Offseason 2015-2016

[Erick]

Yeah but the last rebuild was meant to yield a core that, generously, was meant to be more or less what the Marlins currently have. Maybe the names are different but a ++ pitcher, a lineup with 4-5 projectable starters, and a bunch of back end arms.

That was the logic behind the Toronto trade.

Now the Marlins are more or less there, maybe not exactly how they planned it (less from Toronto's haul, more from in-house) and they're ready to win except for, hey guess what, spending money to fortify the core. And they won't do it.

It's the same fucking death cycle. No team is going to be able to build a total winner completely in house. Even the '03 team - which is meant to be the gold standard for David v Goliath - had reinforcements added to a home grown core.

The is where it is because the drafting has sucked. The drafting sucks because of parsimonious policies and bad player evaluation. Now you're going all in on a move with an eye towards the future with that same bad player evaluation. No fucking way can you justify it. Fucking battered spouses.

It's debatable that they're "ready to win." The rotation is currently a glaring hole. Spending money on the remaining free agents doesn't seem like a realistic solution, and trades that improve the team dramatically seem unrealistic as well because the farm system sucks.

[tjfla]

The pic of Urias is amazing. How does one pitch with one eye?

http://www.baseball-reference.com/re...d=urias-000jul

Got it fixed I think in like August

- - - - - - - - - -

Where is this from?

All over,they offered Pollock and Corbin and we wanted more. Counter with like Pollock,Corbin,Shipley and more.(One report said we wanted Pollock,Corbin and Top 3 prospects) They said NO and moved on

We are not really into Pollock

[AdamRavs]

Got it fixed I think in like August

So thats why he gave up so many runs in AAA in like 2 startts? Could see out of both eyes?

[tjfla]

What we need to do is wait for the Japanese pitcher to sign with either LAD or NYY then call which ever team misses him.

[Swifty]

It's debatable that they're "ready to win." The rotation is currently a glaring hole. Spending money on the remaining free agents doesn't seem like a realistic solution, and trades that improve the team dramatically seem unrealistic as well because the farm system sucks.

I agree with you that the team needs things added to it. I think we disagree about whether the team should add a pitcher from free-agency. I think he Marlins could absolutely hang in the division with Stanton, Gordon, Yelich, Ozuna, hope for a kind of close to repeat year from Hech and figure Prado is going to continue to be Prado. Outside of Jose the rotation is probably 2-3 years away from even knowing what you have (I like Conley as a 3/4, I like Urena as a 3/4, but I think that's their ceiling and their floor is absolutely AAAA). I think they needed a 2 before Alvarez was non-tendered. I know they definitely need a 2 now. They don't have the talent to get one unless they dangle Yelich (which they shouldn't do).

They're in trouble for sure, but within the Jose window, they can win.

And for what it's worth, the team wasn't meant to be operating in a 3 year window with the new stadium. This is still nuttier than squirrel turds.

[HUGG]

If it's Houston, I hope we get Colin Moran

[tjfla]

If it's Houston, I hope we get Colin Moran

Moran,Marisnick and Martes hopefully!!!

If any deal its probably LAD or NYY. They like both of what those teams got but are waiting for that one guy that makes the deal crazy

[Nick]

I guess I shouldn't be, but I'm just in awe that this is happening.

[nny]

I'm not saying Ozuna > Pederson

But age 23 Ozuna: 4.5 rWAR/3.7 fWAR
Age 23 Penderson: 2.3 rWAR/2.8 fWAR

Obviously Ozuna struggled last year, but he also put up a .789 OPS in the second half compared to Pederson's .617. If Ozuna wasn't left in AAA for over a month, his final season numbers likely look a lot better.

Penderson definitely has more upside but I think adding both of them into a trade is more of a wash than would be cared to be admitted.

[tjfla]

I'm not saying Ozuna > Pederson

But age 23 Ozuna: 4.5 rWAR/3.7 fWAR
Age 23 Penderson: 2.3 rWAR/2.8 fWAR

Obviously Ozuna struggled last year, but he also put up a .789 OPS in the second half compared to Pederson's .617. If Ozuna wasn't left in AAA for over a month, his final season numbers likely look a lot better.

Penderson definitely has more upside but I think adding both of them into a trade is more of a wash than would be cared to be admitted.

Did u take into account that Jeff hates Ozuna and Mattingly loves Pederson?

- - - - - - - - - -

If anyone wants to know the problem with us just read this tweet

From
Rosenthal

#Marlins’ Loria on Fernandez: “There is nothing I am thinking about doing at the moment with him.”




What the fuck does he have think about? Do what 90% of owners do sit in an office and write checks

[Bobbob1313]

It really is amazing that they can't turn a cheap core of Stanton, Yelich, Ozuna, Gordon and Fernandez into a contender. That's astounding.

[thatnewguy]

We're the worst run organization in all of professional sports.

[Bobbob1313]

Kolek over Rodon and Nicolino over Heaney are basically the two places you can point to that ruined the Jose/Stanton era. Those two moves lowered both the ceiling and floor of this team by probably 3-4 wins last season and 5-6 over the next five, and led to the situation where they stupidly feel they have to trade Ozuna for pitching.

It's kind of crazy how clear it is that those two moves more than anything else will define the next decade of the franchise, and how equally clear it was at the time that they made the wrong choice in each instance. Because everything else about the team could be identical, with those two added on top.

[nny]

And it's not like that is being 20/20 and playing the result.

I mean, we didn't know about the Nicolino/Heaney thing but I severely doubt anybody would have prefered Nicolino over Heaney then even with Heaney's struggles after his call up (4.3 K/9 in AA!). And when we didn't pick Rodon that was a collective what the fuck?

- - - - - - - - - -

If you take what we've been told as fact:
-The Marlins approached Jose with an extension and he turned it down
-Boras clients rarely sign extensions
-Jose is unhappy here
-Jose was not great in the clubhouse

I know you're prefacing it with "assuming these are facts" but they did the last two same shit with Cabrera before they traded him. Leak stuff out about how he's "unhappy" and "bad for the clubhouse" to put a negative spin on keeping him and then trade him a couple months later.

[lou]

Don't forget it could be Rodon, Heaney, and payroll is still $62 million with Koehler/Cosart and Phelps in the bullpen as the 4-5 RHP behind Ramos, Capps, and Morris, meaning if they were to sign 1 free agent, they could have an absolutely outstanding pitching staff