2021-2022 Offseason Thread

[lou]

keeping watson and trading for marte are not mutually exclusive propositions, all I'm saying is that we have the ability to get him without giving up watson. Trade from the positions of strength we've built (high-level SP and lower level high ceiling bats) and keep the one hitter in your system with superstar potential. Marte is a star, I completely agree, I'm just saying that we can both get that star and keep our number 1 prospect due to the investments they've made and built in the farm system through the draft, IFA, and trades. The benefit of building your team intelligently like they have done in the farm system is being able to acquire impact talent without losing a #1 prospect like Watson.

There is a world where they can both keep watson and have a potential future star AND have the next 3 cheap years of Marte for Meyer/Cabrera, Burdick, Salas, Mccambley, and say a throw in lower level guy.

It's not a dealbreaker, that's my point. Of course you'd want to keep at least four of Meyer, Sixto, Cabrera, Watson, and Eury (we all agree that's the tier 1 of the farm right???), but if two gotta go, so be it. I don't think the Marlins have the ability to get Ketel without 2 of those guys included, unless the DBacks really really love Bleday, Eder, Salas, Fulton, etc., or Rogers, Pablo, or Jazz is included. Your trade above is light. All of baseball will be calling for Ketel and the Diamondbacks will get an awesome package. Look at what Jose Berrios cost the Jays. Ketel is better.

Also, the benefit of building your team intelligently is being able to trade multiple prospects for a star. They have succeeded in this, and if they do an inverse-Yelich trade and dish out 3 major prospects for a star, who cares. They have major youth (and payroll flexibility) at the MLB level and yes losing 3 of their top 10 prospects will hurt the farm, but they'll still have multiple top 100 prospects, multiple close to top 100 prospects, and excellent picks in the 2022 draft where the farm really isn't going to be that bad. Let's say they dish Watson and Meyer, and Cabrera and Sixto (and the Garret/Neidert guys) graduate to bigs. Their top 10 is going to be something like Eury, 2022 1st rounder, Bleday, Eder, Salas, Mack, Burdick, Lewis, Fulton, Cappe/Morisette/Nunez/22 second rounder. The farm is going to still run 15-18 guys deep with that list, not including IFA. Plenty of talent coming to supplant guys leaving and ammo for more guys.

The window is now. Worry about 5 years from now in 4 1/2. Ketel is a difference maker that gets them into plausible playoff discussion if they can add another few guys around him for next year.

[fish16]

MILB portion of the rule 5 is today and the MLB portion will be done when the lockout is ended.
Ive seen a few minor league signings announced which I guess makes sense but is weird in a lockout where MLB moves arent allowed. So teams can sign minor league contracts during the lockout?

[fish16]

Also, probably not a guy in our price range but if they are 100% certain the DH is coming this year, i'd see what kind of deal nelson cruz would be looking for because he fits for a number of reasons. He'd be a good balance to the lefties who will be in the lineup on opening day or can be expected next year some time in Jazz, Lewin, Sanchez, Bleday. And he would give us a pure slugger we don't currently have in the lineup. Plus with his age he's most likely going to get a 1 year deal or at max 2 years, and that would be the perfect impact bat that can make a difference next year without costing lots of money 3-4 years down the line when guys start becoming arbitration eligible.

Rowson was in Minnesota with him for 3 years so maybe that might help get us in the conversation. Not that we can't have both, but if the options are Aguilar at 8-10 million and Cruz at 12-14, give me Cruz. Or you can keep them both and give yourself insurance for Lewin and Cooper and have a huge threat off the bench every night.

C- Stallings
1b- Lewin/Aguilar
2b- Jazz
SS- Rojas
3b- anderson
LF- Sanchez
CF- Garcia I guess
RF- FA or maybe cooper?
DH options- Cruz, Aguilar, Cooper

[lou]

Yea no thanks on 41 year old Cruz. You don't want to be the team to pay him that when the bottom drops out. Which could be any day.

[fish16]

Yea no thanks on 41 year old Cruz. You don't want to be the team to pay him that when the bottom drops out. Which could be any day.

risk is that the bottom drops out for him and he's on a short term contract. Reward can be you get one of the best power hitters in the league and a proven big time player in big games. I would only do it on a 1 year deal, maybe 1 year with a team option for year 2. On a contract like that id much rather pay him 15 million than almost any other guy who would garner that kind of annual salary, and almost anyone else at that pay grade would be 3+ years.

[fish16]

marlins have made a pick in every round so far in the MILB rule 5

Round 1- Charles Leblanc, 25 year old 2b in Rangers org.
Round 2- Robert Garcia, lefty in Royals org.
Round 3- Cobie Vance, 24 year old SS in A's org
Round 4- Luarbart Arias- 20 year old in padres organization. righty pitcher. interesting stats but in low A.
We lost tanner andrews.
round 5- Carlos Santiago, rookie ball SS for Dodgers with awful numbers.

We were the only team to pick in all 5 rounds.

[lou]

risk is that the bottom drops out for him and he's on a short term contract. Reward can be you get one of the best power hitters in the league and a proven big time player in big games. I would only do it on a 1 year deal, maybe 1 year with a team option for year 2. On a contract like that id much rather pay him 15 million than almost any other guy who would garner that kind of annual salary, and almost anyone else at that pay grade would be 3+ years.

$15m bucks is going to be like 18-25% of their payroll more than likely. There isn't a realm in the universe the upgrade from Cooper to Cruz is worth this. BTW, Cruz projected 1.8 WAR in 580 PA, Cooper .7 in 223 PA (that is.... 1.8 WAR over 580 PA). Schwarber, I can get behind. He's young and in his prime. They'd need to figure out CF, but he will rake. Signing Cruz is you've built out the whole team with 25 guys and can't upgrade any of them and there is no better way to spend $15m. They can do better.

[Nick]

Leblanc seems like an interesting utility man candidate.

[fish16]

Leblanc seems like an interesting utility man candidate.

he's got a tall task ahead of him to try to take the title from Wade Leblanc as best leblanc in marlins history.

[rmc523]

Leblanc seems like an interesting utility man candidate.

Who?

[fish16]

Who?

drafted him in the first round of the MILB rule 5 draft

[fish16]

Just looking at what the RP market so far and just from looking at the deals there is no reason they cant either sign Jansen to a deal or sign 2 of the lesser tier guys to bolster the bullpen once the lockout ends.

I think they will end up with Jansen and while I don't love spending that much on a closer I think it makes sense here. We saw a lot last year that a lot of our guys just weren't as effective in the closer role and that they might be able to pull it off but ideally they would be in a lesser role. I think signing Jansen and then pushing down guys like Bass, Bender, Floro, Bleier etc into set up/middle relief roles makes a lot of sense. Not sure what Jansen is going to get though and I wouldnt go more than 2, maybe 3 years, on him. But they were after him a few years ago as well so the interest isn't surprising.

If they go the route of 2 cheaper guys instead of the one proven closer id be all over Collin McHugh, darren o day (not sure if he's retiring), and Andrew chafin. Lower salary option but I wouldn't mind bringing Sergio Romo back again.

[geemoney]

This is from The Athletic on Jesus Sanchez's performance in the Dominican winter league thus far:

"Sanchez, who hit 14 homers in 64 games for the Marlins last year, received an extended opportunity with the Toros del Este before his stint with the team ended. He made a good impression, both in the field and at the plate. He has posted high strikeout rates since his early days in the Rays’ organization. He has struck out in 32 percent of his major-league plate appearances since debuting in 2020. Over 71 at-bats in LIDOM, he struck out only three more times than he walked (12). He showed good control of the strike zone against both left-handed and right-handed pitchers, the evaluator said. If he can carry his adjustments over to next year, he could be on the brink of a major-league breakout."

[Nick]

This is from The Athletic on Jesus Sanchez's performance in the Dominican winter league thus far:

"Sanchez, who hit 14 homers in 64 games for the Marlins last year, received an extended opportunity with the Toros del Este before his stint with the team ended. He made a good impression, both in the field and at the plate. He has posted high strikeout rates since his early days in the Rays’ organization. He has struck out in 32 percent of his major-league plate appearances since debuting in 2020. Over 71 at-bats in LIDOM, he struck out only three more times than he walked (12). He showed good control of the strike zone against both left-handed and right-handed pitchers, the evaluator said. If he can carry his adjustments over to next year, he could be on the brink of a major-league breakout."

Good stuff, I really liked what I saw from Sanchez the last month or so of the season last year.

[lou]

This is from The Athletic on Jesus Sanchez's performance in the Dominican winter league thus far:

"Sanchez, who hit 14 homers in 64 games for the Marlins last year, received an extended opportunity with the Toros del Este before his stint with the team ended. He made a good impression, both in the field and at the plate. He has posted high strikeout rates since his early days in the Rays’ organization. He has struck out in 32 percent of his major-league plate appearances since debuting in 2020. Over 71 at-bats in LIDOM, he struck out only three more times than he walked (12). He showed good control of the strike zone against both left-handed and right-handed pitchers, the evaluator said. If he can carry his adjustments over to next year, he could be on the brink of a major-league breakout."

It would be very Marlins for their two top corner OF prospects to have best as possible off-seasons and for them to sign a corner OF bat for 4-5 years. Ultimately, this just says to me Burdick needs to be attached to a SP and moved for a CF. Sanchez and Bleday are earning extended MLB looks based on performance, and in Bleday's case, draft pedigree. Likewise, the idea of signing a Schwarber becomes extremely skeptical if we assume Sanchez and Bleday are going to play. Someone will have to DH.

All roads go back to being all-in on a centerfielder. And ideally, two of them and have one of them also be able to play in the IF (cough Ketel). That's the moves.