Giancarlo: "I Do Not Like This at All”

[Namaste]

They don't give a shit about the fans.

Shitty business model.

Fans buy expensive jerseys, expensive beer, $6 cotton candy, ya know?

Maybe they make enough from revenue sharing and TV deals to not give a shit.

But know this, there has NEVER been a time when this organization has been so widely despised. Don't fool yourself. It's been 60/40, 70/30 in the past but there is no doubt in my mind that's its 95/5 at best.

Trade Stanton and it bolts to 99/1.

Common Hoosiers One Timer Baby Tonight!

[oakelmpine]

And the excuses continue for this FO. But its okay, 'cause the Marlins don't have any fans.

[Mainge]

And the excuses continue for this FO. But its okay, 'cause the Marlins don't have any fans.

Who's making excuses?

[oakelmpine]

I also remember the Kemp thing being fake.

Just like their promise to keep the payroll at a decent level.

Or was the Kemp thing more fake ?

[Bobbob1313]

The problem with the Angels and Dodgers "proposed deals" is we have zero way of verifying what the deals were. So, if you want to make Beinfest look bad, you can literally make the trade whatever you want it to be. That's easy and fun and makes your argument look great, but the dodgers deal looks a lot worse if it turns out it was actually Loney and Billingsley, which was comparable value at the time.

[Mainge]

Just like their promise to keep the payroll at a decent level.

Or was the Kemp thing more fake ?

What are you talking about?

Kemp was never offered, if you believe the reports. That doesn't mean they haven't done a shitty job.

[oakelmpine]

Who's making excuses?

Well saying the Maybin / Miller trade was "just one of those things" you can't afford to do that when you have a commodity that valuable.

If I was a trader on the market and missed that badly on a trade, I wouldn't be working on Wall Street for long. My ability to foresee the Market would be questioned.

However around here their lack of foresight on not just that trade but on many personnel decisions is just scoffed at, and people shake their shoulders and say, "so what we missed on that".

And their drafting has been abysmal. They have drafted exactly one player, Stanton, in the first two rounds since they have been here in 2002, that can be worth great value. Volstad is the only one other than Stanton that has even made a considerable impact on MLB. I doubt there are more than 5 or 6 teams that have had less home grown talent make it to the Show.

As for Fernandez & Yelich, they have yet to prove themselves for more than 1 year, and who knows if they can do it yet. The already proven track record should have been enough to make some changes in the FO. That is why many don't think they are really serious about trying to really win.

How do you trust the people that have made mistake after mistake in acquiring talent and then expect fans (your consumers) to believe you ?

I will always believe the reason the Marlins didn't go to the playoffs in 2008 & 2009 and possibly even 2010, when they had decent teams is because the talent they didn't get back in the Cabrera trade held them back.

[Mainge]

I still don't see anyone that's making excuses.

Most people here would agree with much of your post and yet, they're making excuses?

[oakelmpine]

What are you talking about?

Kemp was never offered, if you believe the reports. That doesn't mean they haven't done a shitty job.

We don't know if Kemp was offered or not. The only ones that know that for sure are those that were in the Dodgers FO & the Marlins FO.

Do you trust our people to tell the truth about it ? I know I don't and I wouldn't even put it past them to ask the Dodgers to lie about it.
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I still don't see anyone that's making excuses.

Most people here would agree with much of your post and yet, they're making excuses?

Well I see it as an excuse when people give them a pass by saying it was an okay trade "at the time". They aren't paid to make assessments based on "at the time" especially when you are making that critical of a trade.

People need to be held accountable in the FO, at least by the fans even if the owner doesn't hold them accountable.

[Beef]

It's also super douchey for people like me or you to say at the time that they got miller and maybin, 2 top of the top prospects, so great and then to criticize other folks for not seeing into the future

[Ramp]

There is no excuse for the Marlins not buying out Miguel Cabrera's contract. Because of that shortsightedness, they were forced to trade Miguel Cabrera because they couldn't afford him long term. That being said, they acquired 2 of the top 5 prospects in baseball for him, along with a few other players that many believed could be on a big league squad.

No one here is making excuses for them, but Miller and Maybin were rated as high as you can get.
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We don't know if Kemp was offered or not. The only ones that know that for sure are those that were in the Dodgers FO & the Marlins FO.

Do you trust our people to tell the truth about it ? I know I don't and I wouldn't even put it past them to ask the Dodgers to lie about it.

What in holy hell are you talking about? This has nothing to do with our people and there is no proof one way or the other if Kemp was ever offered. Why would our people lie about that anyway? It makes them look bad.

[Erick]

I'm surprised oakelmpine isn't getting more ehe's.

[Mainge]

I'm surprised oakelmpine isn't getting more ehe's.

I think, for the most part, his posts are well thought out and reasoned. I don't agree with some things he says but he deserves a real response.

He's not like tr305 or kingzfan

[Erick]

I think, for the most part, his posts are well thought out and reasoned. I don't agree with some things he says but he deserves a real response.

He's not like tr305 or kingzfan

I feel like saying stuff like "I wouldn't be surprised if they asked the Dodgers to lie about it" is funny.

He's made some fair points but he also keeps saying some weird things.

Like, for example, in the lies to Buehrle thread when he said that if Loria doesn't sue for libel, he's clearly lying...

[Mainge]

Well, yeah. I'll take weird over kingzemporer305 though