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Thread: Marlins 2017-2018 Offseason Discussion Thread

  1. #1676
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    Man all of that complaining for no top 100 prospects for naught.

    To note, not entirely defending the front office, but you got to give them the 2018 season. More reason to keep Yelich and Realmuto until at least next year to see if the pitcher's pan out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lou View Post
    Man all of that complaining for no top 100 prospects for naught.

    To note, not entirely defending the front office, but you got to give them the 2018 season. More reason to keep Yelich and Realmuto until at least next year to see if the pitcher's pan out.
    pretty much. Everyone loved the "we traded 3 good players and didnt get back a single top 100 guy" based on one mlb.com list written months ago. Nevermind the fact that neidert was on BA.com's list at midseason.

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    I wasn't involved in the Top 100 prospects discussion, but there are 32 teams in the mlb, if our best prospect is the 70th or 87th best prospect that's pretty terrible after trading away the best top of the lineup in baseball. Obviously a majority of that blame goes to the previous administration and GM, who is also our current GM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fish16 View Post
    pretty much. Everyone loved the "we traded 3 good players and didnt get back a single top 100 guy" based on one mlb.com list written months ago. Nevermind the fact that neidert was on BA.com's list at midseason.

    Prospect rankings don’t matter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Namaste View Post
    Prospect rankings don’t matter.
    i agree.

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    Quote Originally Posted by żNICK? View Post
    I wasn't involved in the Top 100 prospects discussion, but there are 32 teams in the mlb, if our best prospect is the 70th or 87th best prospect that's pretty terrible after trading away the best top of the lineup in baseball. Obviously a majority of that blame goes to the previous administration and GM, who is also our current GM.
    there are 30 teams in mlb. And you cant just talk about the talent we traded away and not even bring up the fact that Dee Gordon and Stanton both had large salaries for years into the future. Stanton has a deal that will make you glad we traded him in a few years and Gordon's deal doesnt give you much in the way of surplus value. We did pretty damn well on that Gordon deal (we'll see how well in the future but as of just the prospects we got we did pretty well) and Stanton fucked us by utilizing his NTC and essentially forcing us to trade him to the Yankees without anyone else on his NTC list truly interested.

    Also, people do realize how injury prone Stanton has been in his career, right? He is obviously one of the best players in MLB, but for a team that obviously has severe financial constraints, I cant blame the front office for just wanting to bite the bullet and get rid of the whole contract and not be stuck with an Albert Pujols type deal years down the line.

    I also think Guzman is going to be a fucking stud and will rise up those rankings by next offseason so I think that deal wont be nearly as bad as people think given how much money we shed and how good Guzman will be.

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    Damn Chris Volstad re-signed with the White Sox so we will not be seeing a battle of former dissapointing marlins prospects for a rotation spot between him and Jacob Turner.

  6. #1681
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    “Stanton fucked us”

    I lol’d.

    The NL MVP. 59 HR’s.

    He REALLY fucked us fans.

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    My bad on the 32 teams, I've had NFL on the mind recently.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Namaste View Post
    “Stanton fucked us”

    I lol’d.

    The NL MVP. 59 HR’s.

    He REALLY fucked us fans.
    he fucked the team. He was well within his right because the previous regime foolishly gave him the NTC, but theres no question his utilization of his NTC fucked us in that deal.

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    and Loria fucked us, I can't believe this is even a question. Stanton had every right to do what he did. The new FO waited until November to even speak to him, when day 1 Jeter should've been sitting down with Stanton, explaining the situation, and trying to work out a plan that would benefit both Stanton and the Marlins.

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    Quote Originally Posted by żNICK? View Post
    and Loria fucked us, I can't believe this is even a question. Stanton had every right to do what he did. The new FO waited until November to even speak to him, when day 1 Jeter should've been sitting down with Stanton, explaining the situation, and trying to work out a plan that would benefit both Stanton and the Marlins.
    Im agreeing with you. Ive said Stanton was perfectly within his rights to hold the team hostage because he had a NTC. But i dont think any amount of "sitting down" with Stanton would have given him any inclination to play it any differently than he did. You think simply by talking to him we're all of a sudden gonna make him change his mind and accept a trade to STL?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fish16 View Post
    Im agreeing with you. Ive said Stanton was perfectly within his rights to hold the team hostage because he had a NTC. But i dont think any amount of "sitting down" with Stanton would have given him any inclination to play it any differently than he did. You think simply by talking to him we're all of a sudden gonna make him change his mind and accept a trade to STL?
    No I don't, but I do think it possibly avoids making a fool of yourself when you go to SF and STL, and doesn't make you look completely desperate by the time the Yankees get involved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by żNICK? View Post
    No I don't, but I do think it possibly avoids making a fool of yourself when you go to SF and STL, and doesn't make you look completely desperate by the time the Yankees get involved.
    I do see where youre coming from and we can just agree to disagree, i just dont think that makes you end up getting anything better for him. I think the only thing that does is make the yankees know theyre the only one involved in the bidding. It was clear the dodgers werent really interested given what they were offering (if you believe tjfla), and I think what they were trying to do was to try to bring more teams in while they were negotiating with the yankees in the hopes of maybe extracting more when Stanton inevitably declined the trade to SF and STL. I also dont think it was unthinkable that Stanton ended up choosing SF or STL if we told him that it was a choice between going there or staying here during a full on rebuild.

    - - - - - - - - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by żNICK? View Post
    No I don't, but I do think it possibly avoids making a fool of yourself when you go to SF and STL, and doesn't make you look completely desperate by the time the Yankees get involved.
    I do see where youre coming from and we can just agree to disagree, i just dont think that makes you end up getting anything better for him. I think the only thing that does is make the yankees know theyre the only one involved in the bidding. It was clear the dodgers werent really interested given what they were offering (if you believe tjfla), and I think what they were trying to do was to try to bring more teams in while they were negotiating with the yankees in the hopes of maybe extracting more when Stanton inevitably declined the trade to SF and STL. I also dont think it was unthinkable that Stanton ended up choosing SF or STL if we told him that it was a choice between going there or staying here during a full on rebuild.

  13. #1688
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    Heliot Ramos (rumored primary piece of San Fran deal) is ranked 8 spots from Guzman in BA, so I think the narrative of Stanton screwing the Marlins should probably be closed. Castro is probably going to net something like those secondary Shaw and Beede type prospects when he is eventually traded, so this looks like a wash to me. Marlins seemingly didn't do so bad with their second fall back option. I agree that the contract isn't great for an acquiring team, as it's 3 years of Stanton and an opt out, or he gets hurt and you have David Wright/Albert Pujols times 2.

    They just need to keep it up and continue shedding the Strailys/Bours/Castros/Dietrich/Barraclough/Prado/Ziegler/etc. by at latest the deadline this year for more guys in AA, and sign Realmuto for 5.

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    One thing I think we can all agree on is that this slow offseason is really fucking annoying, and I think when we eventually do end up trading yelich it’s gonna bring all the “same as loria” shit again when that wasn’t fair earlier and still won’t be fair when we inevitably trade yelich and the rest of those guys. And it will likely end up that way no matter the package we get for yelich

    - - - - - - - - - -

    I do however think it will get picking up for pitchers once darkish signs and then for hitters once jd Martinez signs

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    As a quick aside based on the prior conversation, Christian Pache was rated pretty high in Keith Law's rankings and Law says that he sees 20 HR power in his future despite not having hit a HR in his career to this point.

  16. #1691
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    We don't take kindly to Keith Law 'round these parts
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    Need help? Questions? Concerns? Want to chat? PM me!

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    Thing that really kills me on Guzman is he going to be 22 in a couple of days and Frisaro is reporting that he will probably be sent to Batavia to start out. What is going on with him that at this age and point that he still isn't going to head to full season ball? I know I read somewherer that he wore down in short season ball last year if that is the case it's not looking promising for him to be a starter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flamarlins93 View Post
    Thing that really kills me on Guzman is he going to be 22 in a couple of days and Frisaro is reporting that he will probably be sent to Batavia to start out. What is going on with him that at this age and point that he still isn't going to head to full season ball? I know I read somewherer that he wore down in short season ball last year if that is the case it's not looking promising for him to be a starter.
    I think that would be foolish. At the very least he should be playing full season ball at Greensboro. I was thinking Jupiter wouldnt be too crazy either. I hope this new front office babies our pitchers less than the previous one. Mostly because the results from the previous regime were awful despite the over carefulness in terms of injuries. I also hope we stop innings limits in individual games and move more toward pitch limits. It drives me crazy seeing guys like Paddack cruise through 5 innings and then taken out despite only throwing 60 pitches or something stupid.

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    I mean if he was 19 I could see sending him back to short season ball. At 22 I would think he would be in Greensboro for sure even if they decide to have him start the season in the pen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flamarlins93 View Post
    I mean if he was 19 I could see sending him back to short season ball. At 22 I would think he would be in Greensboro for sure even if they decide to have him start the season in the pen.
    Ya, id just throw him to jupiter at that age despite his lack of experience. I think his stuff is good enough where he wont be a train wreck, you coud get him in a great pitchers league and ballpark, and you could let him pitch against similar aged guys rather than just using his stuff to dominate younger guys. I would understand Greensboro, but batavia makes no sense to me.

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