2009 Marlins Trade Deadline Discussion

[MiamiHomer]

Very nice road trip. Beinfest has told the Herald that he is making calls but will we ultimately make a solid move to compete for the wild card? Who knows.

[jOOj]

I would like to think Gaby was called up and not used to insure he doesn't get injured this week since he will be traded.

Yes I know this makes no sense.

[mbitcronod12]

Gaby was called up to fill the much needed bench warmer spot. It's been vacant since Fredo couldn't play because of the injury.

I'm really thinking we need a 5th starter. I'm a little worried about who's going to take that spot on Saturday. Miller sure as hell isn't ready and West needs more time, too.

[Marlinsfan4lyfe]

Hopper could get a spot start until we find someone else to fill the role.

[wanks1212]

Carl Pavano's going to be the starter on Saturday.

[Malman]

Too bad for Alyssa Milano...she'll have missed Carl by a week.

[tjfla]

O yes we are buyers and we are looking for a SP/RP and a bat either an OF or 3B

Carl Pavano is still the name I hear as long as they pick up his salary.

Pittsburgh is gonna be the interesting team because we could get Andy Laroche or if we really want to Freddy Sanchez who will be just a rental.

[MiamiHomer]

Yay tj is back...i was afraid we lost our Ken Rosenthals.

[tjfla]

I thought I lost u guys:( Thank God it is back!!! But yes I should be talking to him tommorrow and ill let u guys know

But we will be BUYERS!!!

6-0 Beinfest must have told the guys,win and will spend/lose and the vets are gone

[MiamiHomer]

# Joe Frisaro of MLB.com writes that the Marlins are cautiously watching the trade market. "We've been looking; Larry Beinfest has been looking at moves for a month," Marlins president David Samson said. "It's a difficult scenario because we're not willing to trade our future, because we have such good position players coming up.

from MLBtraderumors.

[FishFanInPA]

Guarantee Beinfest uses some excuse and doesnt do squat.

[MiamiHomer]

Guarantee Beinfest uses some excuse and doesnt do squat.

Yeah, we don't have money....

[Beef]

Guarantee Beinfest uses some excuse and doesnt do squat.

How do you define doesn't do squat here? Are you doing the thing you did before where if you don't hear anything about what's happening then nobody is even going into work?

[FishFanInPA]

Yeah, we don't have money....

If you dont have the money to make one deal or two to help the team then sell. Tom Hicks is killing the Rangers. They are a contending team who prolly won't do anything because of his money woes.

[MiamiHomer]

LOS ANGELES -- For the Marlins to pull the trigger on a deal before Friday's Trade Deadline, a number of factors must first fall into place.

Foremost, the organization isn't willing to spin off top-rated prospects for a quick fix.

The team also has made a conscious decision not to force a trade just to make a trade.

Still in position to make a run at the National League East title, as well as the Wild Card, president of baseball operations Larry Beinfest has been working the phones for about a month looking to upgrade.

The struggle is so many teams are in the same boat as the Marlins, and the players who might be available may not be worth the risk of trading away key prospects.

"We've been looking; Larry Beinfest has been looking at moves for a month," Marlins president David Samson said. "It's a difficult scenario because we're not willing to trade our future, because we have such good position players coming up.

"We feel like we're in position to do something, which is critically important, which is to be good each year. We don't want to hurt that streak of being competitive every year."

The prospects all teams are inquiring about are outfielder Mike Stanton and first baseman Logan Morrison. Both are regarded as untouchable. Both could be making the leap from Double-A Jacksonville to starting in the big leagues as early as next year.

"We're looking to improve ourselves right now," Beinfest said. "We are active. I don't think we've ever really been inactive. It's just different every year, and every team is different."

In recent weeks, the Marlins already made moves to upgrade the bullpen. Veterans Brendan Donnelly and Luis Ayala have been added, but the search continues to add more parts.

"We've talked about some of our younger guys getting experience, and getting better as the season goes on," Beinfest noted.

Spending wisely on payroll is crucial for the Marlins, a low-revenue-generating franchise. A new, retractable-roof ballpark, which is set to open in 2012, will help push up payroll. Until then, the team will be on a tight budget.

"We're not building for 2012. We're building to win, every single year," Samson said. "So we have to be careful.

"We look at the players we have, and we're set up for years. When we go into the new ballpark, we want to be more than competitive. We're not willing to wait until 2012. If there is a chance to get better now, we want to do it. But it's a fine line because you don't want to do it at the expense of the future."

If there is an established player available to help improve the team's playoff chances now, this front office has shown it is willing to pull the trigger.

In 2003, for instance, the Marlins acquired reliever Ugueth Urbina from the Rangers for a package of prospects that included first baseman Adrian Gonzalez, who now is an All-Star with the Padres.

"It's a dilemma everybody faces. We faced it, too, in July of 2003, we traded Adrian Gonzalez and got back Ugueth Urbina," Samson said. "The difference between now and then was, if you recall, Ugueth Urbina was leading the American League in saves. He was the primary closer on the market, hands down. It's been a little different this year in defining an impact player."

http://florida.marlins.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090726&content_id=6069884&vkey=news_fla&fext=.jsp&c_id=fla

[Namaste]

No need to make a move for the sake of making a move.

I mean, who's out there that we won't have to give away a big piece of the future for?

[Metes]

Yeah of the people available, I don't see us making any deals. Either they can't help us or they would cost too much.

[Ramp]

Gotta suck for Mike Hill to be the GM and still have no say on this team lol

[tjfla]

Not a weird rumor but hearing WAIT FOR IT


Jeremy Hermida to Cincy for a pitcher

[MiamiHomer]

Harang? Arroyo?

[tjfla]

Either Harang or Arroyo I am hearing. We still like Pavano too. But Cincy would do a deal with Hermida as other teams want prospects


Of course Harang would cost more tho

[nny]

Arroyo would suck

Harang would be cool if it's not much more than hermida
--------------------
actually would be a lot more than cool

I like harang
--------------------
# 4 years/$36.5M (2007-10), plus 2011 club option

* re-signed by Cincinnati 2/07 (avoided arbitration, $5.5M-$4.25M)
* 07:$4.25M, 08:$6.75M, 09:$11M, 10:$12.5M, 11:$12.75M ($2M buyout)
* 2011 option increases to $13M with 210 IP in 2010
* if traded, 2011 option becomes mutual option at $14M ($2.5M buyout)

lol n/m at harang
--------------------
# 2 years/$25M (2009-10), plus 2011 club option

* signed extension with Cincinnati 2/07
* $2.5M signing bonus (paid 2008)

* 09:$9.5M, 10:$11M, 11:$11M club option ($2M buyout)
* 2011 option may increase to $13M based on IP
* agreed to give up 2008 performance bonuses as part of deal

uhhhh major n/m arroyo? 11m to a guy who sucks?

[tjfla]

Talked to buddy and says we are BUYERS but the market is waiting to see what the Blue jays get for Halladay.

Teams don't wanna sell low and wanna see how much they get for Halladay.

We are looking for a SP,a setup arm if not to expensive and a bat who can play OF or 3B.

Names Heard
Pitchers Carl Pavano,Aaron Harang,Bronson Arroyo,David Aardsma,George Sherrill,John Grabow and Arthur Rhodes:fip(Yes same guy we could have resgined last year and didn't)

Hitters Andy Laroche,Freddy Sanchez,Russell Branyan,Ty Wigginton

Guys we are using as chips
Jeremy Hermida,Gaby Sanchez,prospects with Baltimore and Pitt asking for packages built around Chris Coghlan and Seattle and Cincy asking for packages built around Jeremy Hermida

A name that is popping up is Ryan Tucker,seems we are trying to use him in alot of deals
--------------------
Well I think with the Harang or Arroyo deals Cincy would be throwing in cash too.

[Omar]

Morrison/Tucker/RVH/Coghlan for Halladay

Please?

[tjfla]

Morrison/Tucker/RVH/Coghlan for Halladay

Please?

Never happen Logan Morrison and Stanton are OFF limits

[Omar]

I may sound like a broken record here, but Actual Talent > Prospective Talent. You don't just have Roy Halladay available every year, and you have no MLB track record on a guy like Morrison to prove he's going to hit. Prospects fail to pan out all the time while you know what you're getting with Halladay.

Man up and make the damn move. It's not entirely relevant, but we had two big time hitters in 2003 (Stokes and Gonzalez). We dealt one of them for Urbina and ended up lifting the WS trophy. I don't think anyone regrets that deal - and it was for a reliever, not a top of the line starter. And, well, what do you know - one of the two didn't pan out. Make the damn move!

[Beef]

I may sound like a broken record here, but Actual Talent > Prospective Talent. You don't just have Roy Halladay available every year, and you have no MLB track record on a guy like Morrison to prove he's going to hit. Prospects fail to pan out all the time while you know what you're getting with Halladay.

Man up and make the damn move. It's not entirely relevant, but we had two big time hitters in 2003 (Stokes and Gonzalez). We dealt one of them for Urbina and ended up lifting the WS trophy. I don't think anyone regrets that deal - and it was for a reliever, not a top of the line starter. And, well, what do you know - one of the two didn't pan out. Make the damn move!

See, I don't mind this kind of thinking. I don't like when people say things like "Make it happen!!!!" but will then get pissed when you actually give up what it takes to make it happen. I like your stance, as it is fair. Certainly, a lot of people would be upset, a lot of people would wait to decide whether or not they are upset based on how everything ends up playing out and other people would change their opinion of a move unless we win the World Series and whoever we trade sucks forever

[nny]

I think it's unfair to say we won in 2003 because of the trade. As you say, it was just a reliever.

[tjfla]

I may sound like a broken record here, but Actual Talent > Prospective Talent. You don't just have Roy Halladay available every year, and you have no MLB track record on a guy like Morrison to prove he's going to hit. Prospects fail to pan out all the time while you know what you're getting with Halladay.

Man up and make the damn move. It's not entirely relevant, but we had two big time hitters in 2003 (Stokes and Gonzalez). We dealt one of them for Urbina and ended up lifting the WS trophy. I don't think anyone regrets that deal - and it was for a reliever, not a top of the line starter. And, well, what do you know - one of the two didn't pan out. Make the damn move!

I agree with u but it would probably be Morrison/West/Coghlan who they want and Halladay would be a 1 and half year rental. Unlike the Phillies,we don't offer arbitration to any guys,we don't draft guys who have fallen based on signing or make big FA signings. The Phillies could make a Happ/Drabek/Brown deal and next year take a pitcher at #25 who fell because he wanted 4 million and he is a replacement for Drabek.

If the same guy fell to us at #18 we would pass.Example the kid that St Louis got is better than Chad James but cost more. Sh*t we wont even pay James another $100,000 to make his daddy happy.

Sad fact is we won't and don't pay anyone and only are a develop and trade team at this point

[Ramp]

Arroyo no longer tomorrow's probable starter (http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/probable_pitchers.jsp?c_id=cin)

*ends self*

[MiamiHomer]

NO please god no...I wanted the fat dude. (if this even involves the Marlins)
--------------------
tjfla update?

[Omar]

Rotoworld's 3:39 PM Update on Arroyo:

Jeff Fletcher of AOL Fanhouse reports that the Reds "are close to doing something," most likely with Bronson Arroyo, Aaron Harang or Francisco Cordero.

Following a team conference call on Monday, it is believed that the Reds are officially "sellers." The Dodgers, who are not sold on Jason Schmidt's comeback attempt, could be in the mix for Arroyo and Harang, but would prefer a deal for Cliff Lee. The Reds would likely have to pick up some salary in any possible trade.

[tjfla]

Arroyo no longer tomorrow's probable starter (http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/probable_pitchers.jsp?c_id=cin)

*ends self*

All I can say is told ya. LOL No updates. I think this is just precaution but make sure to see if Hermida is in the lineup tommorrow or Wednesday.

If we do a deal with the Reds would be Arroyo,Arthur Rhodes and possibly another player such as Lance Nix,Chris Dickerson or Jerry Hairston plus cash for Jeremy Hermida,RVH/Badenhop and prospects

[MiamiHomer]

Well we don't play today.

[nny]

fuck arroyo so hard

[MiamiHomer]

Dickerson got hurt Sunday as well and Nix is bleh. Hairston is nothing special.

[tjfla]

Ya would just be a backup player so we can keep Maybin down. We are after Arroyo and Rhodes

[wanks1212]

Arroyo sucks. Harang or Pavano would be cool. Rhodes would be fine.

If the 3rd guy in the deal were Jonny Gomes, that would make things a bit more interesting, but Gomes may not be going anywhere and he's arby eligible.

[lou]

For the record, Arroyo makes $11 million (additional $2 million buyout, so $13) in 2010.

No. Fucking. Way.

[FishFanInPA]

Bronson Arroyo is not what i thought of when i said we needed help.

[Fish and Chips]

could be to the yanks
http://mlb.fanhouse.com/2009/07/27/yankees-reds-working-on-arroyo-deal/

[Beef]

No, I think it is best to blindly assume Arroyo is a Marlin

[FishFanInPA]

Ur sarcasm is not needed there.

[Bobbob1313]

I think it's unfair to say we won in 2003 because of the trade. As you say, it was just a reliever.

Yeah, I'm not so sure I like saying that trading for urbina is even close to comparable to a potential halladay deal.

[Omar]

You're right, we traded a top prospect for a reliever that may or may not have been the reason we won the World Series. Why not, then, trade a top prospect for a pitcher who is clearly superior and will be here next year?

[FishFanInPA]

id think he wouldnt approve a deal here

[Bobbob1313]

You're right, we traded a top prospect for a reliever that may or may not have been the reason we won the World Series. Why not, then, trade a top prospect for a pitcher who is clearly superior and will be here next year?

Because it would be trading more than one top prospect for said pitcher, who is much more expensive and who might not even approve a trade to us.

I also don't think that at the time, Adrian Gonzalez was as highly thought of as Stanton or Morrison.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your point, I just think it is enormously underselling both what Halladay can do and what we'd have to give up to get him by comparing him to Urbina.

Also, who says we will want to pay Halladay next year?

[Omar]

It's important to mention that mention of the Urbina trade was not comparison straight up but merely for a foundation of a deal we've done in the past containing one of our better hitting prospects. Furthermore, as to your point on Gonzalez, wasn't he the #1 pick overall?

I would think that if we trade for him this year it's for both this year and next. Also, I doubt he denies a trade here to be honest. We're a team in the thick of the chase for the playoffs with a pitcher friendly park, a non-psycho environment, and a team that already boosts one of the NL's two best players and a Cy Young candidate.

[Bobbob1313]

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't Stokes more highly thought of than Gonzalez at the time?

[lou]

You're right, we traded a top prospect for a reliever that may or may not have been the reason we won the World Series. Why not, then, trade a top prospect for a pitcher who is clearly superior and will be here next year?

Sub, ignoring the potential for trading Halladay after the 2009 if we were to get him, here's what payroll would look like with him. I'm taking the liberty of cutting a lot of the arbitration guys, and assuming the trade includes West as a piece that realistically could be on the 2010 squad from the get go.

C John Baker $415,000
1B Gaby Sanchez $405,000
2B Chris Coghlan $405,000
3B Emilio Bonifacio $405,000
SS Hanley Ramirez $7,000,000
LF Hermida/Ross $4,000,000
RF Brett Carroll $410,000
CF Cameron Maybin $410,000
B Wes Helms $950,000
B Brett Hayes $400,000
B John Raynor $400,000
B Veteran 1B/OF $1,250,000
B Veteran Bench $750,000

SP Roy Halladay $15,750,000
SP Josh Johnson $5,000,000
SP Ricky Nolasco $4,250,000
SP Chris Volstad $415,000
SP Andrew Miller $2,250,000
RP Matt Lindstrom $1,250,000
RP Leo Nunez $1,100,000
RP Rick Vanden Hurk $410,000
RP Burke Badenhop $410,000
RP Ryan Tucker $400,000
RP Dan Meyer $410,000
RP Another Lefty $400,000

$49,245,000

We're talking an easy $50 million payroll even with trading Uggla, Ross/Hermida, Cantu, Amezaga, Anibal, Amezaga, Pinto, and Proctor off the island. You could nickel and dime this lineup a little with getting the bench cheaper, removing a SP and using something cheaper, or whatever, but this is a very expensive team for 2010. I still think my argument holds firm at $45 million. Maybe in 2011 they will approach $50, but you have to imagine $40 is the number for 2010 at the absolute most. And I can't see the Marlins devoting 40% of payroll to 220 innings pitched.

I say keep the farm, hope to god Uggla, Hermida, and the out of position 2B hit a bit more, and hope the SP and bullpen hold firm. If anything, trading a B SP prospect for Teahen is all I'd do.

[Omar]

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't Stokes more highly thought of than Gonzalez at the time?
I think they were pretty neck and neck

[MiamiHomer]

Arroyo no longer tomorrow's probable starter (http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/probable_pitchers.jsp?c_id=cin)

*ends self*

5:51pm: MLB.com's Mark Sheldon says that Arroyo is indeed scheduled to start for the Reds tomorrow. Tuesday's starter had been listed as TBA in error.

Just to clear that up.

[wanks1212]

If the FO believes the team is in this, they need to go out and shore up the rotation and lineup without regard to the cost (outside of Stanton and MAYBE Logan). If the FO doesn't believe the team can contend, they need to sell off those assets at their peak value (Ross, Kiko, to a lesser extent Cantu).

"Holding" and/or dealing for something like a LOOGY does nothing for the present and nothing for the future. There's absolutely no benefit whatsoever to keeping the team as is and hoping for rebounds from the current underperformers.

[MiamiHomer]

Willingham 3-4 with 2 HR 8 RBI's just sayin'

[Ramp]

Willingham 3-4 with 2 HR 8 RBI's just sayin'

good heavens

[Beef]

I remember when I told him he was gon be so great and then he was like, alright, well, spring trainings over, i gotta go to the minors

[Marlinsfan4lyfe]

I wish the organization would swallow their pride and bring back Hammer.

Is Adam Dunn on the market? Hes got a 2 year 20 million dollar contract. He strikes out a lot, but he hits home runs, drives in runs, and gets on base (.402 OBP this season).

Also, Bobby Abreu's 1 year 5 million dollar contract makes me sick to my stomach.

[m26555]

Willingham 3-4 with 2 HR 8 RBI's just sayin'
Two grand salamis.

[Marlinsfan4lyfe]

i want Hammer back so bad.

[Swifty]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Go for broke, or don't do anything.

I would deal Cam, I would deal Stanton, I would deal West, I'd even deal Logan, just ravage our system if it means we get that elite starter to slot behind JJ and Nolasco and elite corner player to get that .299 OBP out of the lineup. We'd be so scary good it'd be worth it. We need to build up a winning goodwill heading into the stadium. Don't be stupid and deal Tucker for Arthur Rhodes (or his 2009 replacement).

Or, just say the hell with it, get whatever you can for Cantu and Uggla, move Coghlan to 2B, let Cam play the rest of '09 with the big club and prime Logan for a late August callup if Gaby can't handle 1B.

We either need to turn the roster over enough to get Cam, Logan and possibly Stanton some AB's or just fucking go for it.

That being said, I do hope we hang onto Hermida, I know it's been said about 458294 times, but he really looks like he's starting to get it, and that's exciting.

[Metes]

I'm with Swift here. Piss or get off the pot.

[mbitcronod12]

I'm a little late to the party (stupid work) but I saw this on my phone earlier from Rosenthal.

Earlier Monday, Fanhouse.com reported that the Reds are in "serious discussions" with the Yankees about a trade involving Arroyo. One source with knowledge of the talks told FOXSports.com that nothing is imminent, although Arroyo is on the Yankees' list of potential pitching acquisitions.

The Yankees believe the amount of money remaining on his contract is prohibitive. Arroyo is due to earn $11 million next year, and the Reds currently hold a team option for 2011.


MLB trade deadline buzz: Monday's edition (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9858776/MLB-trade-deadline-buzz:-Monday's-edition)

That made me feel better because I don't want to pay Arroyo $11 million next year when he sucks.

Our starting pitching depth is a little thin right now so I'm no averse to obtaining a starter, just not Arroyo.

[nny]

Harang though would be all kinds of awesome

moving him from cinci to here would major drop his HRs and he has awesome k/bb

he wouldn't be an ace but he'd be a front line starter

if we really can get him for hermida and, I dunno, like one of our b- like Tucker/Coghlan/ect, with cinci eating, i dunno, half?....that's a bad deal for cinci though unless the really believe in hermida....that'd be all kinds of awesome for this year and next year
--------------------
I'm with Swift here. Piss or get off the pot.

I'm completely get off the pot. We still just have too many holes. Getting another starter and replacing bonifacio does not fix everything else and '11 and '12 are just too important to give up on
--------------------
I wish the organization would swallow their pride and bring back Hammer.

Is Adam Dunn on the market? Hes got a 2 year 20 million dollar contract. He strikes out a lot, but he hits home runs, drives in runs, and gets on base (.402 OBP this season).

Also, Bobby Abreu's 1 year 5 million dollar contract makes me sick to my stomach.

Dunn won't be traded, he's the only thing bringing fans to that stadium and their owner has basically said as much.

And yeah at abreu lol
--------------------
I remember when I told him he was gon be so great and then he was like, alright, well, spring trainings over, i gotta go to the minors

Is there seriously any player this FO has fucked up more with than Hammer?

Owns minor leagues since he's 23, does not become MLB regular until 27. His repeat of jupiter after he put up a .881 OPS IN FUCKING JUPITER is just laughbly dumb.

And while I still don't fault trading him instead of cody or hermida, fact remains we sold major low, got nothing, can well, now he's healthy and awesome like he was last year before he got injured.

[nny]

with garko being traded I have to wonder if there's any place for cantu now
--------------------
Barnes is probably what to expect for Cantu to. You hope for better but a ~B minus-ish spec is probably what we'd get. From looking around I actually kinda like him and, since imo we should get off the pot, wish we'd have done it if it was available to us.

[MiamiHomer]

Ross Gload never gave the trading deadline a thought when he woke up on the morning of July 31, 2000. He was oblivious to it. He was a minor-league player living on minor-league pay.

``I had bigger things on my mind than if I was going to be traded,'' said Gload, who was in the Marlins' minor-league system at the time. ``I was probably figuring out if I was going to eat Burger King or McDonald's that morning.''

Then the phone rang. The words on the other end said, ``We've traded you.''

Looking back on it nine years later, it's probably fair to say that the Marlins' deadline-day deal with the Chicago Cubs -- Gload and fellow minor-leaguer David Noyce for past-his-prime outfielder Henry Rodriguez -- isn't one that resonates today.

It lacked panache. It became just another, largely forgotten trade.

But as the clock winds toward Friday's

4 p.m. trade deadline -- the last time this season that teams can deal players without having to first clear them through waivers -- the Marlins are looking at potential impact trades, ones they hope can spark a late-season playoff run.

``We're looking for ways to improve ourselves right now,'' said Larry Beinfest, the Marlins' president of baseball operations. ``We are active.''

Beinfest said he is satisfied that the Marlins -- 6 ½ games out of first place in the National League East and 3 ½ games behind in the NL wild-card race entering Monday -- are in contention and trending upward.

The Marlins, who open a six-game homestand against the Atlanta Braves and Chicago Cubs on Tuesday night, are emerging from a successful trip in which they won five out of six games in San Diego and Los Angeles.

But it's uncertain at what positions the tight-lipped Beinfest would like to upgrade, or how he would go about doing it. Outside of shortstop Hanley Ramirez, there is room for improvement in almost every area. The Marlins could be looking at any combination of closers, starting pitchers or position players.

They don't want to part with top minor-league prospects, namely Mike Stanton and Logan Morrison, which suggests they are willing to entertain offers for ready-made players such as Dan Uggla and Jeremy Hermida, whose salaries will continue to escalate through the arbitration process.

MONEY FACTOR

``Every year we have to approach differently,'' Beinfest said. ``Money plays a factor. It always does. We have several very good young players in our minor leagues that are not far away from the major leagues. We have to take that into consideration. We have to look at if we're able to keep the players that you traded for. The amount of time that you can hold onto them matters.

``Every year we have to put all those things in the hopper, and if it makes sense you do it. And if it doesn't, you don't trade just to make a trade, because those things will come back to bite you.''

Since the ownership transfer to Jeffrey Loria in 2002, the Marlins front office has been active in past years heading into the deadline.

• They pulled off a three-team swap with Cincinnati and Montreal on July 11, 2002, unloading Cliff Floyd, Ryan Dempster and Claudio Vargas while acquiring Carl Pavano, Juan Encarnacion and Mike Mordecai, among others. Pavano, Encarnacion and Mordecai were all members of the 2003 team that won the World Series.

• They dealt future All-Star Adrian Gonzalez, a minor-leaguer at the time, for reliever Ugueth Urbina on July 11, 2003. Urbina became the team's closer. With a World Series ring to show for it, the Marlins do not regret the trade even though they paid a high price to get Urbina.

• Bidding to defend their title and make a second-half run in 2004, the Marlins on July 30 traded Brad Penny and Hee Seop Choi to the Dodgers for Paul Lo Duca, Guillermo Mota and Encarnacion. The Marlins failed to reach the playoffs.

• Needing a left-hander in their bullpen, the Marlins traded minor-league pitcher Gaby Hernandez to Seattle for veteran southpaw Arthur Rhodes.

• They made no July trades in 2006 and '07.

HARD TO COMPARE

``You have a different feel to every team,'' Beinfest said. ``This team is a little more inconsistent offensively, and we had a starter drought in the month of May. It's been a little bit more up and down. It doesn't mean that this team can't win. It's just hard to compare it to any other year. This isn't like '03. It's not like '04 when we did Lo Duca and Mota.''

Last year, the Marlins came close to acquiring Manny Ramirez from the Boston Red Sox in a three-way deal that would have sent Hermida to the Pittsburgh Pirates.

The deal collapsed within days of the deadline.

But somewhere, a phone will ring and a player will pick it up to discover he has been traded. Gload, after years winding his way from one organization to another, is back with the Marlins as a backup.

``Honestly, after the first trade, nothing really surprises me,'' Gload said. ``I've been traded three times now and all three of them were out of the blue. It's a a great job, but you can't choose where you want to play or how long you play there.''


Florida Marlins consider impact trades as deadline nears (http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/baseball/florida-marlins/story/1160156.html)

[Party]

Cody Ross discussion has moved to a new thread. (http://soflamarlins.com/showthread.php?t=158)

[The_Godfather]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Go for broke, or don't do anything.

I would deal Cam, I would deal Stanton, I would deal West, I'd even deal Logan, just ravage our system if it means we get that elite starter to slot behind JJ and Nolasco and elite corner player to get that .299 OBP out of the lineup. We'd be so scary good it'd be worth it. We need to build up a winning goodwill heading into the stadium. Don't be stupid and deal Tucker for Arthur Rhodes (or his 2009 replacement).

Or, just say the hell with it, get whatever you can for Cantu and Uggla, move Coghlan to 2B, let Cam play the rest of '09 with the big club and prime Logan for a late August callup if Gaby can't handle 1B.

We either need to turn the roster over enough to get Cam, Logan and possibly Stanton some AB's or just fucking go for it.

That being said, I do hope we hang onto Hermida, I know it's been said about 458294 times, but he really looks like he's starting to get it, and that's exciting.

I agree to a point, but put me in the side category of thinking the player(s) available on the market are just not out there to put us over the hump (I think we need a premier bat, not Halladay), a player good enough to deal away a couple guys who project to be really good and really cheap for years to come in Morrison and Stanton.

I just don't think this team is 'one player away good' enough to deal away such value for the % chance of us actually winning a World Series.

Basically it's a risk I wouldn't want to take.

[Omar]

What I want to know is what happened to the Aubrey Huff rumblings? Is Baltimore being stubborn about price or something? He is kind of a perfect fit for us.
--------------------
Michael Hill on right now.....

Doesn't deny the Marlins are involved, talks about "any team wanting to have him in the rotation"
--------------------
Hill doesn't say we have a specific need/want
--------------------
"We're trying to add to this ball club."

[tjfla]

Baltimore wants Chris Coghlan is what I am hearing. No idea if just for Huff or others but they keep asking for him

[Omar]

(More from Hill)

Marlins don't react to other moves, they simply seek out to make the moves that are best for the clubs. "Can't get caught up in that stuff."

[Longview]

What a cop out..."50/50" chance we make a move.

[tjfla]

(More from Hill)

Marlins don't react to other moves, they simply seek out to make the moves that are best for the clubs. "Can't get caught up in that stuff."

In other words we are making deals for the future and if we keep winning now great

[FishFanInPA]

Give them Coghlan for Huff.

[Fishfan79]

Give them Coghlan for Huff.

is huffs 86 OPS+ really an upgrade for us?
Also sliding Cantu back over to 3rd base where his glove plays worse then at 1st base?

Or is it just a move you want to make a move? I know Huff had a nice year last year (135 ops+) but he has been a far different player this year.

[MiamiHomer]

What a cop out..."50/50" chance we make a move.

It's expected since it's not like he is going to discuss exactly what they are doing on television.

[Omar]

is huffs 86 OPS+ really an upgrade for us?
Also sliding Cantu back over to 3rd base where his glove plays worse then at 1st base?

Or is it just a move you want to make a move? I know Huff had a nice year last year (135 ops+) but he has been a far different player this year.
Huff can play LF/RF and he crushes Jamie Moyer. That should be enough!

His OPS is only .719 overall but he's doing well against RHP (.269/.345/.433, an OPS+ of 117). My biggest concern would be that his Home/Away splits are massively in favor of Camden Yards.

[Fishfan79]

Huff can play LF/RF and he crushes Jamie Moyer. That should be enough!

His OPS is only .719 overall but he's doing well against RHP (.269/.345/.433, an OPS+ of 117). My biggest concern would be that his Home/Away splits are massively in favor of Camden Yards.

His home/away wouldnt play very well in our park, personally I would rather see us snag Teahen if we were going to go for huff, younger wheels and i think he could play out better with his L/R splits. Of course I dont know if he is available but his 111OPS+ plays out better and he can move to the OF/3B/2B.

not sure others thoughts on him (always used to be a fan just havent posted here or elsewhere much since busy with wedding :) ).

[nny]

Hensley injured so there goes basically our only MILB depth

[MiamiHomer]

One general manager of a noncontender said the Marlins called to express interest in possibly adding a hitter, and a second GM said a logical available option would be Nationals/ex-Marlins outfielder Josh Willingham (.298, 16 homers, including two grand slams Monday). Another executive mentioned Kansas City third baseman/right fielder Mark Teahen (.294, nine HR, 36 RBI). The Marlins also will consider acquiring a starting pitcher -- even more so if Andrew Miller has another bad start Wednesday at Triple A.

Miami Herald (http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/columnists/barry-jackson/story/1161744.html)

[REGular]

Teahen is intriguing.

How about Bonifacio FOR Willingham?

[m26555]

Willingham or Teahen would be great; either one.

[tjfla]

One for Ramp

Florida did inquire about Josh Willingham and Washington first words were "Top Pitching prospect" for him. No clue exactly who they asked for but he said the report was "TOP":fip

So I would say Sean West,Alex Sanabia,Kyle Winters,Brad Hand,Graham Johnson

I say offer them Brett Sinkbeil and PJ Dean(who they sent to us as damaged goods)

But ya don't look for the Hammer back here unless they lower the price. The funniest part was some team(Giants) asked about Adam Dunn and was told ML Ready pitcher and 2 Top Prospects.

and MLB can't figure out why Washington sucks LOL

[m26555]

The Nationals will probably come down on their price. NO ONE is going to want to give up a top pitching prospect for a 30-year old outfielder with back problems.

[tjfla]

Who knows? Buddy said that is why the Giants made the Garko deal. They tried to get Dunn and Washington started the discussion with young ML pitcher and not 1 but 2 Top Prospects and they moved on

[m26555]

Who knows? Buddy said that is why the Giants made the Garko deal. They tried to get Dunn and Washington started the discussion with young ML pitcher and not 1 but 2 Top Prospects and they moved on
lol that's hilarious.

Still, I would say Dunn is a bit more valuable than Hammer, and considering the Nats just signed him in the off-season, maybe they didn't want to look stupid trading him so they asked for a lot in return to avoid potential backlash?

I'm probably just grasping for straws here; I REALLY want Hammer back.

[tjfla]

lol that's hilarious.

Still, I would say Dunn is a bit more valuable than Hammer, and considering the Nats just signed him in the off-season, maybe they didn't want to look stupid trading him so they asked for a lot in return to avoid potential backlash?

I'm probably just grasping for straws here; I REALLY want Hammer back.

Well everyone knew when they signed him they were gonna trade him. It's like who really thinks that after next year he is gonna stay??

Feel funny saying this but they should follow the Pittsburgh way of thinking. Trade what u can for young guys and start building. Pitt will trade Freddy Sanchez and the reason is they won't ask for a killing,they get fair value and move on. As for Sanchez-his potential suitors are San Francisco,Houston,and Minnesota. Same teams who would be interested in Uggla if he was on the market

[Ramp]

Problem is that they don't have a real GM right now, just Mike Rizzo as an interim type deal.

As for Hammer being worth a top pitching prospect. Considering how his OPS is top 5 in baseball, can play either corner OF spot or 1B, and is reasonably cheap, a top pitching prospect makes sense.

[m26555]

Problem is that they don't have a real GM right now, just Mike Rizzo as an interim type deal.

As for Hammer being worth a top pitching prospect. Considering how his OPS is top 5 in baseball, can play either corner OF spot or 1B, and is reasonably cheap, a top pitching prospect makes sense.
But then you take into account the fact that he is very injury-prone and isn't exactly a spring chicken, and a top pitching prospect sounds like a lot.

I wonder if something like Thompson + Gaby would get it done? Thompson has been pitching very well as of late.

[McLevin]

That and either corner OF spot is a stretch

It's an injustice that the Nats play him in RF, watching him play the position is one of baseball's more awkward sights

[Ramp]

Hammer's defense isn't nearly as bad as you are suggesting it is.

I don't see how a top pitching prospect is alot for what he's doing this season.

[m26555]

Hammer's defense isn't nearly as bad as you are suggesting it is.

I don't see how a top pitching prospect is alot for what he's doing this season.
He's having a great season, but his injury history has to concern you a little bit. I don't want to deal a Sean West or Alex Sanabia for a guy who could miss 20 games with back problems. Plus, you really have to wonder how long Hammer can keep this up. Everyone knows he's not really a .300 hitter (not even remotely close, to be honest), so I have my doubts that the 1.009 OPS he has isn't going to drop considerably.

In a nutshell, I would prefer not to deal someone who is probably going to be a huge part of this rotation in the future for Josh Willingham.

[nny]

The question for hammer is power, his babip is barely above his norm, and both his walks and k's are basically inline.

right now though he has basically a 300 ISO after being basically 200 each year from 06 to 08

this is powered bya lot higher hr/fb
15.9>
12.1>
13.3>
20.5

I've thought he could be an 950 ops guy since 07 so I don't really think there will be much of a drop off. he was killing it like this last year until his back got hurt

[m26555]

The question for hammer is power, his babip is barely above his norm, and both his walks and k's are basically inline.

right now though he has basically a 300 ISO after being basically 200 each year from 06 to 08

this is powered bya lot higher hr/fb
15.9>
12.1>
13.3>
20.5

I've thought he could be an 950 ops guy since 07 so I don't really think there will be much of a drop off. he was killing it like this last year until his back got hurt
Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly is ISO?

[tjfla]

He's having a great season, but his injury history has to concern you a little bit. I don't want to deal a Sean West or Alex Sanabia for a guy who could miss 20 games with back problems. Plus, you really have to wonder how long Hammer can keep this up. Everyone knows he's not really a .300 hitter (not even remotely close, to be honest), so I have my doubts that the 1.009 OPS he has isn't going to drop considerably.

In a nutshell, I would prefer not to deal someone who is probably going to be a huge part of this rotation in the future for Josh Willingham.

Agree if they want Sinkbeil or a AAA/AA RP and PJ Dean cool but that's about it.

Great season but his back is always gonna be an issue.

[Ramp]

Is DC considered a hitter's park?

And it's not like we need Hammer for the next few years. We need his back to stay healthy for the next 50 games. Maybe all the offseason stuff he did on his back is finally paying off and he's ok. Maybe

[tjfla]

Not saying anything however seems like Seattle are gonna be buyers- they just dealt Jack Wilson and Snell for Clement,Cedeno and prospects

Maybe they will revisit a Jeremy Hermida??

[nny]

Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly is ISO?

isolated power. Slugging minus Batting Average. So takes out the singles in slugging percentage

100 = slap hitter
150 = average
200 = good
300 = top power hitters

I'd say Hammer could push 250.
--------------------
Is DC considered a hitter's park?

And it's not like we need Hammer for the next few years. We need his back to stay healthy for the next 50 games. Maybe all the offseason stuff he did on his back is finally paying off and he's ok. Maybe

rather sur eit's a pitchers park

[MiamiHomer]

Not saying anything however seems like Seattle are gonna be buyers- they just dealt Jack Wilson and Snell for Clement,Cedeno and prospects

Maybe they will revisit a Jeremy Hermida??

So your buddy hasn't heard any Marlins info today?

[tjfla]

Havent talked to him. Usually does not get alot of time this time of year. When I hear anything I will let u guys know. Just like last year when I told everyone about Manny

[wanks1212]

Agree if they want Sinkbeil or a AAA/AA RP and PJ Dean cool but that's about it.

Great season but his back is always gonna be an issue.

I would love to hear the phone conversation between Beinfest and any GM who was offered PJ Dean as the key to a trade package.

If Jim Bowden were still employed, maybe the Marlins could sneak PJ Dean by him. Maybe.

[nny]

We could say he's 33 years old and trade him to Sabean.

[m26555]

Not saying anything however seems like Seattle are gonna be buyers- they just dealt Jack Wilson and Snell for Clement,Cedeno and prospects

Maybe they will revisit a Jeremy Hermida??
Yeah but if they're buyers (and it appears they are), we probably won't get any ML talent back for Hermida. I'm guessing this takes Aardsma off our list of potential acquirees, too.

[Swifty]

With the Phillies getting Lee I think we're now three legitimate moves away from being better than them, and I hate the idea of being buyers on July 31 purely for the wild-card. Sell, sell, sell. Our priority for the rest of the year should be finding AB's for Cam, a legit audition for Gaby, and failing that some August-Sept. AB's for Logan.

[marlins_virus.exe]

Prior to the Dodgers series I would have agreed but at this point there's no way we can sell. We're two out after taking 2 of 3 from (and nearly sweeping) the best team in the league. We beat a team we were neck and neck with. We aren't going to catch Philly but every team in the race now has issues. I don't see how you can justify selling right now.

[m26555]

With the Phillies getting Lee I think we're now three legitimate moves away from being better than them, and I hate the idea of being buyers on July 31 purely for the wild-card. Sell, sell, sell. Our priority for the rest of the year should be finding AB's for Cam, a legit audition for Gaby, and failing that some August-Sept. AB's for Logan.
Sell, sell, sell when we're two games behind the WC leader? That's crazy.

[McLevin]

With the Phillies getting Lee I think we're now three legitimate moves away from being better than them, and I hate the idea of being buyers on July 31 purely for the wild-card. Sell, sell, sell. Our priority for the rest of the year should be finding AB's for Cam, a legit audition for Gaby, and failing that some August-Sept. AB's for Logan.
ugh

so dumb

and i know if we don't make the playoffs you'll point back to this post and say SEE I FUCKING TOLD YOU GUYS but when you're two games out of a playoff spot (who gives a shit if you're playing for the wild card? when the Marlins traded for Urbina in 03 was it to catch the Braves?) and you don't try to make a move you are just not an organization focused on winning, period.

[tjfla]

We are buyers however we are trying to Sell an OF either Cody Ross or Hermida.

[McLevin]

Selling Hermida probably helps us now anyways lol

As I said, if Ross is traded for the right kind of player, go for it. If not, he better stay put.

[Ramp]

I think we're in sell mode, and if we win... so be it

I think we're still looking to 2010

[Swifty]

I'd get the argument if we were someone like Kansas City or Pittsburgh where chances like this just don't come along frequently, but we've had this core play semi-meaningful September games for five of the six previous seasons. There's too damn much wrong with this team, and Philly and St. Louis (the two teams we'll be chasing) getting so much better it's nuts to say unequivocally go for it.

I mean, just to tread water we need at least one SP, probably 2 (since I doubt we see Miller any time soon) and we need to do the impossible, get Mr. .299 OBP on the bench. I even would go so far as to say the pieces are there for us to make a run if Miller can come up and just be decent and RVH stays healthy, but Lord knows we won't use them properly.

[FishFF]

How do you want to use Miller?

[Ramp]

well he just got hurt(sprained ankle), so maybe he's referring to that

[McLevin]

I'm of the school of thought that if you're close to a playoff spot (aka 2 games out of one at the deadline), you go for it. No if's, and's, or but's.

[Bobbob1313]

We haven't had a hanley, Cody, uggla, hermida core since 2004.

[Ramp]

I don't know that we necessarily have the pieces to "go for it"

Yes, we have Stanton, Morrison and Dominguez but they're pretty much off limits

[Virtuoso]

I'm of the school of thought that if you're close to a playoff spot (aka 2 games out of one at the deadline), you go for it. No if's, and's, or but's.

Too bad our FO isn't.

[tjfla]

I think the moves will be Carl Pavano for a prospect and either Hermida to Cincy for Arthur Rhodes and prospects OR Cody Ross to Yankees for prospects

Nothing big except pick up a veteran arm who will probably resign with us and getting Arthur Rhodes back for this year and next year for 2 mil. Plus some prospects

[Virtuoso]

Why do they always trade for the future? Haven't they been doing this ever since Beinfest came into the picture?

[m26555]

I'd get the argument if we were someone like Kansas City or Pittsburgh where chances like this just don't come along frequently, but we've had this core play semi-meaningful September games for five of the six previous seasons. There's too damn much wrong with this team, and Philly and St. Louis (the two teams we'll be chasing) getting so much better it's nuts to say unequivocally go for it.

I mean, just to tread water we need at least one SP, probably 2 (since I doubt we see Miller any time soon) and we need to do the impossible, get Mr. .299 OBP on the bench. I even would go so far as to say the pieces are there for us to make a run if Miller can come up and just be decent and RVH stays healthy, but Lord knows we won't use them properly.
Both Philadelphia and St. Louis will probably win their respective divisions, so I don't see how they're even relevant in this discussion.
--------------------
I think the moves will be Carl Pavano for a prospect and either Hermida to Cincy for Arthur Rhodes and prospects OR Cody Ross to Yankees for prospects

Nothing big except pick up a veteran arm who will probably resign with us and getting Arthur Rhodes back for this year and next year for 2 mil. Plus some prospects
If it's Hermida, I won't mind as much. I just think Cody is far too important to the team this year to deal (not saying that I'm in favor of trading Hermida for a reliever, but I'd rather deal him than Ross).

[wanks1212]

Why do they always trade for the future? Haven't they been doing this ever since Beinfest came into the picture?

2003 saw Urbina come aboard, 2004 was the Lo Duca deal. So no. Not at all.

Anyway as flawed as this team is they are only two games out. I wouldn't have a huge problem with a massive sell-off of assets, but at the same time the PR hit would be pretty big if they were to trade off Hermida, Ross, Uggla, Cantu, etc., while only bringing prospects back, only months after securing a stadium agreement.

That's no reason to buy while selling the farm, but at the same time it's not going to help the Marlins generate excitement, ticket sales etc. for 2010/2011/2012. The cries will be of "more of the same, teh stadium didn't help." Selling off those guys in the offseason is much easier to handle from a PR standpoint than is sellign them when teh team is two games out of a playoff spot.

That said, if the FO is able to reshape teh roster now by sending off Hermida and Ross (Ross is the only guy who I can see having an urgency about trading him now) while bringing back some players who can help this year (like Pavano, Rhodes, ideally Teahen or someone like that in a separate deal) and could also be a part of the 2010 team, then the FO accomplishes the goal of improving the team for the future while not giving the perception of waving a white flag on the present. Whch, from an organizational standpoint, is the ideal outcome.

[BigGameFish]

We haven't had a hanley, Cody, uggla, hermida core since 2004.


WHAT?! Are you seriously saying that you put Hermida in our "core"? AS if he makes our team better? I hope I'm misunderstanding this.

[wanks1212]

well, the Reds just acquired Wlademir Balentien from the Mariners, so it's conceivable they wouldn't be interested in Hermida anymore.

[nny]

well, the Reds just acquired Wlademir Balentien from the Mariners, so it's conceivable they wouldn't be interested in Hermida anymore.

sucks

[wanks1212]

yeah he's terrible

[nny]

I meant for us. sounded like cinci might be the only team to give us something
--------------------
he's certainly not that good though lol

I mean, .250 milb iso when he's been young for the levels

but hugeee k rate
--------------------
I wonder if he could do something like .250/.300/.500
--------------------
his eye will probably keep him from getting to that power level but safeco to cinci will be good for him
--------------------
but he's also bad on defense was wondering when seattle would trade him
--------------------
god this seriously bugs me to no end
--------------------
what i'm talking is

Beinfest: we are going to focus on speed and defense

(nothing changes really)
--------------------
Z is the GM for less than ONE season and he has completely changed the team into his mold into being the best defensive team in the league now that Jack Wilson has replaced Betancourt

[Swifty]

All I'm saying is that since 2003, September has meant something meaningful every season, save '07, but even then we knocked the Mets out.

I don't think this is the year, necessarily to say "well, this chance won't come around again."

Our rotation isn't like San Fran where it's a situation where if you get to the playoffs, throw the records out the window, you're the team no one wants to play, it's not like Philly where you've won already, your window is somewhat closing and you might as well take another swing with what you know has already worked and you've improved it.

We're set up very well for the near future, we're an intriguing team now, and ultimately what I want done will have no impact on what actually happens anyway. We'll make a dumb overpayment for a reliever trade, I'll probably bitch and moan about it, everyone will remind me of it when the guy strikes out the side, and we'll still probably end up behind San Fran and St. Louis and Philly in the standings.

And lastly, does anyone honestly believe we're looking at a solution to the .299 OBP problem? Does anyone really believe we have a clue how much one simple switch (of Emilio and Baker) would make our lineup better? That's another reason I'm kind of down on making any moves right now, I just feel like we'd find some way to continue to hold ourselves back.

[nny]

c-c-c-c-c-combo breaker

asshole

[Beef]

Nobody here wants to make one "big" move and to have that "big" move be for a reliever

[wanks1212]

I meant for us. sounded like cinci might be the only team to give us something
--------------------
he's certainly not that good though lol

I mean, .250 milb iso when he's been young for the levels

but hugeee k rate
--------------------
I wonder if he could do something like .250/.300/.500
--------------------
his eye will probably keep him from getting to that power level but safeco to cinci will be good for him
--------------------
but he's also bad on defense was wondering when seattle would trade him
--------------------
god this seriously bugs me to no end
--------------------
what i'm talking is

Beinfest: we are going to focus on speed and defense

(nothing changes really)
--------------------
Z is the GM for less than ONE season and he has completely changed the team into his mold into being the best defensive team in the league now that Jack Wilson has replaced Betancourt

balentin actually makes more sense for the reds than hermida. both may turn into .750-.775 ops OFs with bad defense, but at least balentien makes the minimun next year.

and yes, the way beinfest "focuses on defense" is completely wrong and it sucks, but at the same time...should he get credit for the team's (so far) good baserunning as part of the "speed" commitment, or is that just brushed off?

[nny]

i've been meaning to break it down since 06 i think i'll go do that now since I'm bored and we can see what's changed and who sucks and who doesn't
--------------------
ofcoarse to be fair I'd be extremely pissed if we had 8 bonifacio's on the field so it's kinda hypocritcal for me to say "DAMN BEINFEST FOR NOT DOING WHAT HE'S SAYING" when I then hate what he's saying I just wish he could build a defensive-first team like Seattle has with hitters that still proudce at a 800ish OPS level rather than .650 OPS guys but they're fast!
--------------------
or not, bp's stat page for br isn't working for me

[MiamiHomer]

The Cubs and Marlins have talked about the idea of sending right-fielder Jeremy Hermida to the Windy City but the Cubs are not optimistic a deal will happen by Friday’s 4 p.m. nonwaiver trading deadline, if at all, according to an industry source.

It was unclear who the Cubs are offering to Florida, which is said to be interested in adding more depth to its bullpen.

The Cubs, in search of a lefty bat, are said to have equal interest in Royals third baseman Mark Teahen. But, like their Hermida pursuit, the Cubs don’t think they’ll land Teahan, either…

As for Hermida, he was still smarting this afternoon over getting picked off first base after taking a wide turn on a base hit to left in the eighth inning Tuesday night. Hermida took his time getting back to the bag and was thrown out by shortstop Yunel Escobar.

“It’s a thing I’ve done a thousand times. It was just bad timing and a bad situation for it. It should have never happened,’’ Hermida said, admitting he was caught off guard.

“It was the last thing that even crossed my mind. I’m not supposed to turn my back on it. I take full blame for it.’’

Manage Fredi Gonzalez didn’t place all the blame on Hermida. He said the Braves deserve credit for making “a heads-up play. It just caught Hermy off-guard a little bit.

“They made a perfect throw and a good tag, That ball could have very easily hit off Hermida’s shoulder and bounced into the dugout and now he’s on the third base. It was a high-risk play but it worked and caught us napping a little bit.’’…

Left-hander Andrew Miller allowed four runs on three hits and two walks while hitting a batter this afternoon for Class AAA New Orleans but that wasn’t the worst thing that happened to him.

Miller suffered a right ankle sprain while fielding an infield hit. He left the game after one inning.

The injury was not considered serious but Miller’s next start in five days is in doubt…

RHP Matt Lindstrom (sprained elbow) pitched again for Class AA Jacksonville, throwing 21 pitches in one hitless inning. He’ll go again Thursday for Jacksonville then possibly join the Marlins on Saturday or Sunday.

“Tomorrow will be a good measuring stick to see how he is and when he can join us,’’’ Gonzalez said…

IF Gaby Sanchez, called up from New Orleans July 21, is still looking for his first taste of big league action.

“It’s been difficult,’’ Gonzalez said. “We’ve got (first baseman Jorge) Cantu swinging it pretty good, Bonie (third baseman Emilio Bonifacio) swinging it pretty good. I’ve sat down and spoken with him: ‘Just keep working. I know you’re there. We’ll try to use you.’’’

Cubs like Jeremy Hermida (http://blogs.palmbeachpost.com/marlins/2009/07/29/cubs-like-jeremy-hermida/#more-1490)

[Ramp]

Maybe they'll send us more damaged goods

[m26555]

All I'm saying is that since 2003, September has meant something meaningful every season, save '07, but even then we knocked the Mets out.

I don't think this is the year, necessarily to say "well, this chance won't come around again."

Our rotation isn't like San Fran where it's a situation where if you get to the playoffs, throw the records out the window, you're the team no one wants to play, it's not like Philly where you've won already, your window is somewhat closing and you might as well take another swing with what you know has already worked and you've improved it.

We're set up very well for the near future, we're an intriguing team now, and ultimately what I want done will have no impact on what actually happens anyway. We'll make a dumb overpayment for a reliever trade, I'll probably bitch and moan about it, everyone will remind me of it when the guy strikes out the side, and we'll still probably end up behind San Fran and St. Louis and Philly in the standings.

And lastly, does anyone honestly believe we're looking at a solution to the .299 OBP problem? Does anyone really believe we have a clue how much one simple switch (of Emilio and Baker) would make our lineup better? That's another reason I'm kind of down on making any moves right now, I just feel like we'd find some way to continue to hold ourselves back.
I really don't see how you can say that. Our top two of Johnson and Nolasco is nearly as good as Lincecum and Cain, and I'll take Volstad any day of the week over Zito.

[nny]

Maybe they'll send us more damaged goods

gotta love trading for a guy who quits baseball and a guy who leaves ST because of a torn labrum

[tjfla]

well, the Reds just acquired Wlademir Balentien from the Mariners, so it's conceivable they wouldn't be interested in Hermida anymore.

Maybe means Mariners are making a move for Hermida? I know Cincy and Seattle both liked him.

[nny]

I just kinda doubt they really want hermida tbh. not saying you or your friend is lieing but it doesn't fit what Z has been doing. He obviously favors UZR, not only has he moves been on it but he has Tom Tango on his staff and obviously is listening to him. And UZR hates hermida. With how much playing time Chavez got and and Langerhans is getting now I definitely think they prefer defense over offense.

[tjfla]

I just kinda doubt they really want hermida tbh. not saying you or your friend is lieing but it doesn't fit what Z has been doing. He obviously favors UZR, not only has he moves been on it but he has Tom Tango on his staff and obviously is listening to him. And UZR hates hermida. With how much playing time Chavez got and and Langerhans is getting now I definitely think they prefer defense over offense.

I don't mean at this moment. The Marlins were shopping Hermida around since June and they were interested however did not want to give up ANYTHING. I doubt he goes there but never know. The only team I heard that liked him in past few weeks in Cincinnati!!!!!

[m26555]

Add the Marlins to the list of teams interested in Pirates lefty reliever John Grabow.

According to a National League source, the Marlins and Pirates have discussed possible trade scenarios that would land Grabow in Florida.

Upgrading the bullpen remains a priority for the Marlins as they hope to improve their playoff chances.

Grabow, 30, has appeared in 44 games for Pittsburgh, while posting a 3-0 record and 3.57 ERA in 45 1/3 innings. The Marlins bullpen entered Wednesday with the fifth best ERA in the National League -- 3.79.

In second place behind the Phillies in the National League East, the Marlins are in the process of searching for experienced relievers. Grabow broke in with the Pirates in 2003, and he's been in 389 games.

A durable lefty, he was involved in a career high 74 games and 76 innings in 2008.

Pittsburgh's third-round pick in 1997, Grabow has 39 strikeouts and 28 walks on the season. Ironically, left-handed hitters are batting .275 against him, while right-handers have a .246 average.

Grabow is signed for $2.3 million this year, and he will be eligible for free agency next season.

In recent weeks, Florida's bullpen has added veteran right-handers Brendan Donnelly and Luis Ayala.

http://trades.mlblogs.com/

[FishFanInPA]

How many fucking lefties do we need? As much as Pinto gives us heartburn, he's been good this season.

[Omar]

All I'm saying is that since 2003, September has meant something meaningful every season, save '07, but even then we knocked the Mets out.

I don't think this is the year, necessarily to say "well, this chance won't come around again."

Our rotation isn't like San Fran where it's a situation where if you get to the playoffs, throw the records out the window, you're the team no one wants to play, it's not like Philly where you've won already, your window is somewhat closing and you might as well take another swing with what you know has already worked and you've improved it.

We're set up very well for the near future, we're an intriguing team now, and ultimately what I want done will have no impact on what actually happens anyway. We'll make a dumb overpayment for a reliever trade, I'll probably bitch and moan about it, everyone will remind me of it when the guy strikes out the side, and we'll still probably end up behind San Fran and St. Louis and Philly in the standings.

And lastly, does anyone honestly believe we're looking at a solution to the .299 OBP problem? Does anyone really believe we have a clue how much one simple switch (of Emilio and Baker) would make our lineup better? That's another reason I'm kind of down on making any moves right now, I just feel like we'd find some way to continue to hold ourselves back.
Who honestly cares about competing in September? In baseball, save for the Yankees (which found out the hard way how things go last year) in the last decade, reaching the playoffs is in and of itself an honor. The National League has 16 teams and only 4 of them makes the playoffs. That means that only 25% of the NL is allowed to play real meaningful baseball. Simply getting into October is a big deal and should never be dropped.

This is, by the way, ignoring the fact that both times we've been there we've been fitted for rings.

We don't have a team that is by all definitions a top playoff team. We have two young aces and a solid back of the rotation that isn't great. We've had that kind of team before enter the playoffs. Pudge is remembered as a hero but he went into the playoffs hitting into double plays like it was on sale at Ñoo Que Barato. Our bullpen was an issue (and that's putting it kindly). The team overall was solid but not everyone amongst us counted them as champions in September. They became champions over the course of October, as every team every year does. No one gets trophies in July.

Considering we're in our 17th season of play and we've made the playoffs all of twice, we shouldn't be acting like we're high and mighty and don't need to get to October because we got kind of close the last handful of seasons.

[nny]

Pinto has a 1.46 WHIP...

Adding a LOOGY would help our bullpen. That's basicallyt he only addition our BP needs

[m26555]

Yeah I wouldn't exactly say Pinto has been "good." He's certainly not as bad as a lot of people make him out to be, but I don't have a problem with adding a reliable lefty to our pen. The less Pinto we see, the better, in my opinion.

[lou]

I said it weeks ago. LaRoche/Grabow is a perfect combo for us. And they "like" Hermida.

Coghlan/Hermida for LaRoche/Grabow/A Ball RP Power Arm. And I only say Coghlan because I'm thinking like Beinfest and obviously Bonifacio is our 2B of the future.

That makes just ridiculous sense on paper. We get a 3B upgrade until Dominguez (and I mean LaRoche has to be better based on his minor league track record?), upgrade the pen, Hermida sheds salary to 'afford' Grabow and possibly a "Pavano" (i.e., we trade some relievers, like Pinto or whoever, as part of that package to clear bullpen space), opens up a slot for Maybin, Pitt can use Clement/Alvarez as their longterm corners, Pitt gets their 2B of the future, and now can deal Freddy Sanchez for the best SP prospect they can get as they don't have to worry about 2B.

I mean, why not? I'll take a risk on Andy LaRoche turning into .270/.350/.400+. Let alone his over 700 PA in AAA of over a .925 OPS. He's like a 3B version of Hermida. Frustrating, but there is potential in there somewhere.

[nny]

The issue with LaRoche is the same as hermida. He's putting up the walks, k's, and babip you'd expect. He's not putting up the ISO. They're both acting like slap hitters when they should atleast be average based off their track record

[Omar]

How is his defense?

[PitchingWinsGames]

+3 so far this year, and +1 each of the past two years (~230, 500 and 800 innings), so likely a plus defender, but average against the bunts

[Ralph]

Grabow is basically Pinto though.

[tjfla]

I said it weeks ago. LaRoche/Grabow is a perfect combo for us. And they "like" Hermida.

Coghlan/Hermida for LaRoche/Grabow/A Ball RP Power Arm. And I only say Coghlan because I'm thinking like Beinfest and obviously Bonifacio is our 2B of the future.

That makes just ridiculous sense on paper. We get a 3B upgrade until Dominguez (and I mean LaRoche has to be better based on his minor league track record?), upgrade the pen, Hermida sheds salary to 'afford' Grabow and possibly a "Pavano" (i.e., we trade some relievers, like Pinto or whoever, as part of that package to clear bullpen space), opens up a slot for Maybin, Pitt can use Clement/Alvarez as their longterm corners, Pitt gets their 2B of the future, and now can deal Freddy Sanchez for the best SP prospect they can get as they don't have to worry about 2B.

I mean, why not? I'll take a risk on Andy LaRoche turning into .270/.350/.400+. Let alone his over 700 PA in AAA of over a .925 OPS. He's like a 3B version of Hermida. Frustrating, but there is potential in there somewhere.

Problem is they don't want Hermida. They want Coghlan and prospects.

[Beef]

Yeah, but we see Pinto more so we know we hate him. We can hate on Fredi for throwing Grabow instead of using Calero some time once it happens. Then we can hate on Fredi for using Calero too much if he gets hurt again.

[tjfla]

Here is your update guys

We are looking at SP,RP,and a bat.

Trying to trade Jeremy Hermida but the problem is Pittsburgh has very little interest in him. They prefer Chris Coghlan and prospects(RVH,Ryan Tucker,Alex Sanabia) in exchange for Laroche or Sanchez and Grabow.

We like Andy Laroche,Freddy Sanchez,John Grabow from Pitt
We like Arthur Rhodes from Cincy
We like George Sherrill from Balt

What they are trying to do is trade Jeremy Hermida to Cincy for Rhodes and prospects and then see what Pitt wants for Laroche or Sanchez

Did NOT say anything about Cody Ross

Still looking at Pavano

[MiamiHomer]

Thanks tj.

[tjfla]

Yep what I think is gonna happen is if Pitt stays on there Chris Coghlan thing it is Hermida to Cincy and then us making a deal with Pitt for just Laroche

If Pitt says ok Jeremy Hermida,RVH and a prospect then we get Grabow and Laroche

[m26555]

So it looks like Herms is a goner?

[Longview]

Hermida for Rhodes??

No thank you. I couldnt imagine them throwing in a prospect that would make that worthwhile.

[Metes]

Ehe Hermida for half a season of Arthur would be funny

[MiamiHomer]

Well it looks like Freddy Sanchez was just traded to SF.

5:51pm: Kovacevic is reporting that the minor leaguer is AA pitcher Tim Alderson. This is an impressive haul for Sanchez--Alderson was ranked the #4 prospect in the Giants' system.

[mbitcronod12]

With the way Miller and West are pitching right now, we can't really afford to give up RVH. We already have extremely limited, decent options for the already vacant 5th starter spot. Having to fill two would be a big worry for me.

I'm really thinking we need to push for a starter. Right now, I think we're relying on Anibal being able to come back when he is eligible to return on the 6th. He has already started rehab and makes his next start on Saturday. I'm just concerned that, with his injury history, we need the depth at that position which is questionable right now.

[Metes]

Even if Anibal does come back and can stay healthy for more than 3 starts, I don't think he's going to be particularly effective or even go late in games. I think the need to acquire a starter is pretty prevalent, if we are indeed buyers at this juncture.

[nny]

if freddy got traded for Aldersen I'm going to rage
--------------------
not as hard as any SF fan though lol

[MiamiHomer]

if freddy got traded for Aldersen I'm going to rage
--------------------
not as hard as any SF fan though lol

Pirates making some nice moves.

[wanks1212]

Ehe Hermida for half a season of Arthur would be funny

Rhodes is under contract for 2010 at $2 mil.

Doesn't mean it's a great trade, but it would be 1.5 years, not just half a season. Assuming Rhodes isn't dealt in the offseason, of course.

[lou]

if freddy got traded for Aldersen I'm going to rage
--------------------
not as hard as any SF fan though lol

Coghlan for Aldersen!!!!!!

Man I'm glad I'm not a SF fan. Garko and F. Sanchez for two really nice SP prospects. What a LOL.

[Metes]

Rhodes is under contract for 2010 at $2 mil.

Doesn't mean it's a great trade, but it would be 1.5 years, not just half a season. Assuming Rhodes isn't dealt in the offseason, of course.

Ah, didn't realize Cincy was bright enough to go 2 years on a 40 year old reliever. Kudos.

[nny]

/random but it'd have been cool if we got Raburn in the Cabrera deal

he's not awesome and he's old but he'd atleast given us some 3b depth

[tjfla]

Ah, didn't realize Cincy was bright enough to go 2 years on a 40 year old reliever. Kudos.

They aren't Arthur Rhodes is bright enough to ask for a 2 year deal and Cincy is stupid enough to offer him it because they thought they were a playoff team

[Ralph]

They aren't Arthur Rhodes is bright enough to ask for a 2 year deal and Cincy is stupid enough to offer him it because they thought they were a playoff team

Can't really call them stupid when the are going to recieve something in return for him and likely not eat any salary.

[Metes]

I was being sarcasmastic

[tjfla]

Can't really call them stupid when the are going to recieve something in return for him and likely not eat any salary.

Ya because they got lucky. If Rhodes was stinking it up the only way to get rid of him would be to throw in cash

If Rhodes is 0-4 6.45ERA u think teams are gonna be calling for him?

[Beef]

They signed Rhodes with the idea that he would pitch well probably, that's what they had in mind when they chose to pay him monies

[tjfla]

They signed Rhodes with the idea that he would pitch well probably, that's what they had in mind when they chose to pay him monies

Of course they did I was just saying what if. They thought they had a playoff team and now they are trying to trade everything

[MiamiHomer]

When I reset everything on my firefox I lost saved passwords so I don't have my brother's insider login but someone who does check this out.

Posted Image
STARK: The Marlins' Halladay run
ESPN.com's Jayson Stark notes that, as usual, at trade deadline time the Marlins are always full of surprises, and in the case of this...

http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/features/rumors?&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fmlb %2ffeatures%2frumors

[Fish and Chips]

MH beat me to it

[Ralph]

If Doc Halladay really did wonders fo AJ, Imagine pairing him up witj JJ, Ricky and Volstad for a year and a half.

[MiamiHomer]

I hate ESPN insider and their lies...

"Or at least an attempted run. Stark says the Marlins made their pitch for the Toronto ace, but the conversation ended when Toronto asked for a package led by outfielder Cameron Maybin and teenage masher Michael Stanton."
--------------------
Cantu would have to move to third and unless we are including CC in the deal that sends Boner to the bench.

[Bobbob1313]

Someone send up the tjflasignal!

[MiamiHomer]

I finally got my brother's insider account and was looking at the Marlins rumors and this is to add to what tj told us about the reds.

The Marlins also were poking around Wednesday on possible deals for outfield bats, according to clubs that spoke with them. One name they kicked around: Cincinnati's Jonny Gomes, ESPN.com's Jayson Stark reports.

[Metes]

Gomes eh? So much for speed and defense.

[Ralph]

I got a fip/boni kinda love for gomes. I want him here.:wub

[MiamiHomer]

Bell, A-Gon and Pavano and we could call it a day.

[FishFanInPA]

Could we poach Bannister from KC?

[MiamiHomer]

I know Juan Rodriguez of the Palm Beach Post brought that up but I don't know.

[FishFanInPA]

I know it's a pipe dream but Bannister/Teahen/Soria. Try and pry 2 of them from KC.

[m26555]

I know it's a pipe dream but Bannister/Teahen/Soria. Try and pry 2 of them from KC.
I can't see Kansas City even considering moving Soria.

[tjfla]

I love how I keep telling u guys what they are doing and u guys think I am messing with U.

They were talking deal with Hermida for Rhodes,a bat,and prospects AND I get u don't know what u are talking about BULLSH*T.

(Marlins looking at Johnny Gomes)

They were talking deal for Heath Bell, they would be be willing to do Miller and 2 prospects AND get that makes no sense

(Marlins looking at Bell and Gonzalez)

They could offer Morrison,West,and Coghlan to Toronto AND get ohh thats too much

(Marlins ask and get Stanton and Maybin)

Guys I are serious about all what I say. I ask him he tells me

[Metes]

Just hit the space bar any time you type a comma

[lou]

Toronto's insane if they wanted Stanton and Maybin.

Marlins would have to sacrifice Morrison, West, Coghlan, and like Sanabia or Tucker, but that's still a substantial package.

[Bucklin12]

I don't know what just happened. Is tj angry? Is he excited? I really do need some translation.

[m26555]

I love how I keep telling u guys what they are doing and u guys think I am messing with U.

They were talking deal with Hermida for Rhodes,a bat,and prospects AND I get u don't know what u are talking about BULLSH*T.

(Marlins looking at Johnny Gomes)

They were talking deal for Heath Bell, they would be be willing to do Miller and 2 prospects AND get that makes no sense

(Marlins looking at Bell and Gonzalez)

They could offer Morrison,West,and Coghlan to Toronto AND get ohh thats too much

(Marlins ask and get Stanton and Maybin)

Guys I are serious about all what I say. I ask him he tells me
Never doubted your information; I just didn't like the information. lol.

[FishFanInPA]

Remember Lou they wanted Hughes and Chamberlain from the Yankees.

[lou]

Remember Lou they wanted Hughes and Chamberlain from the Yankees.

That's also intra-division.

And I don't see how Morrison and West are that far off "young talent wise," than those two, especially if we were to up the 3rd and 4th players to really nice players like a Coglan, Tucker, Sanabia, etc.

I'm pretty confident the Jays would take Morrison, West, Coghlan, and Tucker/Sanabia if we offered them a 4-1. It's not Maybin or Stanton, but that's still a boatload. Just a question of if the Marlins want to go for broke.

[pdub858]

According to fanball.com

Jeremy Hermida could potentially be headed to Chicago if the Cubs decide to add a left-handed bat to platoon with Milton Bradley in right field, according to the Chicago Sun-Times.

Hermida is hitting just .249 on the season, but hits righties pretty well, coming in at a .274 clip in 241 at-bats. He would obviously see less playing time were this trade to happen, however.

[Namaste]

Who are we rumored to get in return?
--------------------
This thread could also go here: http://soflamarlins.com/showthread.php?t=13&page=8

[pdub858]

Doesn't say, the only other thing I see is that there looking at Hermida and Teahen from KC.

[tjfla]

We won't get on George Sherrill unless Baltimore comes off of Chris Coghlan

Halladay talk is still happening as well as a new 3 way with Reds,Blue Jays,Marlins

Talk is

Reds-Scott Rolen,Jeremy Hermida
Blue Jays-Yonder Alonso,Mike Stanton or Logan Morrison,Sean West and another prospect
Marlins-Roy Halladay,Arthur Rhodes,Johnny Gomes

***Other players could be involved to****

I have no clue what Cincinnati is doing but that is what I heard

[Bucklin12]

Woah... Woah.

[MiamiHomer]

wahhhhhhh

[Bucklin12]

So Hermida, Stanton/Morrison, and West plus low level specs (or more)? gets us Halladay, Rhodes, and Gomes? Hm.

[Ralph]

uhhh, I really would prefer Maybin over Stanton/Logan.

[Namaste]

LOL were not getting Halladay. You guyz are so funniez

[tjfla]

That is what I said when he just told me

Seems to make sense too. They get there 4 prospects and lose cash

I just have no clue what the hell Cincinnati is doing or thinking unless they have just given up on the season?

[Namaste]

uhhh, I really would prefer Maybin over Stanton/Logan.


Pretty sure everyone agrees with your sentiment Ralph. I don't think you have anything to worry about.

[Fritz]

That deal makes absolutely zero sense for Cincy, but that's the least of my concerns.

[m26555]

I am hyperventilating right now.

[FishFanInPA]

Mannypalooza all over again!

[tjfla]

Could be?? Seems Toronto just wants 4 TOP prospects and 1 has to be a ML Ready SP

ML Ready-West
2 Top Prospects-Yonder Alonso and Maybin/Morrison/Stanton
1 or 2 Mid to Upper Prospect-??

[FishFanInPA]

Can we give them Maybin instead of Morrison and Stanton?

[tjfla]

That deal makes absolutely zero sense for Cincy, but that's the least of my concerns.

That is what I said to him but I think they have just given up on the season and are moving on. Alonso sort of has no position with Joey Votto at 1B. I just have no clue why they want Scott Rolen

[lou]

If that cincy thing is for real, the marlins would have to pony up a significant (tucker, etc) prospect to Toronto. But if the basic send out/send in is

Out - Hermida, Morrison/Stanton, West, Tucker, and let's say some Leroux/etc RP arm
In - Halladay, Rhodes, Gomes

WTF, sure.

[FishFF]

Just keep Stanton plz

[Fritz]

Ok, Gomes is better than I thought he'd be and he's doing it away from Great American Smallpark (ehe, I'm clever) as well.

.253/.341/.547 away

[mbitcronod12]

We won't get on George Sherrill unless Baltimore comes off of Chris Coghlan

Halladay talk is still happening as well as a new 3 way with Reds,Blue Jays,Marlins

Talk is

Reds-Scott Rolen,Jeremy Hermida
Blue Jays-Yonder Alonso,Mike Stanton or Logan Morrison,Sean West and another prospect
Marlins-Roy Halladay,Arthur Rhodes,Johnny Gomes
***Other players could be involved to****

I have no clue what Cincinnati is doing but that is what I heard

Yes, please! I really don't want to give up Logan or Stanton but I'd do that in a heartbeat for a year and a half of Halladay and Gomes. Rhodes is just icing on the cake.

[MiamiHomer]

Talk about things heating up.

[FishFF]

I might bust a gload twice in three days

[Fish and Chips]

possibly roster after trade
Baker C
Cantu 1st
Uggla 2nd
Hanley SS
Bonifacio 3rd
CC/Gomes LF
Maybin Cf
Ross Rf

sp
Halladay
Johnson
Nolasco
Volstad
RVH

Bullpen:
Calero
Rhodes
Meyer
Sachez
Nunez
Badenhop
?

[MiamiHomer]

The Marlins are a bit more open to trading Rick VandenHurk than guys like Sean West and Andrew Miller.

That's all that mlbtraderumors mentions.

[Fritz]

Halladay has the right to reject any trade, so the possibility still exists even if everyone agrees to this that he tells us to buzz off.

[m26555]

Halladay has the right to reject any trade, so the possibility still exists even if everyone agrees to this that he tells us to buzz off.
I can't see him rejecting a trade that would land him in a rotation consisting of Johnson, Nolasco, and Volstad. He has to see that that has "WS contender" written all over it.

[tjfla]

Halladay has the right to reject any trade, so the possibility still exists even if everyone agrees to this that he tells us to buzz off.

Halladay is class tho. If he thinks he has a chance to win I don't think he cares where he plays

[Fish and Chips]

I think the marlins are on his list, cause the jays wouldnt even talk to us if he would regret it

remember the twins inquire on him ,and the blue jays quickly turned him down, saying that Roy wouldnt accept a trade to minnesota

[tjfla]

possibly roster after trade
Baker C
Cantu 1st
Uggla 2nd
Hanley SS
Bonifacio 3rd
CC/Gomes LF
Maybin Cf
Ross Rf

sp
Halladay
Johnson
Nolasco
Volstad
RVH

Bullpen:
Calero
Rhodes
Meyer
Sachez
Nunez
Badenhop
?

Don't forget we are still looking at Pavano too

[The Hanram]

God I'd bust a nut if Halladay came here.

[Fish and Chips]

im gonna be refreshin mlbtraderumors and soflamarlins every 10 secs now

[The Hanram]

im gonna be refreshin mlbtraderumors and soflamarlins every 10 secs now

Don't need to refresh on here. It's got live topic ability. :mischief

[tjfla]

Thank God for yahoo messenger LOL

Seems the person to watch is Scott Rolen. If u don't see Rolen dealt by this afternoon or tonight we could be seriously talking a 3 way deal.

Benifest working magic again by saying stuff like we will give u 2 or 3 prospects and get a Top Prospect from Cincy to make it 4.

They really need to give Larry money to play with sometime.

[FishFF]

throw in the Manatees and it's a done deal

[m26555]

12:59pm: A Rosenthal/Morosi source with knowledge of the Jays' thinking discusses a package of Dodgers minor leaguers that could catch Toronto's attention in a Halladay deal.

Get lost, L.A.

[PitchingWinsGames]

I always hate sources "with knowledge of a team's thinking"... wtf does that even mean? Is it supposed to be more credible than idle speculation?

[Namaste]

Pretty sure we won't land Halladay but jesus if that happened we would be a tough team to beat in the Division Series.

Halladay
Johnson
Nolasco

[m26555]

I always hate sources "with knowledge of a team's thinking"... wtf does that even mean? Is it supposed to be more credible than idle speculation?
Yeah; I mean, if they want to go that far, I think pretty much every baseball fan has some sort of knowledge of the Jays' thinking, and it's that they want a few top prospects for Halladay.

[Metes]

I have knowledge of the Marlins' thinking and they don't like to pay people, so we won't be trading for anybody

[Beef]

Do tjflas sources have more knowledge than that of a teams thinking?

[MiamiHomer]

Looks like this rumor from tj is getting around to other forums.

[marlins_virus.exe]

anybody who wouldn't give up mike stanton in a deal to get halladay is crazy. just saying. you don't know how he pans out in the majors. he's a freaking prospect who actually has a pretty big flaw (he k's a lot). even if he didn't though, he's too young to know what will be. maybe he'll get injured. maybe mlb pitchers will figure him out. this is roy freaking halladay. one of the top 10 pitchers of our generation, bar none. and we can trade him this offseason or next deadline and get prospects back.

that having been said i don't think we'll get him but i have said all along that we, probably more than any other team, have the prospects to trade without obliterating our minor league system

[Fritz]

I have my doubts that Halladay comes here. I think people have a very negative opinion of the Marlins.

[marlins_virus.exe]

that's one thing i don't have a doubt of. guy has been mired in a .500 climate his whole career. they aren't winning next year. he wants his shot

[m26555]

I have my doubts that Halladay comes here. I think people have a very negative opinion of the Marlins.
All he needs to see is this:

Halladay
Johnson
Nolasco
Volstad

I think that would be more than enough to convince him to accept a trade here. Plus, like Fish and Chips said before, the Jays wouldn't even be talking with us if Halladay doesn't want to come here.

[Ramp]

All he needs to see is this:

Halladay
Johnson
Nolasco
Volstad

I think that would be more than enough to convince him to accept a trade here. Plus, like Fish and Chips said before, the Jays wouldn't even be talking with us if Halladay wouldn't want to come here.

In all seriousness... does Halladay even have a clue who Johnson, Nolasco and Volstad are?

[¿NICK?]

In all seriousness... does Halladay even have a clue who Johnson, Nolasco and Volstad are?
Exactly.

[Ralph]

In all seriousness... does Halladay even have a clue who Johnson, Nolasco and Volstad are?

He did see JJ and Nolasco dominate the Blue jays this season.

[Fritz]

In all seriousness... does Halladay even have a clue who Johnson, Nolasco and Volstad are?

Precisely.

Here's what the general population (and probably a lot of baseball players think about the Marlins):

1. Hanley Ramirez is awesome (and will be traded in a firesale)
2. There will be another firesale soon
3. They won two World Series titles (and had firesales soon after)
4. They've had firesales without winning titles

[Longview]

5. Firesale

[Virtuoso]

anybody who wouldn't give up mike stanton in a deal to get halladay is crazy. just saying. you don't know how he pans out in the majors. he's a freaking prospect who actually has a pretty big flaw (he k's a lot). even if he didn't though, he's too young to know what will be. maybe he'll get injured. maybe mlb pitchers will figure him out. this is roy freaking halladay. one of the top 10 pitchers of our generation, bar none. and we can trade him this offseason or next deadline and get prospects back.

that having been said i don't think we'll get him but i have said all along that we, probably more than any other team, have the prospects to trade without obliterating our minor league system

I would NOT give up Stanton for Halladay. We can only have Halladay for 2 months and MAYBE next year. But Stanton is the future Miguel in my opinion.

[m26555]

Precisely.

Here's what the general population (and probably a lot of baseball players think about the Marlins):

1. Hanley Ramirez is awesome (and will be traded in a firesale)
2. There will be another firesale soon
3. They won two World Series titles (and had firesales soon after)
4. They've had firesales without winning titles
See, I disagree. I think Halladay sees that rotation with him in it and thinks "World Series." He's not thinking like some idiot fan of another team who doesn't even watch the Marlins play.

[Fish and Chips]

you got to hope that major league players should be more educate than that.

[¿NICK?]

Also Halladay knows that if we get him, it won't be for very long. I'm sure he'd prefer to go to a place where he could negotiate a new contract and have a place where he could settle down with his family and not always be wondering where he's going to be from year to year.

[Beef]

you got to hope that major league players should be more educate than that.

:wub

[marlins_virus.exe]

Also Halladay knows that if we get him, it won't be for very long. I'm sure he'd prefer to go to a place where he could negotiate a new contract and have a place where he could settle down with his family and not always be wondering where he's going to be from year to year.

he'd want to go to a place where he can shine in the playoffs and make people think he's even cooler

[m26555]

1:14pm: Yahoo's Tim Brown sees the Dodgers and Red Sox as the frontrunners for Doc in what is shaping up as a two-team race. Brown says the only Major Leaguer in the Dodgers' offer is James McDonald, while the Sox will part with Clay Buchholz, one of Justin Masterson, Michael Bowden, and Lars Anderson, and some lesser prospects. My guess is that the Red Sox find a way to get this done, given the quality they're already offering.

Not looking good.

[mbitcronod12]

In all seriousness... does Halladay even have a clue who Johnson, Nolasco and Volstad are?

He may not know who Volstad is but, if he was paying attention, he should have noted that Johnson was an All-Star and he also saw Nolasco throw up a quality start and 9 K's when he faced off against him in Toronto. Also, if he somehow missed JJ in the All-Star game, he could remember that JJ threw a complete game for a win vrs the Blue Jays in that same series.

[¿NICK?]

he'd want to go to a place where he can shine in the playoffs and make people think he's even cooler

We're not the only team going after him where he could make the playoffs though. Even getting Halladay is no guarantee we make the playoffs.