Gary Sheffield Retires: Will He Be the First Marlin in the HOF?

[DropkickAlex]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=6131472

First Fish to get in?

[Miamarlin21]

Probably not because steroid stuff.

[Ramp]

if he gets in, I think he goes in as a Marlin

[emkayseven]

I think he'll go in eventually, but not anytime soon

And yes, he will go in as a Marlin. Always loved it here, won the championship here, and really it's only between us and LA

[Party]

He's said in the past he would prefer to go in as a Marlin.

[Fritz]

He'll never get in.

Media doesn't like him + steroid stuff = No Hall

[emkayseven]

media didn't like jim rice and I think the "suspected" guys (and maybe some of the convicted guys, even) will eventually get in. once one gets in (palmeiro? bagwell?) the dominoes will fall

[Swifty]

I dont remember where it was, it was either T&B or idiotville, but I had a longish post where I outlined why Sheffield would go in as a Marlin with the only threat, at the time being if he won a title with the Yankees and hit #500 with them (neither obviously happened).

I don't remember exactly what the numbers were, but we had LA beaten in games played, plate appearances and XBH and trailed them in HRs by single digits.

What does need to happen if we want him to go in as a Marlin is to bring him back to the organization, retire his jersey, etc. It shows that the organization identifies him as their own and it also provides an opportunity for media softening and identification as "our guy." or, to phrase it another way, the Jim Rice plan.

[THE_REAL_MIBS]

Had a nice chat with Sheffield about his Marlins days and Hall of Fame hopes. He wouldn’t mind going in as a Marlin, but that day probably isn’t coming any time soon after he’s eligible in 2014. Sheffield has some compelling numbers, but being named in the Mitchell Report won’t aid his candidacy.

Here are some excerpts from the interview:

On his time with the Marlins: “I have nothing but great things to say about it. We did everything [in 1997] we set out to do. Unfortunately we weren’t able to get the stadium they’re so blessed to have right now. If we would have gotten the stadium, you would have seen great teams put out on the field on a year-to-year basis because South Florida is where most players want to come and play and raise their families. I was just glad to be a part of it as long as I was.”

On the 1997 club: “Jim Leyland pulled us to the side and we had a conversation before we even suited up and that was the first thing he mentioned about treating spring training like it was the regular season and we were going to set the tone from day one. We were going to be a force to be reckoned with and were going to show people we were for real. Every day we suited up we came with a purpose and it started from day one.”

On whether he would want a Marlins cap on his Hall of Fame plaque: “Absolutely. That’s the team I won a championship with. Most people since I played with the Yankees associate me with them, but before I got to the Yankees everybody knew me from my Marlin days. Every time they mentioned the Marlins they’d talk about me and what I’d done there, and so I’m always grateful for that. This is one of the teams that’s dear to me and it’s always going to be my first team.”

On Mike Stanton possibly breaking his franchise single-season home run record: “Records are meant to be broken and there has to be somebody who sets them. I’m glad I’m the guy who set the record for home runs in a single season. That’s a high number. If anybody breaks it, that would be great. I wouldn’t be opposed to somebody breaking that record or feel any less about it. I enjoyed my time there. I put up great numbers. There are always going to be some young kids that come up and do better than you did.”

On being included in the Marlins’ countdown to the new ballpark: “I always wanted to be a part of what they have there because we made history there — the first team to ever win a [Marlins] World Series and that means a lot to me and I’m sure it means a lot to the fans. Whatever they want to do, I’m fine with it. If they want to include me, great. If not, that’s fine, too.”

On whether his inclusion in the Mitchell Report will hurt his Hall of Fame candidacy: “My body of work for three decades speaks for itself. We changed the game. That’s how I look at it. We walked 140-some times a year. I look at all the walks that I have and if I didn’t have those walks the way they pitch to great hitters nowadays, what my numbers could have been. I look at that and that’s what makes me more appreciative of what I’ve done. They tried to take me out of the game a lot of times and I still wound up having Hall of Fame numbers.”

On why he waited so long to announce retirement: “I was pretty much done last year. It was a matter of talking it over with my family and friends and they suggested I give it a year and really understand what it’s like to be at home during the summer spending time with your wife and kids, and then you can really look back and reflect on your career and it can be out of your system. That was the best advice I got. Anytime you do something for 25 years, you have the right to sit back and reflect on it. I did back and now that it’s out of my system I was able to go ahead and announce it and feel good about it.”

Gary Sheffield not opposed to going in as Florida Marlin if Hall calls

There's a little more to the blog post but this covers most of it.

[MiamiHomer]

Sheff was my fav.

[Swifty]

Still is my fav.

[Party]

Jim Rice: 16 seasons .298/.352/.502/.854 OPS+ 128 (.277/.330/.459/.789 on the road lulz)
Gary Sheffield: 22 seasons .292/.393/.514/.907 OPS+ 140

Sheffield played most of his career in big ballparks.

Top 10:

OBP 10 times
OPS 7 times
Adjusted OPS 9 times
Home Runs 7 times
Walks 9 times
Offensive WAR 7 times

Black Ink Batting - 4 (415), Average HOFer ≈ 27
Gray Ink Batting - 123 (153), Average HOFer ≈ 144
Hall of Fame Monitor Batting - 156 (77), Likely HOFer ≈ 100
Hall of Fame Standards Batting - 61 (28), Average HOFer ≈ 50

Similar Batters

Mel Ott (875) *
Reggie Jackson (864) *
Ken Griffey (851)
Fred McGriff (850)
Mickey Mantle (840) *
Billy Williams (837) *
Frank Robinson (836) *
Frank Thomas (832)
Al Kaline (830) *
Chipper Jones (822)

The title of "One of the Most Feared Hitters of His Era" is something that he's had from early on his career has a Marlin.

[emkayseven]

Joe Posnanski wrote this:

All of this leads to Gary Sheffield. He officially retired on Thursday, I guess, though he didn't play at all in 2010. He was a scary hitter. We sometimes joke around about how often people call a hitter "feared." But if any hitter of the last 44 or so years was truly scary to face, it was Sheffield with the way he waved that bat around, the absolute look of pure hate on his face, his almost magical ability to hit the ball wherever it happened to be thrown, his eagle eye ... all of it led to a gut-wrenching experience for pitchers.

The guy just obliterated mediocre pitchers:

-- Jamey Wright: .519 average, 6 homers in 27 at-bats.
-- Bruce Chen: .481 average, 5 homers in 27 at-bats.
-- Kent Bottenfield: .458 average, 3 homers in 24 at-bats.

But he cranked against great pitchers too, especially if they happened to be left-handed. He hit .389 against Jamie Moyer. He slugged .629 against Tom Glavine. He hit .474 against Kevin Brown. He got only 19 appearances against Roger Clemens but he hit .611. I'll repeat that. He hit .611. He slugged .537 against Pedro.

Point is, the guy was scary. And you look at some of his numbers -- 500 homers, 140 OPS+ -- these are Hall of Fame numbers.

But getting back to the point of the last section: Corner outfielders hit. That's what they do. They are, in most cases, not fast enough, gifted enough or good enough defensively to play one of the key defensive spots. Sheffield was by the numbers and reputation a poor defensive player who had to be moved off third base after he made 34 errors in 1993 and his outfield defense wasn't much to speak of either. So you would think that for Sheffield to be considered one of the great players in his era, he had to outhit just about everybody.

But did he? Bonds was a better hitter. MannyBManny was a better hitter. I think Bagwell was a better hitter, Thome was a better hitter ... I would argue that Edgar and Larry Walker were better hitters too.

For a long time, when someone would ask me if I thought Gary Sheffield was a Hall of Famer, I would say that I hadn't studied it but my first thought was: Yes. But after looking a bit, I'd say that my second thought is: No. I think, all things considered, there were at least five right fielders of my lifetime who were better players. Dewey got very little Hall of Fame support. Larry Walker has a long, uphill climb. I'd say Sheffield has a long line ahead of him.

[Swifty]

I'm confused as to his last point. He says that Bagwell is a better hitter (and therefore, at least imply, a more deserving HoF candidate) but I would say with absolute certainty that Bagwell is not a top-5 1B in my lifetime or just about anyone else's.

I'm also confused that he compares Sheffield to 6 hitters, only one of whom was a right-fielder for his entire career (Walker) and one of whom moonlighted in right (Manny).

His discrediting arguments seem to lack foundation. He's not as good as these guys, because position matters, but none of them played the same position.

It's just very hard to discredit a player that has a batting title, three top-3 MVP finishes, 9 all-stars and top-10 in HR's 7 different times.

Also, I'm not sure if I'm using the stat correctly, but he's top-100 all-time for career WAR among position players. (89th)

That certainly seems like a HoF career to me.

[Valid]

I thought you weren't allowed to choose what team you go in as anymore?