general baseball fan? If i look for a team, it would be a similarly downtrodden team but at least with a slice of hope for the future. maybe the orioles i guess with rutschman, and ive been to their ballpark on a ballpark tour years ago and its beautiful, but i just cant bring myself to support another team. And all of this is as a diehard fan of this team. how fucking bad will attendance be next year when they try to fake as if they think that the rebounds from soler and garcia and full seasons from luzardo and cabrera equal 25-30 win improvements to what it will take to be a playoff team. who in the world would buy that? who in the world would run their organization this way? It's pathetic. we are quite literally the worst franchise in baseball in terms of our current predicament plus hope for the future.

They will never sell the team, and sherman is so fucking invisible that i have 0 idea whether he would ever have the self awareness to realize how completely fucked this situation now is without him spending money,

There doesn't seem to be any plan. Kim probably got a budget of the same as last year, so she's just not doing anything.

They're counting on the casual fans that just show up randomly, while ignoring fans that actually would support them on a consistent basis.

I can't support another team. I'll just stop following baseball altogether, aside from casually seeing the scores.

[lou]

im just out of things to say. what is even the plan? they sold a bag of goods with a smart plan to rebuild in the hopes of building a new organization from top to bottom, which they did well and which i think after jose died we can all acknowledge was probably needed. but now that its time to spend, sherman is the only owner literally in all of baseball who hasnt signed a single major league free agent this offseason and hasnt made a single deal. all of the top free agents are off the board other than swanson who is going to go to the cubs in all likelihood or re-sign with our rivals.

i said this last week, but i wish someone would ask in shermans one time a year answering questions, why on earth should anyone spend their money supporting this team? What on earth has he done in 5 years other than tearing it down and half ass rebuilding it up that would indicate that he gives a single fuck about winning? It is beyond sad how many of the best memories i have of this team since 2003 come from a 2020 shortened year where they were realistically not very good and got super lucky to get into the playoffs. im 28, how on earth have i gone from 9 years old to 28 and the best memories i have of this team are an asterisk playoff berth where they were swept against the only good team they played in the playoffs. At least other teams who have had historic droughts were just incompetent and not incompetent and also, possibly even worse, indifferent. i love baseball and i love the marlins but im so close to being on the lookout for a new team and i dont want to be, but they give this fanbase 0 reasons to watch and be fans of this team. what possible hope is there for the future if 6 years into what was supposed to be the turning point for the franchise, it's literally worse than ever? and what team do i even root for or do i just become a general baseball fan? If i look for a team, it would be a similarly downtrodden team but at least with a slice of hope for the future. maybe the orioles i guess with rutschman, and ive been to their ballpark on a ballpark tour years ago and its beautiful, but i just cant bring myself to support another team. And all of this is as a diehard fan of this team. how fucking bad will attendance be next year when they try to fake as if they think that the rebounds from soler and garcia and full seasons from luzardo and cabrera equal 25-30 win improvements to what it will take to be a playoff team. who in the world would buy that? who in the world would run their organization this way? It's pathetic. we are quite literally the worst franchise in baseball in terms of our current predicament plus hope for the future.

They will never sell the team, and sherman is so fucking invisible that i have 0 idea whether he would ever have the self awareness to realize how completely fucked this situation now is without him spending money,

I am impressed you are this angry and didn't even get to experience the greatness of 1998. You missed one of the biggest fuck-yous from ownership. Respect!

I'd shoot for the Mariners also. Going AL is the way to go in case the Marlins ever get their shit together. Seattle is scrappy, Julio is incredible, and they have budget limitations so they will have to be strategic. It's also easy to hate on the Astros, Angels, and Rangers. Seattle is everything we want Miami to be as a front office. For instance, still having Luis Castillo which should be a thing!

Also it's not worse than ever, the Marlins have not cashed in the pitching and Jazz is great. Payroll is non-existent. They are set up for success if they choose to do almost ANYTHING. I unfortunately feel they may have determined kicking the can is the best decision because Eury/Eder/Meyer/Bender/Sixto/Fulton all being MLB ready are the missing pieces, both to fill holes and to trade out two current SP for bats, and they aren't going to make prospective moves until they see how everyone developments another .5-1 seasons. Basically, they are scared to trade anyone as if arms blow themselves out they'll be screwed. Yes I know all the problems with this both on the field and off, I'm just speculating how cheap/passive they are and they are just fine sitting 1 more year as *maybe then everyone is healthy.* Sigh.

[rmc523]

I am impressed you are this angry and didn't even get to experience the greatness of 1998. You missed one of the biggest fuck-yous from ownership. Respect!

I'd shoot for the Mariners also. Going AL is the way to go in case the Marlins ever get their shit together. Seattle is scrappy, Julio is incredible, and they have budget limitations so they will have to be strategic. It's also easy to hate on the Astros, Angels, and Rangers. Seattle is everything we want Miami to be as a front office. For instance, still having Luis Castillo which should be a thing!

Also it's not worse than ever, the Marlins have not cashed in the pitching and Jazz is great. Payroll is non-existent. They are set up for success if they choose to do almost ANYTHING. I unfortunately feel they may have determined kicking the can is the best decision because Eury/Eder/Meyer/Bender/Sixto/Fulton all being MLB ready are the missing pieces, both to fill holes and to trade out two current SP for bats, and they aren't going to make prospective moves until they see how everyone developments another .5-1 seasons. Basically, they are scared to trade anyone as if arms blow themselves out they'll be screwed. Yes I know all the problems with this both on the field and off, I'm just speculating how cheap/passive they are and they are just fine sitting 1 more year as *maybe then everyone is healthy.* Sigh.

The problem is "everyone" is never healthy at the same time. That's just a fact. If they're waiting for that, it'll never happen.

[lou]

The problem is "everyone" is never healthy at the same time. That's just a fact. If they're waiting for that, it'll never happen.

Hence - "Yes I know all the problems with this both on the field and off." They seem to be waiting for a perfect scenario with how passive they are.

Continuing with these guys absent some major changes is the definition of insanity. Which is mind boggling as they have so many ways to improve. But hey, they do have till spring training. So we can bitch before we all check out. It'll be nice not caring at all March 1st-July 28th and then maybe the real trades finally happen then.

[sports24/7]

There doesn't seem to be any plan. Kim probably got a budget of the same as last year, so she's just not doing anything.

They're counting on the casual fans that just show up randomly, while ignoring fans that actually would support them on a consistent basis.

I can't support another team. I'll just stop following baseball altogether, aside from casually seeing the scores.

While not spending money is dumb, and certainly makes it harder for Ng to do things, that's not a good enough excuse to do nothing when you have so much pitching depth, and some good pieces in the farm system.

But as for them counting on any fans to care, they absolutely should not if they effectively stand pat. I hope they set records for low attendance and their TV numbers tank. They should also be loudly criticized by the media for their lack of trying.

[rmc523]

While not spending money is dumb, and certainly makes it harder for Ng to do things, that's not a good enough excuse to do nothing when you have so much pitching depth, and some good pieces in the farm system.

But as for them counting on any fans to care, they absolutely should not if they effectively stand pat. I hope they set records for low attendance and their TV numbers tank. They should also be loudly criticized by the media for their lack of trying.

1000% agree. Can't sign a free agent? Sucks, but ok.....but do something....trade prospects for proven guys. Don't just sit on your hands!

[rmc523]

In what seems like a typical Marlins move.....we'll probably overpay Conforto - a guy that hasn't played in a year, and wasn't that good in his walk year, and then be shocked when he performs so poorly that having an opt out won't matter.

[Lee Stone]

I have zero interest in watching Conforto play. For that matter, I'll take a pass on Justin Turner also.

Must have room for Jerar in the lineup. His winter season is vastly better than DeLaCruz and J Sanchez.

[sports24/7]

In what seems like a typical Marlins move.....we'll probably overpay Conforto - a guy that hasn't played in a year, and wasn't that good in his walk year, and then be shocked when he performs so poorly that having an opt out won't matter.

Yes, and I'd also prefer something better. But also, I'd prefer to take a shot on Conforto than the other most likely options.

[Namaste]

Missed all of 2022 and will be 30 years old in 2 months a. Please do not acquire Conforto. Not to mention his bullshit antics.

[Lee Stone]

Missed all of 2022 and will be 30 years old in 2 months a. Please do not acquire Conforto. Not to mention his bullshit antics.

Couldn't agree more. Doing absolutely nothing would look good compared to signing Conforto.

Does anyone have details on financial structure of the deal for the Marlins? How much of the package is made up of debt? How much are the annual payments that debt service requires? I have a hunch that most teams are owned outright but that the Marlins are largely financed and have substantial annual obligations. That would be a major obstacle to expanding payroll.