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  • ESPN: Edwin Rodriguez Trying to Keep Fish Afloat

    PHILADELPHIA -- Florida manager Edwin Rodriguez isn’t losing any sleep over the team’s 1-14 stretch, but that’s only because he’s REM-deprived no matter how the Marlins are playing. When it comes to shut-eye, Rodriguez makes Charlie Sheen look like Rip Van Winkle.

    “I only sleep for three or four hours a night,’’ Rodriguez said Wednesday. “I’ve been that way for many, many years, even back home. Sleeping is overrated.’’

    Sleep can be a handy refuge for a manager who wakes up every morning to speculation that his job security is hanging by a very thin thread. But it’s tough to fade off into dreamland when you’re counting one-run losses and runners left in scoring position.

    For the first two months this season, Rodriguez and the Marlins were one of baseball’s surprise feel-good stories. Three weeks ago they were 29-19 and one game behind Philadelphia in the National League East. Team president David Samson and general manager Larry Beinfest were so euphoric after a three-game sweep of the Giants in San Francisco, they ordered 200 In-N-Out burgers for the charter flight out of town.

    But just about everything has gone wrong since Scott Cousins bowled over Buster Posey by the Bay. The Marlins are 3-17 since the wheels touched off the San Francisco Airport runway. The anguish continued with back-to-back losses in Philadelphia on Wednesday. The Marlins dropped the opener 8-1 and then coughed up a 4-2, two-out lead in the ninth to lose 5-4 in 10 innings in the nightcap.

    It’s no challenge finding reasons for the Marlins’ unraveling. Josh Johnson, an early Cy Young candidate, is on the 60-day disabled list with an inflamed shoulder and won’t return until after the All-Star break. Chris Volstad (6.07 ERA) and Javier Vazquez (7.09) have been far too hittable at the back end of the rotation. Shortstop Hanley Ramirez, who just returned from a back injury, is hitting .206 with four homers. And the Marlins are 24th in the majors with a .235 batting average with runners in scoring position.

    They’re also a very young group: Of the nine-man lineup that Rodriguez ran out in the opener of Wednesday’s doubleheader against the Phillies, only third baseman Greg Dobbs and second baseman Omar Infante were older than 27.

    On a positive note, two scouts at Citizens Bank Park said the Marlins continue to play the game as though they’re fully engaged.

    “You watch them and they go hard the down the line on every ground ball,’’ one scout said. “They’re still busting their asses.’’

    But it’s only natural that Rodriguez’s name is making the rounds in “hot seat’’ speculation. Marlins CEO Jeffrey Loria, an owner who can be euphemistically referred to as “hands-on,’’ earned a reputation for impetuousness by firing Joe Girardi and Fredi Gonzalez, who are now working for marquee franchises in New York and Atlanta. And Loria showed that he meant business this year by venting about the team’s “uninspired’’ play midway through spring training.

    The Marlins recently generated a player backlash when they fired hitting coach John Mallee, a popular figure in the clubhouse. The Florida front office was reportedly chapped when Logan Morrison, the team’s quotable, engaging, social media-savvy left fielder, spoke out forcefully in Mallee’s behalf.

    It’s also the time of season when tensions begin to escalate and dugout seats keep getting warmer. The Oakland A’s fired manager Bob Geren last week after reliever Brian Fuentes’ public complaints hinted at internal clubhouse strife, and the Houston Astros fired pitching coach Brad Arnsberg on Tuesday over “philosophical differences.’’

    Rodriguez, a 50-year-old Puerto Rico native, is an easy guy to root for. He spent seven years as a scout with the Minnesota Twins and managed 887 games in the minors before finally getting his shot in Florida. He’s an avid reader who meditates each morning and projects a Felipe Alou-like air of serenity and calm. He’s widely regarded in baseball circles as the real thing.

    “I can only speak for me, but I love him,’’ Morrison said. “I had him in the minor leagues, and I never had a problem with him. If you play hard for him, he’s going to have your back.’’

    As the losses mount and the Marlins’ season heads in the wrong direction, Rodriguez is stoically keeping a lid on his emotions. He focuses on positive reinforcement, telling his players that one series, one game or one pitch might be all it takes for things to turn around. Teams are rarely as good as they look when they’re winning or as hopeless as they appear when they’ve dropped 14 of 15.

    “At the beginning of the year, everybody was saying what a great manager he was,’’ Marlins catcher John Buck said of Rodriguez. “Now we’re losing games and all you keep hearing is, ‘He could be on the hot seat.’ But the feeling I’ve gotten from him -- especially while we’ve struggled -- is that he cares about these young guys. He’s trying to help them get better rather than focusing on his job.

    “When you’re going through what we’re going through now, that’s usually when players will feel panic [from the manager]. But Edwin keeps going around trying to make guys feel more comfortable. That’s why people gravitate toward him. Through the peaks and valleys, he’s consistent.’’

    The first instinct for any manager under scrutiny is to withdraw and tune out the media. Not Rodriguez. He paid close attention, for example, when the A’s sent Geren packing last week. Rodriguez played Triple-A ball with Oakland GM Billy Beane in Portland, Ore., and he was on the same winter league team in Puerto Rico with Geren.

    “When somebody gets fired, I like to read about the reaction from the organization, the players and the coaches,’’ Rodriguez said. “I think you can learn from that. You put yourself in those situations and ask yourself, ‘How would you react?’’’

    There’s a fine line between acknowledging reality and radiating tension, and it’s tougher to navigate with every loss. Rodriguez had to sweat out lots of Bobby Valentine and Ozzie Guillen rumors before the Marlins decided to bring him back this season. The conventional wisdom is that Loria will want a more high-profile manager as the team prepares to move into a new ballpark in 2012. The question is, are the Marlins prepared to fork out the big money required?

    “I’m not feeling the pressure, to be honest,’’ Rodriguez said. “If it’s going to happen, it’s going to happen. There’s only so much you can do or say as a coach or manager, and then it’s out of your control.

    “People keep asking me or telling me that the front office here is always very involved in the clubhouse. That doesn’t bother me. On the contrary. I want an owner that cares about what’s going on. Good or bad.’’

    Until the good Marlins reappear, Rodriguez will rely on stoicism, consistency and encouraging words to resurrect hope in the clubhouse and save his job. It’s up to the players to do the rest.
    http://espn.go.com/blog/SweetSpot/po...ep-fish-afloat

  • #2
    Interesting, and damning of Loria. He's fired his last two managers, both of whom might be wearing WS rings by the end of October. No matter what we think of them, the national media will have a field day with that.

    I wonder what the real word is out on Loria, and how most people around MLB think about him. How hard will it be for him to get someone else to replace Rodriguez if he is fired, and will he have to pay a real premium to get a big name here, since they will have to put up with Loria's antics (whether real or just perceived) ?

    Comment


    • #3
      a) world series rings have almost nothing to do with managers
      b) managers realistically have little to do with success or failure as the only impact they have really is pinch hitting and bullpen usage, something I think Edwin has been pretty good at
      c) Steinbrenner never had problems getting managers, you put out the money and an opportunity to manage and people will come
      Originally posted by Madman81
      Most of the people in the world being dumb is not a requirement for you to be among their ranks.
      Need help? Questions? Concerns? Want to chat? PM me!

      Comment


      • #4
        Too bad we burnt our bridges with Bobby Valentine.

        There has to be a change coming soon, there's no way loria stays shut given the way we are performing.

        Comment


        • #5
          eh, I think Loria will just ride it out till next season.

          New stadium, new manager.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by markotsay7 View Post
            a) world series rings have almost nothing to do with managers
            b) managers realistically have little to do with success or failure as the only impact they have really is pinch hitting and bullpen usage, something I think Edwin has been pretty good at
            c) Steinbrenner never had problems getting managers, you put out the money and an opportunity to manage and people will come
            I agree I don't think firing Edwin is the answer. But with Loria, you know his inner Steinbrenner is itching to pull the trigger soon.

            Steinbrenner was also the owner of the Yankees, and they always have more money than God, can just about pay their way to any FA to be had, so its a different dynamic when you are talking about being the manager of Florida, who has an owner who thinks he deserves a Yankeesque team, but isn't willing to fork out the $ to do it. He puts unreasonable demands on his coaching staff, and then gets pissed when they don't get his team into the playoffs. No wonder Valentine went away from discussions laughing at Loria. Valentine is no dummy and knows it will take harder work than he is willing to put out to win with Florida. Especially with an owner that maintains illusions of Yankee Grandeur. The pressure to win for a big name like Valentine is 10 times harder than for Edwin, because Loria will expect even more because he is paying this guy more because of his name.

            I'm sure that Valentine asked if Loria was willing to open up the pocket book, and Loria said that was not in the immediate plans and Valentine then said, "see ya later". Its why Showalter didn't even show any interest in this job. And it why, until Loria gets off his high horse and either really pays big bucks in FA he will be stuck hiring more Edwins, if in fact Edwin is released before the end of the year.
            --------------------
            Originally posted by Namaste View Post
            eh, I think Loria will just ride it out till next season.

            New stadium, new manager.
            I agree, any change during this season, will be for another "Edwin" type.

            I still maintain that Loria will have to fork out $ to get a name here, even higher than many would take to manage other franchises, just because people in MLB no what an asshole Loria is, and will want extra compensation for having to put up with his Assness Mr. Loria.
            Last edited by Emperor; 06-16-2011, 11:46 AM. Reason: Doublepost Merged

            Comment


            • #7
              Until Loria gets off his high horse? We spent some money this off season and have locked up Hanley and JJ for the future. Payroll is going to rise next season and we have a very cool legit core of players. Not to mention that you get to live in South Florida and the team is overshadowed by the Dolphins and Heat, therefore outside of management, there is not much pressure.

              Comment


              • #8
                If owner Jeffrey Loria signs off on a managerial change, he’ll have to contend with one angry superstar.
                Before Thursday’s series finale against the Phillies, Hanley Ramirez gave Edwin Rodriguez a powerful endorsement. The Marlins since a 29-19 start are 3-17. They’ve already fired hitting coach John Mallee and based on the Marlins’ managerial history, no one would be surprised if Rodriguez is next to go. That wouldn’t sit well with Ramirez.
                “I’m on his side,” he said. “Whatever he does, I’m good for it because he’s the best guy we’ve ever had here. Everything is going bad right now, but he’s there for you. I’ll never complain about anything he does. He’s a pretty good guy and a pretty good manager. He’s smart.
                “When we do good, people look at us. It’s like Ozzie [Guillen] says, yeah, when the team is winning you have to give credit to the players and when they’re losing they want to fire me. No, that’s not how it is…He’s going to be here forever. I’m on his side. I’ve got his back to the death.”
                Ramirez as a rookie had a great relationship with Joe Girardi during his lone season here, but he never found similar ground with Fredi Gonzalez. Rodriguez is an exceptional communicator and has gotten through to Ramirez, who appreciates the way he’s led the club in both good times and bad.
                “He does things the way you’re supposed to,” Ramirez said. “He comes to you and talks to you. Whatever questions he asks you directly. When you have a manager like that, what more can you ask?…He always tells me he knows the player I am, that I’m going to hit, not to worry about it and to just keep playing hard. That’s the only thing I can control.”
                Rodriguez said he’s received numerous text messages and emails from friends concerned about his job security.
                “Of course I want to be here,” Rodriguez said. “I saw the firing of Mallee coming. I was more worried about Mallee than firing me. Mallee’s career is starting right now as a big league [hitting coach]. For me, before they called me last year I felt fine with my career. Then they called me up and it was a bonus. I think it would be a mistake [to fire me] because I don’t think anything is going to change on the field…I’m grateful they gave me a chance to be here. What they do after this, whatever they want to do.”
                Told of Ramirez’s support, Rodriguez said that was good to hear. He planned on having a pregame meeting to make sure nobody is hanging their heads.
                “Everybody is expecting us to go out there and feel like we’re defeated,” Rodriguez said. “I don’t want to see that. They play hard…I’m going to tell them I’m going to pull anybody I see that’s going to be dragging. I don’t want anyone anyone dragging out there. I want them to police themselves. If they see anybody dragging, they should make sure to stop that. Everybody is expecting us to just give away this game. Cliff Lee on the mound, Philadelphia, they’re just going through the motions. That’s not going to happen.”
                Ramirez was not in Thursday’s starting lineup. He won’t play in day games after night games for a while. Rodriguez said he’ll likely use Ramirez as the designated hitter for the Sunday matinee in Tampa.
                “He knows I came back from the DL not 100 percent because I want to play and I want to help this team to win,” Ramirez said. “People are going to be mad. They want to see me out there everyday, but they have to understand. We have more than 90 games to go.”
                Asked about the current stretch compared to the Marlins’ 11-31 start in 2006, Ramirez said: “This is worse because now everybody has a little bit [of time] in the big leagues. Back then, pretty much the whole team was rookies. Now we’re not supposed to suck. We’re supposed to be winning right now.”
                Hanley Ramirez gives Edwin Rodriguez strong endorsement

                Comment


                • #9
                  maybe Hanley needs a douche as a manager for him to start hitting again

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ramp View Post
                    Until Loria gets off his high horse? We spent some money this off season and have locked up Hanley and JJ for the future. Payroll is going to rise next season and we have a very cool legit core of players. Not to mention that you get to live in South Florida and the team is overshadowed by the Dolphins and Heat, therefore outside of management, there is not much pressure.
                    Ramp, don't always look at reality but look at perception. No matter what the reality is, around baseball the Marlins have a horrible reputation, especially Loria. With players & FO personnel. In reality and perception, the Marlins are one of the lowest payroll teams. That is a fact. Players don't want to hear the reasons why, all they know is the Marlins are not one of the teams that attract high priced free agents, hence (in the players perception) they have a cheap ass owner. Don't kill the messenger in this case bro. I know you don't like to hear it, but its reality.

                    And until they prove it, this "cool core of legit players" are nothing.

                    As for South Florida, I have news for you - many people around the country have visited So Fla and hate it. Especially people from California, AZ and the like. Many of our core players are from SoCal, and I can agree with them, that is an incredible place compared to So Fla. Its not just the boring flat landscape, its mostly the unfriendly & rude population. That is the complaint I hear most often from the people I know that visit here (in my business its necessary for many of my clients and superiors are from or live now in LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Tucson & Las Vegas). That and the horrible language barrier. In many shops in Miami, if you don't speak Spanish you are treated very poorly. At least 2 of the "core players" and many promising young players in our minor league system are West Coast kids, and they only live here during the season, and only because they have too. Look at how many players (Steve Finley for an example) would only allow themselves to be traded to a West Coast team. I maintain that Stanton, if not locked up by the end of next season, will NEVER stay here, and will end up on a West Coast team by 2014 or 2015. No way Loria will pay him the money he will be able to command by then. And then when he has a chance he makes a break for the West Coast.

                    And the "locking up of Hanley & JJ" is only as good as they play. Right now, neither one of them has made a recent contribution of note. Injuries withstanding, this is a "what have you done for me lately" game, and especially with Loria. His behavior in the past has been irrational at times and certainly not in the best long term interest of the franchise. There is a perception, whether right or wrong, earned or not, that the Marlins are just not a good organization. Ownership is at best cheap, if not outright stealing from MLB (through the revenue sharing), and its not just fans from other teams, its players & coaches who feel this way too. I can assure you that in that Atlanta clubhouse, Uggla has told a few or two tales about Mr Loria (whether or not they are 100 % true is another thing), but the words get out that way, and then, well its takes years of good to overcome that kind of bad rep. Trust has to be rebuilt, and sometimes that is harder done than said.

                    As for pressure, right now that is starting to build. With the new stadium is going to come really high goals for many "new" fans. They will expect results sooner rather than later, and if we bomb out like this next year, all hell can break loose. MLB will certainly expect to see us spend, and we need to make a splash. I think that will be very expensive for Loria, much more than if he was any other owner, because I maintain, because of his past actions, it will cause him to have to pay more to get the same other teams can get for less. Mostly because of Loria's past rep. It will follow him around.

                    Mock me if you wish, but I think deep down in your hearts, the members of the board know I am right.

                    Comment


                    • #11

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        There are 30 available major league managing positions available in the entire world.

                        They won't have trouble finding someone because Loria is moody, or whatever.
                        poop

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Emperor View Post
                          Ramp, don't always look at reality but look at perception. No matter what the reality is, around baseball the Marlins have a horrible reputation, especially Loria. With players & FO personnel. In reality and perception, the Marlins are one of the lowest payroll teams. That is a fact. Players don't want to hear the reasons why, all they know is the Marlins are not one of the teams that attract high priced free agents, hence (in the players perception) they have a cheap ass owner. Don't kill the messenger in this case bro. I know you don't like to hear it, but its reality.

                          And until they prove it, this "cool core of legit players" are nothing.

                          As for South Florida, I have news for you - many people around the country have visited So Fla and hate it. Especially people from California, AZ and the like. Many of our core players are from SoCal, and I can agree with them, that is an incredible place compared to So Fla. Its not just the boring flat landscape, its mostly the unfriendly & rude population. That is the complaint I hear most often from the people I know that visit here (in my business its necessary for many of my clients and superiors are from or live now in LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Tucson & Las Vegas). That and the horrible language barrier. In many shops in Miami, if you don't speak Spanish you are treated very poorly. At least 2 of the "core players" and many promising young players in our minor league system are West Coast kids, and they only live here during the season, and only because they have too. Look at how many players (Steve Finley for an example) would only allow themselves to be traded to a West Coast team. I maintain that Stanton, if not locked up by the end of next season, will NEVER stay here, and will end up on a West Coast team by 2014 or 2015. No way Loria will pay him the money he will be able to command by then. And then when he has a chance he makes a break for the West Coast.

                          And the "locking up of Hanley & JJ" is only as good as they play. Right now, neither one of them has made a recent contribution of note. Injuries withstanding, this is a "what have you done for me lately" game, and especially with Loria. His behavior in the past has been irrational at times and certainly not in the best long term interest of the franchise. There is a perception, whether right or wrong, earned or not, that the Marlins are just not a good organization. Ownership is at best cheap, if not outright stealing from MLB (through the revenue sharing), and its not just fans from other teams, its players & coaches who feel this way too. I can assure you that in that Atlanta clubhouse, Uggla has told a few or two tales about Mr Loria (whether or not they are 100 % true is another thing), but the words get out that way, and then, well its takes years of good to overcome that kind of bad rep. Trust has to be rebuilt, and sometimes that is harder done than said.

                          As for pressure, right now that is starting to build. With the new stadium is going to come really high goals for many "new" fans. They will expect results sooner rather than later, and if we bomb out like this next year, all hell can break loose. MLB will certainly expect to see us spend, and we need to make a splash. I think that will be very expensive for Loria, much more than if he was any other owner, because I maintain, because of his past actions, it will cause him to have to pay more to get the same other teams can get for less. Mostly because of Loria's past rep. It will follow him around.

                          Mock me if you wish, but I think deep down in your hearts, the members of the board know I am right.
                          [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAOxY_nHdew[/ame]

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Emperor View Post
                            Ramp, don't always look at reality but look at perception. No matter what the reality is, around baseball the Marlins have a horrible reputation, especially Loria. With players & FO personnel. In reality and perception, the Marlins are one of the lowest payroll teams. That is a fact. Players don't want to hear the reasons why, all they know is the Marlins are not one of the teams that attract high priced free agents, hence (in the players perception) they have a cheap ass owner. Don't kill the messenger in this case bro. I know you don't like to hear it, but its reality.
                            We've been able to get Pudge and Carlos Delgado. Both very much in their primes. Yea, we didn't re-sign Pudge and we traded Delgado, but both came to Florida willingly.

                            And until they prove it, this "cool core of legit players" are nothing.
                            Hanley and Josh Johnson are elite players. Now Hanley is struggling mightily, but his career speaks for itself. Anibal Sanchez is a very good pitcher and Ricky Nolasco has his moments (more good than bad). Logan Morrison, Gaby Sanchez and Mike Stanton are the makings of fantastic 2-6 hitters. You have to be kidding me if you don't believe any of this. And while we're at it, John Buck is locked up for two more years and he is has been more than adequate as a game-caller and defensively.

                            As for South Florida, I have news for you - many people around the country have visited So Fla and hate it. Especially people from California, AZ and the like. Many of our core players are from SoCal, and I can agree with them, that is an incredible place compared to So Fla. Its not just the boring flat landscape, its mostly the unfriendly & rude population. That is the complaint I hear most often from the people I know that visit here (in my business its necessary for many of my clients and superiors are from or live now in LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Tucson & Las Vegas). That and the horrible language barrier. In many shops in Miami, if you don't speak Spanish you are treated very poorly. At least 2 of the "core players" and many promising young players in our minor league system are West Coast kids, and they only live here during the season, and only because they have too. Look at how many players (Steve Finley for an example) would only allow themselves to be traded to a West Coast team. I maintain that Stanton, if not locked up by the end of next season, will NEVER stay here, and will end up on a West Coast team by 2014 or 2015. No way Loria will pay him the money he will be able to command by then. And then when he has a chance he makes a break for the West Coast.
                            Can't argue with this part. If we don't lock Stanton up, we won't be able to afford him. Neither would 20 other teams in the league. The nonsense about our players liking California more than South Florida is pure hearsay at this point on your part.

                            And the "locking up of Hanley & JJ" is only as good as they play. Right now, neither one of them has made a recent contribution of note. Injuries withstanding, this is a "what have you done for me lately" game, and especially with Loria. His behavior in the past has been irrational at times and certainly not in the best long term interest of the franchise. There is a perception, whether right or wrong, earned or not, that the Marlins are just not a good organization. Ownership is at best cheap, if not outright stealing from MLB (through the revenue sharing), and its not just fans from other teams, its players & coaches who feel this way too. I can assure you that in that Atlanta clubhouse, Uggla has told a few or two tales about Mr Loria (whether or not they are 100 % true is another thing), but the words get out that way, and then, well its takes years of good to overcome that kind of bad rep. Trust has to be rebuilt, and sometimes that is harder done than said.
                            You're seriously out of your mind. Josh Johnson is one of the best pitchers in baseball and again, while Hanley has had a rough 2.5 months, he's still one of the best shortstops in the game. Teams would give their first born for him. You can assure me that Dan Uggla is talking shit about Loria to the Braves? Who the fuck cares what Dan Uggla says? He wanted a contract that would be worth more than Hanley Ramirez. He's just as insane as you are. Blah Blah Blah trust... if the millions are offered, players show up. Money talks.

                            As for pressure, right now that is starting to build. With the new stadium is going to come really high goals for many "new" fans. They will expect results sooner rather than later, and if we bomb out like this next year, all hell can break loose. MLB will certainly expect to see us spend, and we need to make a splash. I think that will be very expensive for Loria, much more than if he was any other owner, because I maintain, because of his past actions, it will cause him to have to pay more to get the same other teams can get for less. Mostly because of Loria's past rep. It will follow him around.

                            Mock me if you wish, but I think deep down in your hearts, the members of the board know I am right.
                            Nothing wrong with new fans looking for the team to win. This team is going to have plenty of excitement surrounding them heading into the 2012 season. We spent money this off-season, and I look for us to spend money this coming off-season. Loria's rep means nothing except for fans that like to bitch and moan about him.

                            Also, I don't have a heart, so don't worry about how deep it goes.

                            Comment


                            • #15


                              I did this?!?

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