Mike Stanton Wants to Be a Major Leaguer Now

[Swifty]

There's no way Stanton makes the club (barring a rash of injuries) right?

[Bobbob1313]

I can't see any way he does.

He's going to have to absolutely embaress people in AA this season to make it up before rosters expand.

[Swifty]

I dunno if he has to embarrass people, between what he showed in his short lived fall league stint and now, you figure he's likely already able to put together a low .700 ML OPS.

[Bobbob1313]

Arbitration. No matter what, he stays down until June. There's nothing wrong with seeing 200 more PAs at AA. 23 PAs in Arizona and 12 in Spring Training isn't enough.

He doesn't turn 21 until November and he's only seen 341 PAs above A ball. Preferably, keep him down all year in AA, if he kills it there, let him get 150 PAs at the end of the year in AAA and then start him in AAA next year. He'll still be 21 when he makes the majors on that timeline.

He might be ready to contribute, but why not keep him down until there's nothing left to learn? He's still a baby, there's no need to rush him. See what Peterson and Cousins can give you first, at least.

[Nick]

Arbitration. No matter what, he stays down until June. There's nothing wrong with seeing 200 more PAs at AA. 23 PAs in Arizona and 12 in Spring Training isn't enough.

He doesn't turn 21 until November and he's only seen 341 PAs above A ball. Preferably, keep him down all year in AA, if he kills it there, let him get 150 PAs at the end of the year in AAA and then start him in AAA next year. He'll still be 21 when he makes the majors on that timeline.

He might be ready to contribute, but why not keep him down until there's nothing left to learn? He's still a baby, there's no need to rush him. See what Peterson and Cousins can give you first, at least.

If he gives us a better chance to win then he should be up with us. Simple as that.

[Bobbob1313]

If he gives us a better chance to win then he should be up with us. Simple as that.

It depends on a number of things. How sure you are he gives you a better chance and how much of a better chance he gives you.

If we're talking about the difference being like playing Bonifacio in RF or Stanton, then yeah. Let Stanton play.

But it can be reasonably assumed that he does not represent a major upgrade over anyone we have right now, so there's absolutely no reason to call him up.

We have Coghlan, Maybin, Cody, Carrol, Cousins and Petersen who should all probably get a shot before Stanton does, unless, like I said, he embaresses people.

He's a long term piece, and he should be handled with kid gloves, in my opinion. You can't really hurt a player's development by keeping them down too long.

[Nick]

It depends on a number of things. How sure you are he gives you a better chance and how much of a better chance he gives you.

If we're talking about the difference being like playing Bonifacio in RF or Stanton, then yeah. Let Stanton play.

But it can be reasonably assumed that he does not represent a major upgrade over anyone we have right now, so there's absolutely no reason to call him up.

We have Coghlan, Maybin, Cody, Carrol, Cousins and Petersen who should all probably get a shot before Stanton does, unless, like I said, he embaresses people.

He's a long term piece, and he should be handled with kid gloves, in my opinion. You can't really hurt a player's development by keeping them down too long.

Definitely that's what needs to be determined. I'm just saying that if he is clearly the best option we have at corner outfield positions than he needs to be up here. If he's clearly the best option and clearly ready to play at the major league level there's no way you can hurt his development by calling him up.

Now I don't believe he'd be an upgrade to Ross at any point this season, but if there should be some sort of injury that opens up a spot, we shouldn't be shy about calling him up if indeed he proves himself to be major league ready. Keeping him down to see if Cousins or Petersen are any good is silly if he is clearly a superior player now and in the future.

[Bobbob1313]

Definitely that's what needs to be determined. I'm just saying that if he is clearly the best option we have at corner outfield positions than he needs to be up here. If he's clearly the best option and clearly ready to play at the major league level there's no way you can hurt his development by calling him up.

Now I don't believe he'd be an upgrade to Ross at any point this season, but if there should be some sort of injury that opens up a spot, we shouldn't be shy about calling him up if indeed he proves himself to be major league ready. Keeping him down to see if Cousins or Petersen are any good is silly if he is clearly a superior player now and in the future.

I think you can absolutely mess up a player's development by calling him up too soon. That's why he has to prove he's major league ready. I don't think he's proven that yet.

Stanton has a higher ceiling than Petersen or Cousins, but that means there is more risk in messing up his development. You call a Cousins or Petersen up to get slaughtered before you risk it with Stanton.

It's like Logan vs. Gaby, but way more extreme. You've got some organizational depth, with the high ceiling guy further away. Rather than rush him, why not see what you've got. Let Logan and Stanton mash in the minors, delay their arbitration, and let natural attrition get them to the big league club.

We need Stanton for 2012-2016, not 2010.

[Nick]

I agree you can mess up a player by calling him up too soon, I'm saying is if he continues to rake in ST and is putting up a .900+ OPS in AA or AAA and it's around midseason, you're not going to mess up his development by calling him up, because his abilities have exceeded those levels. If Petersen and Cousins are having similar years to Stanton than sure call them up instead.

All I'm saying is call the guy up that will clearly give you the most production. Stanton's numbers will dictate whether he is ready or not, so don't stick a predetermined timetable on the guy, or have his development determined by the arbitration calendar.

[lou]

I agree you can mess up a player by calling him up too soon, I'm saying is if he continues to rake in ST and is putting up a .900+ OPS in AA or AAA and it's around midseason, you're not going to mess up his development by calling him up, because his abilities have exceeded those levels. If Petersen and Cousins are having similar years to Stanton than sure call them up instead.

All I'm saying is call the guy up that will clearly give you the most production. Stanton's numbers will dictate whether he is ready or not, so don't stick a predetermined timetable on the guy, or have his development determined by the arbitration calendar.

Keeping him down till midseason IS the arbitration calendar though. I don't think anyone will complain if Stanton is .310/.410/.600 in Jax to bring him up if we have an outfielder struggling in June (and Petersen/Cousins don't look like better immediate options). or Vice Versa with Logan in June after 200 PA or whatever. I think, even if he/they hit .500 this spring, it's to soon because he/they need to be exposed to more of the minors. Let alone the added financial benefit. Which is really enormous because Bob is right, we need Stanton in 2012-2015 more than this year. 2010 is all about the SP growing up, or not.

[Nick]

I'm 100% with you that he shouldn't make the team out of spring. I'm just saying that if we're in a playoff race this season and a situation arises where Stanton has proved that he could help us right now and a spot opens up for him, then 2010 becomes more important than 2012-2015 and everything should be done to win now.

Plus if it is determined that he's ready enough to help us now then I can't see how bringing him up would hurt his development. The situation where it's going to hurt his development is if he's having an average to above average year in the minors and he's brought up out of desperation, he's the only option we have, and fails when he hits the majors. I just can't see that happening with the depth we have at corner outfield so that shouldn't be an issue.

[lou]

I'm 100% with you that he shouldn't make the team out of spring. I'm just saying that if we're in a playoff race this season and a situation arises where Stanton has proved that he could help us right now and a spot opens up for him, then 2010 becomes more important than 2012-2015 and everything should be done to win now.

Plus if it is determined that he's ready enough to help us now then I can't see how bringing him up would hurt his development. The situation where it's going to hurt his development is if he's having an average to above average year in the minors and he's brought up out of desperation, he's the only option we have, and fails when he hits the majors. I just can't see that happening with the depth we have at corner outfield so that shouldn't be an issue.

Yea, but it's still growth and excelling in the minors doesn't mean an instant and smooth transition to the big leagues. Even Stanton rocketing AA, might not mean he's ready and a rush to the bigs could hurt (although he seems to be very mature for a 20 year old from all the reports on him). I think it's better safe than sorry to leave them down so they come up awesome like Ryan Howard/Andrew McCutchen, then rush prospects because you hope they immediately turn into Chris Coghlan. More likely than not, they come up like Hermida or Maybin. And yes, I completely agree our MLB outfield depth, coupled with Petersen, Cousins, and potentially Morrison, for OF spots renders Stanton most likely out of the picture for 2010.

[Swifty]

Stanton's numbers will dictate whether he is ready or not, so don't stick a predetermined timetable on the guy, or have his development determined by the arbitration calendar.

Ding ding ding

[Bobbob1313]

Mike Stanton is probably never going to have a season like Matt Wieters' 2008 in the minors. And they left him down in AAA to see another level, get more at bats, and to delay his arbitration clock. It's good policy for a number of reasons.

Assuming we have no major holes in our outfield, I say let him stay down and get at least to AAA, no matter how good he's hitting. There's no negative to letting him stay down all year and half of next year, no matter how well he hits. He'll still be 21 by then.

Sure, you don't say this is the only plan, things happen, but assuming there's no real need for him and you aren't getting terrible play from your outfielders, keep him down as long as you can for a number of reasons.

It's better to be safe than sorry with prospects. I'm happy they didn't bring Maybin up in 2008 until the end even though we had a need, and I'm happy we didn't leave him up this year to get slaughtered.

Maybe he kills it in AA this year and you give him a shot at the start of next year. But you'd better have a quick leash with him like they did with Maybin. We don't have a black hole of an affiliate in AAA anymore, you can actually send people there.

[Swifty]

THe problem with that mindset is as much as you say he's on his own schedule, you're still sending him to AAA regardless and saying we'll see you in 2012.

Let's say Stanton finishes with a strong spring, goes to AA puts up numbers you'd expect of him, and come June 1 Maybin sucks or is hurt, or Ross' hammy finally comes back to haunt him, or Gaby or Morrison is ineffective at the ML level and the other isn't setting AAA on fire.

Then what do you do? Do you bring him up? I say that he is rapidly placing himself into the "first to get the call for long term injury or ineffectiveness" camp, and that's A-OK with me. Given what we have at the ML level, he doesn't need to break camp with us, but if something funny happens on the way to awesome, I would hope that Stanton is the first guy we look to to pick up 250-350 AB's.

I know that instinctively the call is for Carroll, but good ML teams often have enough talent to fill in a lost starter (not a star, a starter) but the problem is almost always not how to replace the starter, but rather how to replace the player that replaced the starter. Carroll's got a nice niche as a 4th OF guy and lefty starter (and he should stick there), Cousins or Petersen can be the 15 day DL replacement, but Stanton almost has to be the answer if someone gets seriously hurt or seriously sucks.