Marlins 2017-2018 Offseason Discussion Thread

[tjfla]

Well, if Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Dispatch says it's true, I guess I shouldn't argue with him, lol. A good FO doesn't get held hostage by this, plain and simple. You do not have to trade him. If you can make Stanton believe that is a real option, you take back some control. You're never going to be able to trade him to any team you like, but letting his value plummet by letting him dictate only 2 options, is not doing your job.

Guess u read the article

As Avila’s and the 29 other front offices gathered Monday at the Waldorf Astoria Orlando for the start of baseball’s GM meetings, the only presence bigger than slugger Giancarlo Stanton’s availability via trade is his no-trade clause. As one agent said in the hotel lobby Monday: “He has all the power; they have none.”

Derrick Goold didn't say it everyone(agents/teams/reporters) at the meetings did. I just put it because no one believes it when one person says something

[sports24/7]

Guess u read the article

As Avila’s and the 29 other front offices gathered Monday at the Waldorf Astoria Orlando for the start of baseball’s GM meetings, the only presence bigger than slugger Giancarlo Stanton’s availability via trade is his no-trade clause. As one agent said in the hotel lobby Monday: “He has all the power; they have none.”

Derrick Goold didn't say it everyone(agents/teams/reporters) at the meetings did. I just put it because no one believes it when one person says something

One agent said that according to Goold. And even if that's the perception, that doesn't make it so. If Stanton truly had all of the power, he'd be a lock to go to the Dodgers or Giants. Miami wouldn't even be talking to anyone else, which reportedly is not the case. Again, maybe this front office is just as bad as the previous one, but a player with a long term should not have "all the power", if you have a good FO.

[fish16]

Well, if Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Dispatch says it's true, I guess I shouldn't argue with him, lol. A good FO doesn't get held hostage by this, plain and simple. You do not have to trade him. If you can make Stanton believe that is a real option, you take back some control. You're never going to be able to trade him to any team you like, but letting his value plummet by letting him dictate only 2 options, is not doing your job.

exactly my point as to why he does hold a lot of power, but the marlins do too. He has already publicly lost leverage because he stated he doesnt want to be in a rebuilding situation. If he plays hardball and severely diminishes our potential return, he can stay here and be a fan favorite on a terrible team and opt out in a few years or just wait it out till the rebuild is complete and we are good again.

Stanton holds all the power if you operate under the assumption that we have to trade him this offseason and will trade him this offseason no matter what. That's not the case. If we cant find the right deal or he fucks us around and overplays his hand, he can rot in RF for a terrible team for a few years.

[tjfla]

Joe FrisaroVerified account
@JoeFrisaro

Source: Outfield prospect Heliot Ramos, #SFGiants No. 4 prospect according to @MLBPipeline is being discussed as a potential trade piece in a deal for Giancarlo Stanton. The Giants are among at least 4 teams interested in Stanton.

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Of course other stuff would be in it but Heliot Ramos has been the main guy if we deal with SF. Looks like if SF can trade a ML guy for some young cheap pieces we could be seeing a 3 way with Stanton to SF as they have the inside track cause they are on his trade list

Also before people sh*t on Ramos. He is only 18 and far off(3 years atleast-2020) but probably should have been the AZL MVP as a 17 yr old

http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp...tting/2017/ALL

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https://www.fanragsports.com/heyman-...-want-stanton/

The Marlins are also talking to teams about star second baseman Dee Gordon and also third baseman Martin Prado, and perhaps some relievers, as they endeavor to cut payroll and rebuild for the future.

[tjfla]

Giants plan seems to be try to trade Cueto or Samardzija for a young ML ready player and/or prospects that the Marlins like then flip them along with Heliot Ramos and 1 or 2 more prospects(Arroyo,Shaw,Suarez,Beede,or whoever else we like-they don't have high end BUT we have interest in a few of their minor league guys)

Maybe Minnesota/Milwaukee/St Louis would like one of them instead of 100+ mil for Darvish/Arrietta? All 3 have Top end prospects and young ML ready players that we love and have tried to get before

[fish16]

Giants plan seems to be try to trade Cueto or Samardzija for a young ML ready player and/or prospects that the Marlins like then flip them along with Heliot Ramos and 1 or 2 more prospects(Arroyo,Shaw,Suarez,Beede,or whoever else we like-they don't have high end BUT we have interest in a few of their minor league guys)

Maybe Minnesota/Milwaukee/St Louis would like one of them instead of 100+ mil for Darvish/Arrietta? All 3 have Top end prospects and young ML ready players

Going back to that fake cubs trade talked about, if the cubs can get someone like Cueto or Shark back and give up Happ, a package of Happ, Ramos, Arroyo, and Beede isnt terrible in the slightest relatively speaking.

Or maybe, since the cubs need pitching too, they can be involved in a Straily deal too and maybe send Schwarber this way and he could be our 1b for the next few years? He's a DH but his hitting ability is worth it if he can play a reasonable 1b. Schwarber, Happ, Ramos, Beede, and maybe one more guy for Straily and Stanton? Dont know how realistic that is but id be cool with that. Then trade Gordon, Bour, Ozuna, Bearclaw, etc for prospects? Id like that team.

I do like Ramos though. He seems like a player.

[tjfla]

Going back to that fake cubs trade talked about, if the cubs can get someone like Cueto or Shark back and give up Happ, a package of Happ, Ramos, Arroyo, and Beede isnt terrible in the slightest relatively speaking.

Or maybe, since the cubs need pitching too, they can be involved in a Straily deal too and maybe send Schwarber this way and he could be our 1b for the next few years? He's a DH but his hitting ability is worth it if he can play a reasonable 1b. Schwarber, Happ, Ramos, Beede, and maybe one more guy for Straily and Stanton? Dont know how realistic that is but id be cool with that. Then trade Gordon, Bour, Ozuna, Bearclaw, etc for prospects? Id like that team.

I do like Ramos though. He seems like a player.

Thats what they seem to be trying to do. Trade 3 or 4 of their own prospects and then a SP for more from another team. We could actually get between 5-7 players for Stanton even tho not exactly "high end"

Doubtful SF wants to lose a contract if they get Stanton that's why they are so interested in it. They get rid of a SP that costs 20 million+ and get things that help them get Stanton

The question is for all these teams is do u wanna pay 5/100+ for a FA or 60-80 million for a SF SP?

[fish16]

Thats what they seem to be trying to do. Trade 3 or 4 of their own prospects and then a SP for more from another team. We could actually get between 5-7 players for Stanton even tho not exactly "high end"

Doubtful SF wants to lose a contract if they get Stanton that's why they are so interested in it. They get rid of a SP that costs 20 million+ and get things that help them get Stanton

The question is for all these teams is do u wanna pay 5/100+ for a FA or 60-80 million for a SF SP?

I doubt Samardzjia or cueto have much value right now, though.

[sports24/7]

Heliot Ramos and the package they'd get for Cueto is a poor return for Stanton. But I'm sure that's what this front office will get. I can't wait for more of the same under this ownership group. I guess we're going to have to hope they can turn some of the high picks they'll inevitably have over the next several years into good players.

[tjfla]

I doubt Samardzjia or cueto have much value right now, though.

Just say St Louis misses out on a Top 3 FA SP u don't think they would look out to SF and say wanna try a 3 way with Miami??

SF-Stanton
St Louis-Cueto/Ziegler(cash)
Miami-Heliot Ramos,Christian Arroyo,Andrew Suarez,Dakota Hudson,Junior Fernandez,OF from St Louis,and low level prospects

Same with Milwaukee or Minnesota who already have said they want a Front end SP. U arent getting Top prospects back but u can get some solid stuff

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Heliot Ramos and the package they'd get for Cueto is a poor return for Stanton. But I'm sure that's what this front office will get. I can't wait for more of the same under this ownership group. I guess we're going to have to hope they can turn some of the high picks they'll inevitably have over the next several years into good players.

Well Boston has turned attention to JD Martinez,he still hasn't said Yes to St Louis and no chance in hell he goes to Philly(4 teams in on him-SF,St Louis,Boston,Philly). So options are SF or stays in Miami

From Heyman article-“Stay tuned,” an executive with another team said. “They are serious about moving this deal.”

The Marlins are thought to most prefer pitchers back in return, but Marlins people are open to any sort of talent, as they want to bolster an overall depth issue – and cut expense.

I know its only 1 executive and quality over quantity!!!

[fish16]

I just dont think those teams would give up much for the cueto or Samardjia deal. Look how bad the Samadzjia deal is. And cueto was really bad last year.

[tjfla]

I just dont think those teams would give up much for the cueto or Samardjia deal. Look how bad the Samadzjia deal is. And cueto was really bad last year.

That much? Its pretty much what we gave up for Straily LY. The only difference is St Louis gives up 1 of their 8 MLB Ready OF's and gets Brad Ziegler for 3 million

2 AA SP and a MLB Ready OF for a proven #2/3 SP who doesn't cost over 100 million

[fish16]

That much? Its pretty much what we gave up for Straily LY. The only difference is St Louis gives up 1 of their 8 MLB Ready OF's and gets Brad Ziegler for 3 million

2 AA SP and a MLB Ready OF for a proven #2/3 SP who doesn't cost over 100 million

oh i was referring to a happ/possible schwarber trade and the cubs taking them on. Didnt even look at your proposal. Not crazy about that return. IF we could include the cubs and find a way to get Happ involved in could be into that.

[tjfla]

oh i was referring to a happ/possible schwarber trade and the cubs taking them on. Didnt even look at your proposal. Not crazy about that return. IF we could include the cubs and find a way to get Happ involved in could be into that.

O ya I dont think the Cubs would do that I was talking more about to St Louis,Milwaukee,Minnesota,Philly,Texas who misses out on a Top 3 FA SP

[fish16]

O ya I dont think the Cubs would do that I was talking more about to St Louis,Milwaukee,Minnesota,Philly,Texas who misses out on a Top 3 FA SP

I'd just like to acquire one top of the rotation potential arm in a stanton deal, because I think once we combine that with a huge package that we will inevitably get for Ozuna, whether its pitching or hitting, that will kick off the rebuild very nicely.