Justin Upton for Morrison, Nolasco?

[Bobbob1313]

His ground ball rates really worry me for his long term power potential, and guys with Upton's power often develop better eyes as pitcher's learn to be more careful.

[Valid]

His ground ball rates really worry me for his long term power potential, and guys with Upton's power often develop better eyes as pitcher's learn to be more careful.

Fair enough, and I understand that Upton is already a stud defensively, too, but I'm just very wary of trading a potential stud in Morrison and a proven quality starter in Nolasco, regardless of whether or not we add a Pavano.

[fishy]

Would they trade any of the starting pitching prizes like hand, koehler, james or villanueva to get a big time name

[Ramp]

They aren't that prized around the majors.

[lou]

Let's start with the fact that Morrison posted a .390 OBP last year, which is absolutely incredible for a 22-year old rookie. Upton's career-high is .366, and while that is still very good, I can see Morrison consistently posting OBPs north of .400 throughout his career. I don't think Upton will ever approach that kind of production.

As far as power goes, I think it's pretty clear that Upton has Morrison beat, but I certainly don't think it's out of the question to see Logan hit 20-25 homers a year once he matures. And I know Upton is fast, but it's not exactly like he's been lighting up the basepaths; he stole 18 bases last year (caught eight times) and 20 the year before (caught five times).

So, am I saying for sure that Morrison will be a better player than Upton? Certainly not. I'm just saying that dealing Morrison and Nolasco for a player who Morrison may very well end up being better than (or nearly as good as) seems like overkill to me.

Noted, however

(1) You lose nothing with Ricky. We want to give him a 3 year deal. We can match his production instantly via free agency with a Pavano type with $8-10 million to spend. Losing Nolasco means nothing as long as we sign someone.

the trade then devolves into Morrison and an assortment of RP for Upton and whatever throw ins

(2) Upton will out slug Morrison by a fuck ton and will likely double Morrison's HR production longterm, and it's not like a .360 OBP is bad for Upton if that's what we want to use for sake of discussion
(3) Upton is a plus plus defensive outfielder, and Morrison is a neutral fielder or marginally above average at best
(4) Upton's on base production, not just steals, first to third/prowess, is considerably better and this adds up
(5) Upton is significantly more expensive over the next 5 years, but still has a reasonable contract if he can be in .850+ OPS land
(6) Upton has had a breakout year (2009), Morrison has not done that even with his very good half-season

I like LoMo, but there is much more growth potential in Upton. The only thing is, you better be damn sure Upton does not tank like his brother because that contract could hurt big time in a few years if Upton is more of 2010 than 2009, but I think he's going to be a manimal so not worried.

[Bobbob1313]

Fair enough, and I understand that Upton is already a stud defensively, too, but I'm just very wary of trading a potential stud in Morrison and a proven quality starter in Nolasco, regardless of whether or not we add a Pavano.

Upton is likely to be A LOT better than Morrison over the next 5 years. I love Nolasco, but I do that in a second.

[Valid]

Noted, however

(1) You lose nothing with Ricky. We want to give him a 3 year deal. We can match his production instantly via free agency with a Pavano type with $8-10 million to spend. Losing Nolasco means nothing as long as we sign someone.

the trade then devolves into Morrison and an assortment of RP for Upton and whatever throw ins

(2) Upton will out slug Morrison by a fuck ton and will likely double Morrison's HR production longterm, and it's not like a .360 OBP is bad for Upton if that's what we want to use for sake of discussion
(3) Upton is a plus plus defensive outfielder, and Morrison is a neutral fielder or marginally above average at best
(4) Upton's on base production, not just steals, first to third/prowess, is considerably better and this adds up
(5) Upton is significantly more expensive over the next 5 years, but still has a reasonable contract if he can be in .850+ OPS land
(6) Upton has had a breakout year (2009), Morrison has not done that even with his very good half-season

I like LoMo, but there is much more growth potential in Upton. The only thing is, you better be damn sure Upton does not tank like his brother because that contract could hurt big time in a few years if Upton is more of 2010 than 2009, but I think he's going to be a manimal so not worried.

Personally, I'd rather re-sign Nolasco and sign Pavano (we can afford both, correct?). Pavano as our fourth starter would be absolutely crazy.

Good points throughout the rest of your post, though.

[kylekash]

Personally, I'd rather re-sign Nolasco and sign Pavano (we can afford both, correct?). Pavano as our fourth starter would be absolutely crazy.

Good points throughout the rest of your post, though.

They only have 3-4 million left for budget right now according to some reports and Pavano is going to cost 8-10 mil, so no I don't think they could get both.

[Ramp]

I can't go in this thread anymore. Way too excited about Upton. I do not want to be let down.

[MiamiHomer]

I can't go in this thread anymore. Way too excited about Upton. I do not want to be let down.

Send out your little birdies to gather info on this Ramp. Get to it Matt!

[Ramp]

Oh, the birdies are out there. OUT THERE AND LOVIN IT!
--------------------
but seriously, out there

[Jewbility]

I won't let this happen.

[Ramp]

GTFO

[MiamiHomer]

I won't let this happen.

No fucking way.

This thread just got 1001039401349230x better.

[Valid]

The Diamondbacks have a lot of holes to fill, and the growing sense, from listening to club sources, is that the best way to address them might be to utilize their most valuable trade piece: Justin Upton.

Since GM Kevin Towers stated publicly earlier this week that he would be willing to listen to offers, he is said to have been bombarded with attention from interested teams.

Those teams, of course, were trying to gauge the Diamondbacks’ asking price, which is certain to be steep. The club will seek a package of at least four or five pieces, according to one club source, with perhaps three of those being big leaguers or big-league ready.

With holes in the bullpen, left field, first base and the starting rotation – and, of course, an Upton trade creating a new hole in right field – there’s no shortage of combinations the Diamondbacks could look for in return.

Is a huge haul realistic? That all depends on how you view Upton.

“The value is in the eye of the beholder,” said a scout with an NL team. “But I would guess they could get an established big leaguer, two top 10 prospects and a lower-level prospect.”

Said a different NL scout: “What if you got a Teixeira return? You’d do that in a second if you’re the Diamondbacks, wouldn’t you? I’d think you’d have to get a starting pitcher, a back-end bullpen piece and an everyday outfielder to start with.”

In a trade deadline deal in 2007, the Rangers received five players, including pitcher Neftali Feliz and shortstop Elvis Andrus, in exchange for first baseman Mark Teixeira and a reliever.

Teixeira was a much more established player than Upton is, but he had just 1 1/2 years left before free agency. Upton has five, and, at age 23, many believe he has yet to reach his potential.

“I’d think you’d have to get so many pieces back you’d have to be right on a few of them,” the scout continued. “You’d have to look at what your risk would be on each guy. You would have to have a guy in there where there’s not much risk on.”

An NL executive was skeptical that the Diamondbacks would get anything close to the return they’d seek in order to move him. And if they would, he believes it almost certainly would have to come from one of the two behemoths in the game.

“(Upton’s value is) less than what I’ve read about,” he said. “For one, he probably got overpaid. He’s got supreme talent, but his brother’s record isn’t helping him. He’s never gone to the next level. I don’t know. Maybe he needs a change of scenery.

“Some teams rely more on the scouts and the potential, especially if you’ve got money to spare.”

That, he said, leaves the Red Sox and the Yankees as clubs that could gamble on Upton’s future considering the price he’s locked in at. The executive noted that Upton will be making more than $14 million in each of the final two years of the six-year, $51.25 million deal he signed before this season.

“He might be worth $20 million then,” he said. “But if he’s a bust then somebody’s going to regret it. It’s a risk the Red Sox could take, a risk the Yankees could take. I don’t see any other team giving up a host of young guys for one young guy who hasn’t figured it out yet.”

Another executive landed in the middle, noting Upton’s tremendous potential but wondered whether a market would materialize.

“First and foremost, he’s a young, athletic, position player, right-handed hitter with power potential,” he said. “So what that represents is a big-time player.”

But, he noted, that Towers almost certainly isn’t looking for a package of A-ball prospects like the Rangers were willing to take with Teixeira. (Andrus and Feliz were low-level guys at the time of that deal.) As such, the Diamondbacks will be limiting the market.

“There’s still some uncertainty about Upton,” he said. “It’s been streaky. … I think they’re going to have trouble moving him for the package they want. But then again, he does represent something that’s very valuable in the industry, a right-handed impact bat.”

The contract might be an issue, as could the shoulder problem that kept Upton off the field for most of the final month of the season. The shoulder – a labrum tear that resurfaced from an original injury more than 4 ½ years ago – did not require surgery.

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blo...Piecoro/107064