Miami Herald: Payroll is Going Up in 2012

[Big Z]

I agree, there are better resources out there than Uggla for $10 million.

[lou]

For the money it'd take to get Crawford, you can get Cliff Lee and probably have some cash left over (with the way Lee's finished, I think he gets a 4 year deal, Crawford may get 7).

Neither's happening, but you blow your load on a starter.

Chance of return on a hitter is far more though. If we're legitimately going to give out a $120-150 million contract, it's got to be a hitter. This organization learned that lesson already with Alex Fernandez (which was a huge deal at the time). I know it's fantasy land with these two, but I'm just saying. Buy bats, develop arms.

[Swifty]

100% in agreement with you on theory. That's how you build an organization ground up.

I think that with us, for this finite span of Hanley-JJ-Stanton-Logan-Maybin-Coghlan all together and all cheap we get so much better with that legit 1A starter than we do that top end position player.

Going forward though, and for building a new nucleus, I completely agree with you. Pay the position players, develop pitchers.

[tjfla]

How long have they been sitting on this story? The FO said this in Dec/Jan and again when Bobby V was talking to become the manager


Next year we are not spending however the following year we are spending. Remember most of us had a good laugh about them them having a bigger payroll and spending 10 million a year on a 32 yr old 2B.

[Ramp]

Sometimes I'm really in love with you.

You should see him in person. Such a statistical dreamboat.

[lou]

The problem is 2012 free agency is terrible besides Adrian and Prince, and those guys are 10/$200 and the Marlins have two capable 1B club controlled for 5 more years. And a sidenote, Uggla has the same WAR as Prince this season, so if we are going to commit here, it's pretty much Adrian and you know someone is trading for him and signing him before he hits the market. There is nothing to really spend on here. My next 20 favorite free agents, no order:

Dan Uggla
Rickie Weeks
Mark DeRosa
Aramis Ramirez
Jose Bautista
Ryan Ludwick
Josh Willingham
Conor Jackson
Mark Buerhle
Edwin Jackson
Joel Pinerio
Wandy Rodriguez
CJ Wilson
Heath Bell
Jon Broxton
Matt Capps
Ryan Franklin
Ryan Madson
Jon Papelbon
Michael Wuertz

Fucking literally. These are all complimentary pieces you overspend on, which is why we haven't signed Uggla in the first place. Do we want Uggla at $12 million and Wandy at $14 million a year in 2012-2014, when we could have Crawford at $18, an innings eater at $5, and whatever Uggla brings back in trade?

If you're committed to spending money, I think you go big on one of the two superstars, Crawford or Lee, right now and make your statement one year early. They can field that team at $50 million in 2011 getting rid of Uggla, Nunez, Paulino, and A. Miller, and replacing them with CC options. I don't think anyone would cry about this.

2011

C Club Controlled/Unknown $410,000
1B Logan Morrison $410,000
2B Chris Coghlan $600,000
3B Emilio Bonifacio $420,000
SS Hanley Ramirez $11,000,000
LF Carl Crawford $12,000,000
CF Cameron Maybin $420,000
RF Mike Stanton $420,000
B Wes Helms $1,000,000
B Veteran lefty who plays 3B/Tracy $750,000 (or keep Gaby, but I suspect that would create problems unless he can man 3B for real)
B Hayes/Davis/Baker $420,000
B Cousins/Petersen/Carroll/other $410,000
B Veteran Backup IF/Barden $500,000

SP Josh Johnson $7,750,000
SP Ricky Nolasco $6,000,000
SP Anibal Sanchez $2,250,000
SP Chris Volstad $430,000
SP Sean West $420,000
RP Clay Hensley $1,000,000
RP Brian Sanches $430,000
RP Alejandro Sanabia $410,000
RP Veteran Lefty/Ohman $1,000,000
RP Veteran Righty/Veras $750,000
RP Club Controlled $410,000
RP Club Controlled $410,000

$50,020,000

Trades - Uggla, Gaby, Nunez, Paulino, A. Miller, and nominal pieces, which could turn into the catcher and bullpen very quickly
Mid season potential call ups - DOMINGUEZ (how perfect is that), Ceda, Marinez, Jennings, Hand

Crawford is low, I know. But scale the pay $12-15-18-20-22-21-18 (7/$126, 18 million year) creatively and shit gets done. New ballpark, gets Hanley, Johnson, Stanton, LoMo, Lebron, South Beach, aging Phillies and Mets teams, a 3 years away Nationals team, and the Braves are a toss up if they can develop some more around the pitching. There is a lot to like here if Loria is committed to moving to mid range payroll in 2012. They can handle the three big contracts, multiple arbitration year to years, and pick up 3-5 veteran arms/bench guys with that kind of payroll.

Just saying! If you're going to spend, spend now. Overpay. Generate buzz. Do whatever you can and get him (or Cliff Lee under the same theory, just obviously reorganizing the lineup with Gaby instead of Crawford). The money can work out, just clear house of all the other guys and what have you really lost? Crawford will make up for all weaknesses at 3B and C, and whose to say Dominguez and some young kid/Baker, don't just fix that by the summer.

Now what they should do, and what they will do, are totally different things. But there is no excuse not to go big right now. Payroll is NOT an excuse. Next year's guys suck for us. These two, are the ones worth the cash.

[lou]

double posted, erased it

[Ralph]

That outfield would save the pitching staff a billion runz.

[Swifty]

A good catcher and that lou team probably wins 90-95 games.

That'd be fun.

[wanks1212]

Only if Volstad or West breaks out. I don't see a team with the 2010 versions of Volstad/West in the rotation, a patchwork bullpen (which the above bullpen would be), and Emilio in the everyday lineup winning 95 games, no matter how much the Crawford addition/full season of Stanton and Logan help the offense.

I think they're another 83-88 win team as long as Volstad and West are still pitching like clowns and the bullpen is led by the likes of Hensley, Sanches, and Veras. The team would probably be alot like the '09 team in terms of their production.