Extending Johnson is Marlins' "top Priority" This Offseason

[Metes]

He has a $2.6 club option for '10, so he'd have to not find another team that will beat $950k. I think he gon'

[lou]

He has a $2.6 club option for '10, so he'd have to not find another team that will beat $950k. I think he gon'

I'm aware of all contractual issues, but the thing is that will be declined and no one will give him anything resembling that in FA. I bet the Marlins offer him something like 2/$2.6 and he'd really have to think hard about that.

Getting rid of Uggla, Cantu, Hermida, and Nunez, keeping the starters, Lindstrom, and Ross, produces about a $33+ million team. There is money here for a million bucks to Gload, while finding a $2-3 million 3B.

[Metes]

Right, I meant that the option is declined and he'd get offered a Helms deal. You don't think he can get $1m in FA?

[nny]

He has a $2.6 club option for '10, so he'd have to not find another team that will beat $950k. I think he gon'

we can renogitate the contract so he never touches free agency
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Right, I meant that the option is declined and he'd get offered a Helms deal. You don't think he can get $1m in FA?

over 2 years no

also for clarification for my first post I thought you meant that since we wouldn't be able to sign him until like May 15th if we declined option and he became fa he wouldn't be here

[Todd]

If Volstad bounces back, a buyout like the Cardinals gave Wainwright would be great for him if they decided to keep some consistency in the pitching staff. However, the Cardinals got a major steal on that deal(6 years, $36 million total if both options are exercised) and might not be enough to buy out JJ.

[Swifty]

Locking ourselves into Volstad, long term, is a bad idea unless we're going to adopt a $80 millionish budget going into the new facility.

I think, short term, you say your top 3 is JJ, Nolasco and likely Sanchez. You have 4 guys (Volstad, RVH, Miller, West) fight for the last 2 spots. Another 2 years out, unless we're already conceding Ricky's departure, we're going to have at least another 3 arms to add to this list. I don't think a budget conscious team can lock itself into a player where, let's be honest, you have comparable replacement talent. Coming up, no one talked about Volstad's "stuff" it was his ability to get ground balls and log innings. He's not a true sinkerballer, and as such, you really have to wonder if his two seamer translates to the major league level since he certainly doesn't throw a heavy ball.

[nny]

Coming up, no one talked about Volstad's "stuff" it was his ability to get ground balls and log innings. He's not a true sinkerballer, and as such, you really have to wonder if his two seamer translates to the major league level since he certainly doesn't throw a heavy ball.

My question is, did we change him? This seriously might be a case of Wiley fucking with him (or someone else, but Wiley's the easy target).

A normal legit sinker ball pitcher (we're talking 60%+ GBs, the Wangs, the Webbs, the Lowe's) throws their fastball around 75% of the time.

Volstad? Just 65%. We're talking of some ~300 less fastballs over a year. And, I mean, he was 57% GB in the minors. It's quite a huge change he's had in the majors. Maybe MILB hitters just simply kept getting ontop of his curveball and change up aswell? But then why did scouts type-cast him as a sinker ball pitcher?

FWIW's though, I don't really know how they come about it so I don't normally use it, but going by Fan Graph's pitch type runs, Volstad's fastball is what got him killed this year, and was his worst pitch last year too. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx...on=P#pitchtype

[Todd]

Volstad might of been putting too much pressure on himself to live up to his rookie year as well and overthrew alot.

I dont know how you could trust Sanchez over Volstad at this point, Swift. Volstad is 2 years younger, I personally dont think Sanchez's stuff is any better than Volstads, and Volstad doesnt have Sanchez's history injury or future risk.

[Beef]

I trust Sanchez more

[nny]

I trust Volstad more to be a mainstay mid-to-back rotation guy

He doesn't touch Anibal's potential though.

[Todd]

I guess I have just never been as high on Sanchez as others, even before his injuries.

[nny]

More food for thought with Wiley fucking with Volstad.

In his first 4 ML starts, he had a GB% of 60%.

The rest of the 08 season, 51%. This season, it was 50%.

SAMPLE SIZE ALERT obviously but still. When he was first here, he got GBs like he did in the minors. More work with ML coaching, it goes down.

I'm going to check with brook pitch fx to see if he was throwing more FB then

[Swifty]

My question is, did we change him? This seriously might be a case of Wiley fucking with him (or someone else, but Wiley's the easy target).

A normal legit sinker ball pitcher (we're talking 60%+ GBs, the Wangs, the Webbs, the Lowe's) throws their fastball around 75% of the time.

Volstad? Just 65%. We're talking of some ~300 less fastballs over a year. And, I mean, he was 57% GB in the minors. It's quite a huge change he's had in the majors. Maybe MILB hitters just simply kept getting ontop of his curveball and change up aswell? But then why did scouts type-cast him as a sinker ball pitcher?

FWIW's though, I don't really know how they come about it so I don't normally use it, but going by Fan Graph's pitch type runs, Volstad's fastball is what got him killed this year, and was his worst pitch last year too. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx...on=P#pitchtype

I don't think we tweaked his delivery. I think the problem is, aside from a fastball that's mostly flat, he doesn't repeat his release point. It's not that his delivery changes, it's that he'll come to 3/4 for his curveball and stay over the top for his fastball. Maybe the best thing to do would be to try him 3/4 all the time, but if he's that tall, having the over the top delivery really benefits him as it makes the fastball deceptively fast (although, yes, I realize it's not doing anything for him now).

[nny]

More food for thought with Wiley fucking with Volstad.

In his first 4 ML starts, he had a GB% of 60%.

The rest of the 08 season, 51%. This season, it was 50%.

SAMPLE SIZE ALERT obviously but still. When he was first here, he got GBs like he did in the minors. More work with ML coaching, it goes down.

I'm going to check with brook pitch fx to see if he was throwing more FB then

That'd be a negative. Still threw his FB only 63% of the time in those 4 starts. so sample size.
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I don't think we tweaked his delivery. I think the problem is, aside from a fastball that's mostly flat, he doesn't repeat his release point. It's not that his delivery changes, it's that he'll come to 3/4 for his curveball and stay over the top for his fastball. Maybe the best thing to do would be to try him 3/4 all the time, but if he's that tall, having the over the top delivery really benefits him as it makes the fastball deceptively fast (although, yes, I realize it's not doing anything for him now).

My point wasn't his delivery, it's that sinker ball pitchers throw fast balls a lot more then he does, which would partly explain his much lower than expected GB% (after all, the things being beat into the ground are fast balls, less fast balls = less ground balls)

[Swifty]

But the problem with Volstad isn't that he's not throwing more fastballs, his 4 seamer sucks and his 2 seamer doesn't get enough ground balls, to me, the problem is it's very easy to layoff his curveball and his changeup is pretty much a non-factor. I don't think it's that he's not throwing it enough, I think the problem is he basically has one somewhat effective pitch, and 2 if he can locate his curveball well.