The 2017 Game Thread Thread

[AdamRavs]

Last inning having Anderson up instead of DD would of been nice.

[fish16]

Well at least we're really working the counts against strasburg. 55 pitches through 5 innings. He's gonna go at least 8.

[AdamRavs]

Need to sweep Philly this weekend

[fish16]

I'd be super OK if we could trade Dee Gordon this offseason and get nothing back if his entire salary is wiped clean. It's kind of unfair that he tested positive for roids immediately after his best season where he showed more power than he ever did before and we gave him a big contract off of it. He is useless with the bat as a slap hitter with absolutely 0 power, even for doubles. He is a great hitter in the 1980's, yet in the current day and age of baseball he is a negative with the bat.

[AdamRavs]

Complaining about Dee is not even remotely one of our issues. He serves exactly what we need. When he gets on base we win. Our issue is Bour not staying healthy, SS and pitching. Dee is about issue #103 with this team.

[fish16]

Complaining about Dee is not even remotely one of our issues. He serves exactly what we need. When he gets on base we win. Our issue is Bour not staying healthy, SS and pitching. Dee is about issue #103 with this team.

I never said he was one of our top issues. This team is riddled with tons of issues. What I was saying was that for his contract, he is a horrible value for what he produces. He's a career .327 OBP guy and even that number is inflated by the .359 his one good OBP year when he was then caught doing steroids. Having him with no power and then a SS with no power is part of the problem for why our offense is so prone to go through these bad droughts. I think, for the sake of the depth and the run producing potential of our lineup I'd like to see what we do with Anderson at 3b, Prado/Dietrich at 2b, and finding some sort of upgrade with more of a hit tool at SS than Rojas. I love Rojas's glove but he cant be our everyday SS. He is simply not an everyday SS. And the combo of him and Dee's complete lack of ability to hit anything other than singles is killer.

So I would try to trade Dee rather than Prado, move Realmuto to the leadoff spot full time, go with Anderson at 3b, Prado at 2b, and then try to find a guy who could put up a .750 OPS at SS. It would improve our team OPS. Im just of the opinion that Dee is a player more suited to the 1980's/old style of baseball and is not actually a quality player in this day and age, specifically at his contracts number.

But ya, front line starter is our first issue, and the horrific and obviously stupid contracts that were obviously stupid at the time they were given out are the 2 biggest problems this team has. But there is no doubt that the bottom of this lineup is also a significant issue. Bour coming back helps that, but we still have significant holes.

My overall team building philosophy is to not overpay players and to get as much bang for your buck as possible. If we trade Dee and get someone to eat his salary, we can very easily find someone to play at 2b to match his overall offensive output for a fraction of the cost. People would argue dee has had a quality offensive year and he is below a .700 OPS.

[fish16]

The biggest impediment for this team being able to contend next year is simply put the horrifically stupid contracts Mike Hill gave out over the last 2 offseasons. Chen's deal is bad enough, but backloading it is gonna kill this team. And i wasnt aware of this at the time of the contract, because I honestly like the type of pitcher that he was, but if they gave that contract knowing he has that elbow issue, that should be grounds for MLB coming in and firing Mike Hill on the marlins fans behalf.

Then, he went out and gave 2 relievers, the easiest thing in baseball to find, deals that paid them like 13 million this year and nearly 16 million next year. Im of the opinion of that you should almost never give a free agent reliever a significant deal like that. Going to arbitration with your own guys is one thing, and signing a guy like Jansen to be a shut down closer is also acceptable, but giving average relievers significant money is just a complete and utter example of Mike Hill ignoring the modern (and completely obvious) basics of 2017 baseball team building. If you invest in your own drafting, IFA, and player development, which we obviously dont, you should literally NEVER have to give those type of contract.

Also, rather than signing a 1 year stop gap type player like Dickey or someone like Fister, we gave Volquez a 2 year deal at over 10 million a year when he has almost never been a quality SP. If you need a SP, that is one thing. but you either go all in on a true front of the rotation guy or you sign them to a 1 year deal. Again, basics of team building that Mike Hill just is completely ignorant to. Now, Volquez was his typical, average to below average self before the injury, and then he gets injured and because of the ignorance to basic team building and salary structure, we have yet another 10 million next year committed to a player who wont play a single game.

Then, we emotionally gave Martin Prado a double digit million deal because we liked the way he handled the Jose death. I like Martin Prado as a player, but it is really simple economics and getting bang for your buck. There is literally no marlins fan alive who would look at that deal at the time that it was signed and say, wow, we got really good value there. Value and salary efficiency wins games in baseball. It's one reason why the platoon is such a popular lineup strategy. It allows you to maximize the production from a position for a small cost. And the only contracts that we have given that fits the "value" construct is Yelich. We have guys on rookie deals, but every other actual major league contract that we have given out are complete and utter cancers to our team salary, and any fan who has a basic understanding of baseball contracts could have told you that they were at the exact second they were signed.

And relating this all back to dee gordon, we now are gonna be forced to trade from our core of great young hitters to cut salary and fill holes because of complete and utter mismanagement, all dating back to within the last 2 years. that is honestly impressive to mismanage your own team that badly that quickly. I dont blame them for the dee contract because if he was the hitter that he was 2 years ago, his contract actually would be value. But because he duped the marlins with steroids into thinking he was more than a <.700 OPS guy, we now get terrible value for the money he makes, thus making us very likely to be happy to just be able to dump his salary for nothing.

Between all the guys i mentioned, we will be paying them nearly 80 million dollars. All for contracts that were signed within the last 2 offseasons. that's not like signing a star to a 8 year contract and the contract being an albatross towards the end. Those are almost immediate albatross contracts, which is hard to do.

I'd love to see a roundtable of actual modern day baseball minds discussing what mike hill has done the past 2 years and see just how much they trash him for being completely and utterly incompetent at his job.

to end my rant: TL/DR, Mike Hill is one of the worst general managers in baseball history.

- - - - - - - - - -

Dillo Peters a healthy scratch today in Jax. So at least they arent dumb enough to give Despaigne another start.

[Nick]

Is there a stat for Stolen Base adjusted OPS? Stealing 77 of 94 bags over the past two years has to be worth something.

[fish16]

Is there a stat for Stolen Base adjusted OPS? Stealing 77 of 94 bags over the past two years has to be worth something.

that is a good point, but i dont think it makes up for a complete lack of power and a low OBP for his career. My overall point is contract value is one of the most important things in just about all sports, even MLB without a salary cap. not necessarily for teams like the dodgers, red sox, or yankees, etc, but for the marlins, he is a terrible value. He is not nearly the worst value on the team, dont get me wrong, but that is mostly due to Mike Hill's complete and utter incompetence.

[emkayseven]

Remember when everyone acted like I was crazy for saying we would get swept?


We are still very much in this thing, like I said at the onset of this stretch it's about the whole picture and not any individual series. I am still of the opinion that we are in the driver seat, however it is completely baffling to me that they aren't going to at least make a small Nick Johnson type move to signal to the team that they believe in them

[fish16]

Remember when everyone acted like I was crazy for saying we would get swept?


We are still very much in this thing, like I said at the onset of this stretch it's about the whole picture and not any individual series. I am still of the opinion that we are in the driver seat, however it is completely baffling to me that they aren't going to at least make a small Nick Johnson type move to signal to the team that they believe in them

I thought you were being negative but you were completely right. That was as pathetic a series as this team has played all year.

This is just Jeffrey Loria's last fuck you to the city of miami.

[dim]

I complain a lot, and even I think you overdo it.

[fish16]

I complain a lot, and even I think you overdo it.

we have one of the worst front offices in all of sports. there is no overdoing it when it comes to constantly calling them our when their terrible moves affects a teams ability to contend.

[Namaste]

Remember when everyone acted like I was crazy for saying we would get swept?


We are still very much in this thing, like I said at the onset of this stretch it's about the whole picture and not any individual series. I am still of the opinion that we are in the driver seat, however it is completely baffling to me that they aren't going to at least make a small Nick Johnson type move to signal to the team that they believe in them

I thought you were being very pessimistic.

Somehow you KNEW the Marlins would go 1 for 22 with RISP.



*that's not a made up stat. It really happened.

[fish16]

I thought you were being very pessimistic.

Somehow you KNEW the Marlins would go 1 for 22 with RISP.



*that's not a made up stat. It really happened.

thats almost hard to do. impressively bad series.

Is despaigne really starting tonight?