Marlins 2017-2018 Offseason Discussion Thread

[tjfla]

Thing that really kills me on Guzman is he going to be 22 in a couple of days and Frisaro is reporting that he will probably be sent to Batavia to start out. What is going on with him that at this age and point that he still isn't going to head to full season ball? I know I read somewherer that he wore down in short season ball last year if that is the case it's not looking promising for him to be a starter.

Thats why no one ever listens to Frisaro. No chance Guzman starts the year in Extended ST then Batavia unless he is hurt.

People are saying Denbo wants him in Jupiter but he at least be in Gboro. Wouldn't be surprising to see alot of our guys being moved aggressively-he was known for this when he ran the NYY and I hope we do it. Rather have a 21 yr old getting roughed up in Jupiter than some 28 yr old there going 10-0 with a ERA of 1.00. We will likely sign a few old guys but we have enough 23/24 yr old guys to take chances on

One thing I hope Denbo does do is figure out who guys are and stick to it. No more of this draft college closers and then slow track them as SP only to make them RP/Closers again. Example-We took 2 college closers who are used to throwing 1 inning and tried them as SP(Both bombed) however when tried as RP again looked great. I know SP are more desired but its really hurting guys development

Plus Gboro doesn't have any spots open-Rogers(If he can make it out of NM),Cabrera,Castano,Sam Perez,Guenther,Remey Reed and 4 other guys(Hock,Lillie,Braley,Osman) they don't know if SP/RP yet. At least 10 SP for 5/6 spots. We also have 7 guys out shoulder/TJ who have talent-Roberson,Holloway,Garrett,Mojica,Wells,Lee,Lilek

Jupiter rotation is Ethan Clark,Brandon Miller,Beggs,Dugger,Max Duval who is 27 and maybe Kolek?(if he can throw 1 pitch over the plate) So wouldn't be suprised to see Guzman and maybe 1 or 2 of the older guys in Gboro up in Jupiter instead

[Erick]

Example-We took 2 college closers who are used to throwing 1 inning and tried them as SP(Both bombed) however when tried as RP again looked great. I know SP are more desired but its really hurting guys development

Who?

[fish16]

I didnt know Denbo was known for being aggressive with prospects, but im glad. We have been so ridiculously over cautious with SP's especially. Makes no sense especially considering how little it has helped in preventing TJ/shoulder issues.

[tjfla]

Who?

Lillie/Hock LY. Sean Guenther was another closer that people thought would move fast as a RP however he looked solid as a SP despite being Dillon Peters size

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I didnt know Denbo was known for being aggressive with prospects, but im glad. We have been so ridiculously over cautious with SP's especially. Makes no sense especially considering how little it has helped in preventing TJ/shoulder issues.

Well not as aggressive as Atlanta but he has been known to but 21 yr olds in AA and 17 yr olds in GCL/SS ball. Lets just say if a 24 yr old has a 1.24ERA in Jupiter he probably won't be there long

[lou]

Thats why no one ever listens to Frisaro. No chance Guzman starts the year in Extended ST then Batavia unless he is hurt.

People are saying Denbo wants him in Jupiter but he at least be in Gboro. Wouldn't be surprising to see alot of our guys being moved aggressively-he was known for this when he ran the NYY and I hope we do it. Rather have a 21 yr old getting roughed up in Jupiter than some 28 yr old there going 10-0 with a ERA of 1.00. We will likely sign a few old guys but we have enough 23/24 yr old guys to take chances on

One thing I hope Denbo does do is figure out who guys are and stick to it. No more of this draft college closers and then slow track them as SP only to make them RP/Closers again. Example-We took 2 college closers who are used to throwing 1 inning and tried them as SP(Both bombed) however when tried as RP again looked great. I know SP are more desired but its really hurting guys development

Plus Gboro doesn't have any spots open-Rogers(If he can make it out of NM),Cabrera,Castano,Sam Perez,Guenther,Remey Reed and 4 other guys(Hock,Lillie,Braley,Osman) they don't know if SP/RP yet. At least 10 SP for 5/6 spots. We also have 7 guys out shoulder/TJ who have talent-Roberson,Holloway,Garrett,Mojica,Wells,Lee,Lilek

Jupiter rotation is Ethan Clark,Brandon Miller,Beggs,Dugger,Max Duval who is 27 and maybe Kolek?(if he can throw 1 pitch over the plate) So wouldn't be suprised to see Guzman and maybe 1 or 2 of the older guys in Gboro up in Jupiter instead

So what you're saying is, Arquimedes Caminero won't be kept in Rookie-A+ for 6 seasons anymore.

I would expect Guzman in Greensboro with a dozen start promotion to Jupiter, with the hope he can open in AA in 2019. I imagine they hope he is ready after the 2019 Super2 deadline passes, or sometime early 2020 as a fallback.

I always forget Lilek exists. Is he healthy?

[tjfla]

So what you're saying is, Arquimedes Caminero won't be kept in Rookie-A+ for 6 seasons anymore.

I would expect Guzman in Greensboro with a dozen start promotion to Jupiter, with the hope he can open in AA in 2019. I imagine they hope he is ready after the 2019 Super2 deadline passes, or sometime early 2020 as a fallback.

I always forget Lilek exists. Is he healthy?

That would be nice wouldn't it? ML type Arms that everyone knows about but the Marlins keep below Jupiter for years for no reason. Every other ML team promotes guys based on stats while Marlins would keep guys in same class for 2/3 years no matter if dominant or couldn't throw a strike then lose them as 6 yr FA.

My favorite was still when we would promote a 19/20 yr old to Jupiter cause they needed an arm. The kid would look great and instead of just keeping them up they would restart them back in the GCL and sign some 30 yr old career minor league arm.

Who the hell knows about Lilek? He was suppose to be back March 2017 but nothing. He is still in the system

[sports24/7]

From Mish:

Craig Mish

Verified account

@CraigMish
3m3 minutes ago
More
Source : Brewers have put together a trade offer & have shown strong interest Marlins OF Christian Yelich. Other teams remain in the mix.

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pretty much. Everyone loved the "we traded 3 good players and didnt get back a single top 100 guy" based on one mlb.com list written months ago. Nevermind the fact that neidert was on BA.com's list at midseason.

Is we traded 3 good players and still only have 2 players on the bottom of the list that much better, though, really? The Marlins didn't get enough in return for Stanton and Ozuna, top 100 prospects or not.

[fish16]

From Mish:



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Is we traded 3 good players and still only have 2 players on the bottom of the list that much better, though, really? The Marlins didn't get enough in return for Stanton and Ozuna, top 100 prospects or not.

it's the same either way, that narrative of "no top 100 prospects on mlb.coms list from 6 months ago" was stupid to begin with. and i dont think they did for Stanton as far as pure value but they were never going to due to his contract status. To get out from under his deal with essentially no dead money is incredibly significant for the long term future of this organization. A team like the angels might be able to survive pujols ridiculous contract and still compete but we dont have the resources to do so.

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brewers would be a great trade partner for yelich. Hiura, Burnes would be the starting point for me with 2-3 other good prospects being involved.

[sports24/7]

I don't see enough elite talent in the Brewers system to make me excited about any deal with them. Brinson would have to be the headliner, but I'd hope they would get two more of their top guys like Woodruff/Burnes and Huira.

[Ralph]

Brinson, Ortiz, Huira, Burnes, Isan Diaz, Freddy Peralta are all exciting.

[fish16]

I don't see enough elite talent in the Brewers system to make me excited about any deal with them. Brinson would have to be the headliner, but I'd hope they would get two more of their top guys like Woodruff/Burnes and Huira.

The brewers system is incredibly talented, they have quite a bit of elite talent in their system.

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Brian Anderson listed as the 9th best 3b prospect in the minors according to MLB.com's just released list.

[sports24/7]

The brewers system is incredibly talented, they have quite a bit of elite talent in their system.

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Brian Anderson listed as the 9th best 3b prospect in the minors according to MLB.com's just released list.

They don't have a Guererro, Acuna, or Robles type. Those are elite prospects. They have very good prospects, but not that. I want an elite prospect.

[Ralph]

I myself would prefer a younger prospects than the soon to be 24 year old Brinson. But don’t get it twisted he is an elite prospect. He has as much talent as Robles.

[sports24/7]

I myself would prefer a younger prospects than the soon to be 24 year old Brinson. But don’t get it twisted he is an elite prospect. He has as much talent as Robles.

He has elite potential, but he's not the elite prospect Robles is. The power is big time with Brinson, and the fielding seems to be impressive, but the hitting for average seems like it's still a question mark. I know people say not to get wrapped up in the rankings, but there's a reason why Robles is a top 5 prospect everywhere, and Brinson isn't in the top 10.

That being said, if you can get something like Brinson, and two of Hiura, Burnes, and Woodruff then that would be enticing. I just don't see that happening. I see one, maybe two of any team's top prospects coming back, and if that's the case, it should only be guys in that top tier IMO.

[Maddawg]

Might not be a lot to be optimistic about, but theres not nearly as much to be pessimistic about as you continually show.

And you guys act as if every public comment is the team being totally transparent. If they say Sierra isnt near MLB ready and needs to spend significantly more time in the minors, youd crush Sierra and the Ozuna trade. If the team makes the flippant and totally meaningless statement that they'll give Sierra an opportunity to make the team rather than coming out and saying that they are going to leave him in the minors until he accrues another years of team control, youll say "this fucking team." If the team comes out and admits that they will not promote Sierra until he accrues another year of team control, you'll complain that they treat their own players terribly. If the team says they are ok keeping Castro so as not to make it seem like they are 100% going to deal him and lower his trade value, you crush the team. IF the team is making it fairly clear a Stanton trade is coming, youre going to complain about how theyre ruining their value by not being more discreet. If they ask for Acuna, you'll complain about how unrealistic the team is being in trade talks. When the team gets another group of top prospects, albeit not the "top" prospect in all of baseball in Acuna, you'll complain that they didnt get back the team's top prospect. Just give the fucking front office at least 1 spring training game before you constantly look for the negative in every move of a much needed rebuild.

Why should we...did the new ownership give the fans a chance to respond & turnout now that Loria is gone ? No....and now they will want MLB prices for tix to see a AA team.

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I also think Guzman is going to be a fucking stud and will rise up those rankings by next offseason so I think that deal wont be nearly as bad as people think given how much money we shed and how good Guzman will be.

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Based on what....wishful thinking ? Dude you dong sucking of the front office is hilarious.