Marlins Fire Fredi Gonzalez, Jim Presley, Carlos Tosca

[Bobbob1313]

He retired.

[Valid]

Did he really? Didn't know that.

[FishFanInPA]

now he did....in the offseason he was available.

[Valid]

Well, the fact that he retired should probably tell you something.

[Bobbob1313]

Washburn has been exceptionally mediocre for a few years now and was dreadful after the trade last season. If you take out the pre trade deadline numbers fro last year, his era since 2006 is 4.75.

and he wanted at least $5m.

[nny]

I want John Smoltz

[Bobbob1313]

So let's say we went out and spent a total of $8 mil and got Livan, Smoltz, and like Matt Capps.

Do we really think that team is significantly better? Are we then OK with saying the season is ending in a pile?

[MiamiHomer]

So let's say we went out and spent a total of $8 mil and got Livan, Smoltz, and like Matt Capps.

Do we really think that team is significantly better? Are we then OK with saying the season is ending in a pile?

I'd go out on a limb and say we would be in way better shape.

[Valid]

I'd go out on a limb and say we would be in way better shape.

Hindsight is 20/20.

[FishFanInPA]

Yeah, signing Livan before the season began wouldnt have made that much of a ripple on this team. No shot before the season began, we'd think he's be doing this.

[Ramp]

Let me break down that list for you:

Bedard: injury-prone schlep who hasn't thrown 100 innings since 2007; you really want to pay him the kind of money he was probably asking for?

Garland: okay; I'll give you him.

Duchscherer: you already said it.

Harden: similar to Bedard except that he has actually pitched a decent amount of innings the last couple of seasons. Again, especially knowing that we needed money to lock up Johnson, did you want to pay him what he was asking for?

Livan: LOL. Come on. Livan could not even stay in the Mets' joke of a starting rotation last year. Yes, he's having a good season this year, but I guarantee you that if we would have signed him, you would have been complaining.

Pedro: you said it yourself. He's "still" available. Don't you think there's a reason why?

Pavano: I'll give you that.

Penny: he's having a good season this year, but please explain to me how how his previous few seasons were any better than Nate's?

Sheets: do I even need to explain this?

Lackey: are you SERIOUS? I know you're upset about the FO being cheap, but come on; this is overkill.

And what "bridge" to get to Leo Nunez? How many times do I have to say that bullpens are a COMPLETE crapshoot (save for a select few relievers)? You keep saying that Hensley is going to come back down to earth when, for all we know, he might follow in the same footsteps as Gardner and Nelson and remain reliable all year long.
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Yeah, just like every other bullpen in baseball.

Bedard signed for under $2mil.
Duchs was awesome until he got hurt.
You give Harden a one year deal and try catching lightning in a bottle. He's got as good a stuff as anyone out there.

Livan well... I just like the guy. Prob wouldn't have made a difference but he is pitching pretty damn well so far. More like me playing the result at this point. Shouldn't have listed him.

Pedro is still available. But he's gonna sign in the next 8 weeks. If we sign him in that span, I'll be more than happy. But we won't. We won't even talk to him or even look up his baseball-ref page.

Brad Penny sucked finishing his year in LA and then Boston. But on the same token, he was a completely different pitcher with the Giants to end the season. His velo was up and his command was much improved. Would have absolutely been excited if he ended up here for Opening Day '10.

Ben Sheets... yea explain that. Unless you are suggesting his salary was too high, then fine. But I'd like to see the front office show me/us some effort that they are atleast looking to bring in a guy to establish the rotation as having no major holes in it. I fully believed this division was there for the taking heading into the season if we made a move or two. That hasn't happened yet.

As for bullpens... the following teams have 2-3-4 arms in their pen that most would suggest are good or better, it's no surprise that most of these teams are above .500 (or close enough)

Red Sox, Yankees, Mets, Braves, Tigers, Dodgers, Twins (and they lost that Nathan guy), A's, Phillies, Padres, Giants, Cardinals, Rangers

What I'm saying is that bullpens don't have to be a crapshoot if you get some good solid arms in their to begin with.

[Bobbob1313]

I'd go out on a limb and say we would be in way better shape.

I'm not asking that.

It's opening day. David Samson just said "The season will end in a pile".

We have livan in our 5th spot and capps and Smoltz in the pen.

Are we still making the "lol samson loves dudes in piles" jokes?

[MiamiHomer]

I'm playing the results of their current season...

[Ramp]

So let's say we went out and spent a total of $8 mil and got Livan, Smoltz, and like Matt Capps.

Do we really think that team is significantly better? Are we then OK with saying the season is ending in a pile?

Absolutely.
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Well, I have a problem with the Marlins' president saying these things to begin with. But that's another story.

[Valid]

Bedard signed for under $2mil.
Duchs was awesome until he got hurt.
You give Harden a one year deal and try catching lightning in a bottle. He's got as good a stuff as anyone out there.

Livan well... I just like the guy. Prob wouldn't have made a difference but he is pitching pretty damn well so far. More like me playing the result at this point. Shouldn't have listed him.

Pedro is still available. But he's gonna sign in the next 8 weeks. If we sign him in that span, I'll be more than happy. But we won't. We won't even talk to him or even look up his baseball-ref page.

Brad Penny sucked finishing his year in LA and then Boston. But on the same token, he was a completely different pitcher with the Giants to end the season. His velo was up and his command was much improved. Would have absolutely been excited if he ended up here for Opening Day '10.

Ben Sheets... yea explain that. Unless you are suggesting his salary was too high, then fine. But I'd like to see the front office show me/us some effort that they are atleast looking to bring in a guy to establish the rotation as having no major holes in it. I fully believed this division was there for the taking heading into the season if we made a move or two. That hasn't happened yet.

As for bullpens... the following teams have 2-3-4 arms in their pen that most would suggest are good or better, it's no surprise that most of these teams are above .500 (or close enough)

Red Sox, Yankees, Mets, Braves, Tigers, Dodgers, Twins (and they lost that Nathan guy), A's, Phillies, Padres, Giants, Cardinals, Rangers

What I'm saying is that bullpens don't have to be a crapshoot if you get some good solid arms in their to begin with.

Bedard: yeah; $2 mil for a guy who might never throw 100 innings again.

Harden: you're also risking paying a decent sum of money for a guy who might blow out his arm in April.

Sheets: the DL could essentially be named after him, and then when you take into account the amount he was asking for, hell no.

Yeah, and just about EVERY one of those teams you mentioned caught lightning in a bottle with a good portion of their relievers.

Good, consistent bullpen arms aren't exactly a common commodity.
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I'm playing the results of their current season...

Well, this discussion is not about the results of the current season.