Buente Designated for Assignment; Cishek Recalled

[Omar]

The likelihood that one person will succeed, however, is higher than the likelihood that many will. That's also before you factor in that the many you're asking to pitch a bullpen game will do so after having pitched on the road trip in various capacities.

I mean, it's not like Sunday where we had a day off and could ward off the nuisance of having to go to the pen early. We don't see another off day until the West Coast trip is over.

I think it basically boils down to this:

1) AAA starter. If he does well, you get 5 innings out of him, 2 out of 1 more (maybe Webb?), then the aces. If he does poorly, you get the three innings you got on Sunday and you lose 1 of Hopper/Sanches if not both.
2) Bullpen game. Hopper for 3, Sanches for 2-3, then the aces. You're now guaranteed to lose your two long relievers for the rest of the weekend and possibly until Tuesday.

Which do you prefer, then, on a trip with no rest - probably losing one long man with the chance that the opposition thinks they're us and gets shut down OR definitely losing both long men and probably praying for rain on Sunday?

[THE_REAL_MIBS]

The likelihood that one person will succeed, however, is higher than the likelihood that many will. That's also before you factor in that the many you're asking to pitch a bullpen game will do so after having pitched on the road trip in various capacities.

I mean, it's not like Sunday where we had a day off and could ward off the nuisance of having to go to the pen early. We don't see another off day until the West Coast trip is over.

I think it basically boils down to this:

1) AAA starter. If he does well, you get 5 innings out of him, 2 out of 1 more (maybe Webb?), then the aces. If he does poorly, you get the three innings you got on Sunday and you lose 1 of Hopper/Sanches if not both.
2) Bullpen game. Hopper for 3, Sanches for 2-3, then the aces. You're now guaranteed to lose your two long relievers for the rest of the weekend and possibly until Tuesday.

Which do you prefer, then, on a trip with no rest - probably losing one long man with the chance that the opposition thinks they're us and gets shut down OR definitely losing both long men and probably praying for rain on Sunday?

I get what you're saying but Ricky is pitching on Sunday. He's likely going to give you 6-7 innings, meaning you wouldn't need Hopper or Sanches.

Let's look at the starters leading up to this game Saturday. Ricky tonight, Volstad tomorrow, Anibal on Thursday. With the way they've been pitching, you can pretty much count on Ricky and Anibal to give you a good 6-7 innings. Volstad has been pitching deeper into games lately having gone 6 innings in his two previous starts before his last and he could have gone at least another inning in his most recent start. All three have pretty good track records facing the Giants in San Francisco. If this holds true, we really shouldn't need the bullpen much in the next three games.

That leaves us with Vazquez's start on Friday. This is the wild card here. Yes, he's coming off a great start but that was his only really good start out of 9. I don't think anyone is confident that he can repeat that. If he can and we don't need the pen, go with the bullpen day on Saturday. If he can't or we need to lean on the pen more than anticipated in San Francisco, then call up a starter for Saturday.

[AdamRavs]

I say we bring up someone to hopefully give us 4 or 5 innings.. Burning through the pen is asking for problems.. Cause you never know if were gonna have to go to the pen early with any of our other starters. Bring up a sacrificial lamb and hope for the best.

[Omar]

I get what you're saying but Ricky is pitching on Sunday. He's likely going to give you 6-7 innings, meaning you wouldn't need Hopper or Sanches.

Let's look at the starters leading up to this game Saturday. Ricky tonight, Volstad tomorrow, Anibal on Thursday. With the way they've been pitching, you can pretty much count on Ricky and Anibal to give you a good 6-7 innings. Volstad has been pitching deeper into games lately having gone 6 innings in his two previous starts before his last and he could have gone at least another inning in his most recent start. All three have pretty good track records facing the Giants in San Francisco. If this holds true, we really shouldn't need the bullpen much in the next three games.

That leaves us with Vazquez's start on Friday. This is the wild card here. Yes, he's coming off a great start but that was his only really good start out of 9. I don't think anyone is confident that he can repeat that. If he can and we don't need the pen, go with the bullpen day on Saturday. If he can't or we need to lean on the pen more than anticipated in San Francisco, then call up a starter for Saturday.

Basically, what you're saying is that you want to tell Vazquez and Nolasco that the bullpen is going to barely be available for their starts this weekend. What if Nolasco gets shelled, something that isn't out of the question considering that he hearts extra base hits? What if Vazquez pitches like all of his starts before last Saturday?

So let's say the weekend goes as we would expect based on the first two months of the year. Vazquez goes on Friday and gets us 5 innings. Let's say we're up for some reason and then go Mujica 6, Webb 7, Dunn 8, Nuñez 9. Now, let's pretend that none of those four pitchers have pitched since Tuesday, even though that's preposterous. That means that they can each go an inning on Saturday for the bullpen game. So now we'll start with Badenhop for 1-3, Sanches 4-5, and then repeat Mujica-Webb-Dunn-Nuñez. Now, in this world where they were all available for these assignments and none of them performed poorly - who is left for Sunday for innings 8 and 9, even assuming Ricky has a great start and gives us 7 strong?

This is, of course, assuming that absolutely NOTHING goes wrong in this 72 hour turnaround.

[THE_REAL_MIBS]

Like I said, we really need to evaluate this again on Friday. If we're leaning heavy on the bullpen the next four games, by all means, call up a starter for Saturday. If we're not, I'd say we use the bullpen to cover the game on Saturday. By no means am I saying that we need to name a starter right now and stick to it like glue. All I'm saying is that we should consider using Saturday as a bullpen day rather than just completely ignore the possibility.

[Mainge]

Like I said, we really need to evaluate this again on Friday. If we're leaning heavy on the bullpen the next four games, by all means, call up a starter for Saturday. If we're not, I'd say we use the bullpen to cover the game on Saturday. By no means am I saying that we need to name a starter right now and stick to it like glue. All I'm saying is that we should consider using Saturday as a bullpen day rather than just completely ignore the possibility.

No we should not. Absolutely not.

[lou]

I think it's a bit dramatic to say you'd burn through the entire pen. So you use 5 relievers on RP day, including using Cishek. You still have 4 guys completely rested, and you can send Cishek right back down and call up Ceda and have a 5th fresh arm. I have a hard time believing we'd then use all 4-5 of those arms the next game, and whatever relievers pitched a shorter time of RP day, causing a pen catastrophe. A worst case scenario is ending up with a short 3-4 man bullpen on day 3 or optioning Cishek/Badenhop/Cedas and bringing up the other wave of Richardson, Koehler, or whoever. Again, we're talking about optioning the 8th and 9th guys in the bullpen here. This is not a big deal and is not torching the bullpen. If this was an every week occurrence, absolutely. But we're carrying 9 relievers. There are plenty of arms and innings here.

It's going to be ok if they do this. This is not a big deal.
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You're asking the bullpen to cover their current duties and then on top of that link together to pitch a whole game. Hoping on a AAA arm to get you 4-5 innings rather than over working your bullpen for one game seems fine with me.

How is this different than your 8th reliever (Badenhop) and 9th reliever (Cishek) throwing 4-5 innings?

[AdamRavs]

your also counting on them being effective as well too to get through 2 or 3 innings each.
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Also we have a open spot on the 40 now.. Lets use it to bring up a starter maybe someone gets hot.. As you never know if JJ will back on time.

[Mainge]

I think it's a bit dramatic to say you'd burn through the entire pen. So you use 5 relievers on RP day, including using Cishek. You still have 4 guys completely rested, and you can send Cishek right back down and call up Ceda and have a 5th fresh arm. I have a hard time believing we'd then use all 4-5 of those arms the next game, and whatever relievers pitched a shorter time of RP day, causing a pen catastrophe. A worst case scenario is ending up with a short 3-4 man bullpen on day 3 or optioning Cishek/Badenhop/Cedas and bringing up the other wave of Richardson, Koehler, or whoever. Again, we're talking about optioning the 8th and 9th guys in the bullpen here. This is not a big deal and is not torching the bullpen. If this was an every week occurrence, absolutely. But we're carrying 9 relievers. There are plenty of arms and innings here.

It's going to be ok if they do this. This is not a big deal.
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How is this different than your 8th reliever (Badenhop) and 9th reliever (Cishek) throwing 4-5 innings?

Good fucking luck getting through 9 with only 5. That wouldn't give us any better chance to win than your random AAA starter.

[HUGG]

Koehler is due to start on Thursday, will be interesting to see if he does so.

[Ramp]

Buente claimed by Rays

[Miamarlin21]

lol

[Chewford]

That is awesome somehow.

[AdamRavs]

Maybe the Rays need to fill out their AAA rotation? lol

[Todd]

I'd like to see what Hopperino could do with a start.

Seen it before. Not much.

10 GS, 6.95 ERA, 1.72 WHIP, .859 OPS against, under 5 IP/start.