Donnie Fuckin' Murphy Saves A Panda, Fish Win in 10 3-2 Over Nats

[Mainge]

I don't understand how pitchers avoiding Uggla = plate discipline. He is dependent on his power to draw walks.

That's not really a negative.

Also it's plate vision

[Party]

I didn't say it was.

[Omar]

So in an argument over who has better plate discipline, you'd take Juan Pierre over Adam Dunn?

Considering the difference between Dunn and Pierre's OBP is higher than any of the years I mentioned for Infante/Uggla (either way), it's not the same argument. However, plate discipline is equal parts knowing which pitch to let go and which pitch to swing at.

[jOOj]

KJC was txting me telling me we were gonna lose, I had to tell him to stop.

[Miamarlin21]

Gaby Hernandez...now theres a name I havent heard for a while.

He's with the White Sox now. Very nice guy, sad he couldn't put it together.

[Bobbob1313]

]Uggla, at least for me, is a guy whose stats look a lot better than his game.

He's one of my favorite people to point to when people do the "I trust my eyes" thing. Just watching Uggla, 30% of the time he looks absolutely hopeless, and more if you catch him on the wrong day. But he's a good hitter based on his overall production.

[nny]

I would assume the better way of putting it is Uggla is more patient and Infante has better contact abilities.

In terms of going deep into the count, since that's what originally brought it up, Infante averages 3.62 pitchers per PA in his career; Uggla's at 4.04.

Last season, Uggla ranked 12th in pitchers per PA.

Infante was 126 (Out of 149)

So yes, we did get worse.

[Miamarlin21]

Can someone explain the who panda thing? I wasn't able to watch the game so I don't understand the reference.

[TealMonster08]

Why would you think the panda would have come from the telecast?

[Party]

Chewie was held up in his house threatening to kill a panda if the Marlins didn't score in the 10th. The police intervened, the Marlins won and the panda was saved.

[Miamarlin21]

Chewie was held up in his house threatening to kill a panda if the Marlins didn't score in the 10th. The police intervened, the Marlins won and the panda was saved.

Phew, glad the Marlins won then because why would Chewie want to kill such a cuddly panda? Not cool dude haha

[Omar]

I would assume the better way of putting it is Uggla is more patient and Infante has better contact abilities.

In terms of going deep into the count, since that's what originally brought it up, Infante averages 3.62 pitchers per PA in his career; Uggla's at 4.04.

Last season, Uggla ranked 12th in pitchers per PA.

Infante was 126 (Out of 149)

So yes, we did get worse.

Those numbers don't do anything other than scratch the surface. Where did Uggla rank amongst #5 hitters in P/PA (since he spent the majority of his time there)? What was Infante's rank amongst #1/2 hitters? What percentage of pitches did Infante see in the strike zone vs Uggla? What percentage of fastballs does Uggla see vs Infante?

These numbers also fail to go the distance, but they shed more light:

Balls Swung At: 21.1% vs 23.1%
Strikes Swung At: 65.9% vs 61.8%
Pitches Swung At: 43.2% vs 44.1%
Balls Contacted: 47.0% vs 58.7%
Strikes Contacted: 82.0% vs 90.0%
Pitches Contacted: 73.3% vs 82.5%
Strikes Seen: 49.3% vs 54.2%
Swing/Miss: 11.1% vs 7.5%

Player 1: Uggla
Player 2: Infante

From this one can see a couple of things. First, Uggla sees way more balls over his career than Infante. This is a function of several things (hitter type, location in the order, situation, propensity to swing/miss, etc.). But it'd be hard to argue that it's not easier to see more pitches per at-bat when you're getting more thrown at you that aren't good to swing at. Furthermore, despite swinging at slightly more balls and significantly fewer strikes, Infante has a significantly lower swing/miss percentage than Uggla. So how, again, does the former second baseman have better plate discipline than the current one?

[Bobbob1313]

You're confusing contact ability with plate discipline.

[Omar]

No, I'm not.

Uggla's defenders are confusing plate discipline with the ability to not swing at a ball that bounces in front of home plate or is three feet out of the strike zone.

[Mainge]

The original point still stands. We've lost a lot of walks in our lineup, regardless of how they came.